76 FJ40 Suspension recommendations/help needed

[Yellow Jacket]

Would appreciate any suggestions / opinions on what I should do here.

Background: 1976 model that I recently bought (my first!) and I just (apparently) ignored the suspension because it looks like a mess to me now, but maybe i'm over-reacting. PO used it as a rock-crawler and had done a lot of typical mods including shackle reversal (looks like a BTB kit), rear scissor shackles, but looks like he also altered the spring attachment points. It has a nice stance to it, but too extreme for my intended use. (weekend fun driver, light off-roading ie. taking the family into woods for primitive camping). I understand it worked well for the PO for it's intended use, so I'm not bashing him. If I was to big a rock crawler I might have done much the same. My fault for not taking one of y'all with me to inspect it.

It failed the state safety inspection because of worn bushings. (It has poly bushings on it now, but they are in BAD shape.) So I order new bushings and start to look closely at the set up and several (all?) attachment points look bent. On the test drive, I didn't notice any wonder on the road, but last time I drove it was hard to go in a straight line and seemed to have a mind of it's own. Frankly, it was a bit scary.

So now thinking of how to move forward. Options:

1. Just replace bushings and see how it handles (not sure I'll be able to get new bushing on all of the pins - you'll see why below)
2. #1 plus replace any bent shackles (one could argue all of them probably)
3. #2 plus replace BTB bent shackles (you'll see what I mean below)
4. Scrap all existing shackles, springs, u-bolts, etc. and get all new aftermarket lift kit to replace. I had planned to eventually do an OEM 2.5 lift anyway. (Not sure I can use an aftermarket kit because of POs custom work on spring points)
5. Go whole hog and rip out everything PO did - return to OME suspension attachments points and then go with OME 2.5" lift kit to replace everything with.

I've got the funds to buy the OME kit, but thought I would just replace bushings until I crawled under it today. I am strongly leaning towards #4 or #5 above to just have it done right. Not sure if #4 is even possible and Not sure how much #5 will cost to have a competent welding shop take off what is now there and weld in OEM attachment components for the springs.

Any and all thoughts appreciated.

 

[Yellow Jacket]

more pics....

 

[Yellow Jacket]

last ones...

Can take any others that folks need to help make a recommendation.

 

[Rock_Hugger]

That thing is hammered. I think I would start from scratch. I would cut off all the mounts and install new ones that use bigger bushing and run FJ60 springs.

 

[Yellow Jacket]

Thanks for the input Rock_Hugger. Will consider the FJ60 springs.

Anyone else with an opinion? I'm stressing on this right now thinking about how long the rig may be down until I get a solution worked out.

Thanks as always.

 

[ice man 1]

I had a similar mess on my '79 FJ40. Pulled everything off and installed a SOR 2-1/2" lift kit with the shackle reversals as this was to be my daily driver and I didn't want to have to change brake lines and all the other stuff involved. It started off looking like a 6" lift (was super cool!) but was so stiff it would nearly break your neck. (They all are like this when you put any new set of springs and shackles on.) Took a few treatments of Deep Creep to the springs to help them settle out of it, but now it rides terrific. Sure sits lower. (I know.....) But I'd buy this kit over again anytime. Good luck! And welcome to the club.

 

[reddingcruiser]

I agree with the other folks, start over. I would use the Ruff Stuff spring and shackle hangers along with FJ60/62 springs, but that's just my opinion. You'll get larger, more durable bushings and a much nicer ride.

With regards to a "competent welding shop", I would suggest you need to look for someone who has done FJ40 spring conversions before and understands the issues you are likely encounter, and knows how to resolve them. Depending on what combination of springs and hardware you use, and unless you return everything to the OEM configuration and springs compatible with that set up, you are likely to encounter issues with shock mounts, shock lengths, caster angle, driveline lengths, pinion angle(s), etc. It's good to work with someone that's done it before.

 

[winnie]

I agree with the other folks, start over. I would use the Ruff Stuff spring and shackle hangers along with FJ60/62 springs, but that's just my opinion. You'll get larger, more durable bushings and a much nicer ride.

With regards to a "competent welding shop", I would suggest you need to look for someone who has done FJ40 spring conversions before and understands the issues you are likely encounter, and knows how to resolve them. Depending on what combination of springs and hardware you use, and unless you return everything to the OEM configuration and springs compatible with that set up, you are likely to encounter issues with shock mounts, shock lengths, caster angle, driveline lengths, pinion angle(s), etc. It's good to work with someone that's done it before.

x2 ... start over ... find someone that knows what they're doing to help you out ... based on what you have planned for the truck with your family, etc, its an essential investment ...

 

[mcjb]

Going in a straight line mine was the same way til i got it aligned at a local shop and he fixed the castor angle. It was like night and day. I have the btb shackle reversal kit as well. It'll fight you on the highway if you dont have this fixed and definitely not safe. Good luck and hope this helps.

 

[Yellow Jacket]

Thanks for the inputs guys. Pretty clear consensus to scrap everything I have and start over. It was the way I was leaning anyway. Would rather do it right once.


I've been reading up on using 60/62 springs. It sounds interesting, but I don't think I want all the customization of changing the wheelbase, drive shafts, etc.

My plan right now, unless you guys talk me out of it is to go back to factory OEM spring and shackle locations and go with an OME 2.5" lift. This rig will never be turned back into pure factory spec (just too many mods on it already), but I prefer to get closer to factory rather than further away.

If I can't find someone local help me do it, looks like IPOR will be getting a new customer.

Where can I source OEM spring and shackle hangers? Does Toyota still sell them or do I have to hit the used parts forum? Thanks again for the help.

 

[ice man 1]

IF you can't find them in your area, there are some great resources here in Iowa/ Illinois.

 

[jim land]

x2 for bigger bushings


if you need hanger and springs ' go bigger '
if you want 40 springs its not a problem, you need a kit for an 80-84 model year

plus 60 hanger are eazy to find

 

[Yellow Jacket]

x2 for bigger bushings


if you need hanger and springs ' go bigger '
if you want 40 springs its not a problem, you need a kit for an 80-84 model year

plus 60 hanger are eazy to find

I like it. I didn't realize the fj60 and the late model fj40 used the same hangers. Sounds like a good plan. Thanks again everyone.

 

[Yellow Jacket]

So has anyone done this? If so, pics please. I'm having a local mechanic (who knows 40s well do this for me as the welding is beyond my skill set. He has run into a couple of issues. What did you do for the front hanger on the rear set of springs? The one that is offset from the frame.

Also did anyone have an issue with their Saginaw? He says its going to be in the way of the front shackle. He commented that the sag is installed lower than most he has seen.

Thanks.

 

[RWBeringer4x4]

So has anyone done this? If so, pics please. I'm having a local mechanic (who knows 40s well do this for me as the welding is beyond my skill set. He has run into a couple of issues. What did you do for the front hanger on the rear set of springs? The one that is offset from the frame.

Also did anyone have an issue with their Saginaw? He says its going to be in the way of the front shackle. He commented that the sag is installed lower than most he has seen.

Thanks.

I can't help you on the offset spring hanger - but regarding the saginaw/shackle issue, I feel your pain. My box is mounted pretty low, and pretty tight to the frame.

I unfortunately don't have a good shot of what I did to make this work, but when I installed new shackles, I "clearanced" the top of the shackle with an angle grinder to make it slightly more narrow at the top so it could move freely in the area between the box and the frame. I also but a nylock nut in half, so I could do away with the larger nut/lock washer. These two things combined provide JUST enough clearance for the shackle to move properly. I am concerned with how it might act when flexed.

Depending on the size of the hole in your frame, you may be able to add some strong washers (grade 8) between the box and the spacers to push the box out a few fractions of an inch and give you a little more space to work with. As long as it doesn't move the back of the box to where the steering joints start binding, that should work.

 

[White Stripe]

Incorrect negative caster angle, and wide tires tend to cause poor handling. An alignment shop can tell you what your caster is at.

 

[RWBeringer4x4]

Another thing to mention on caster angle as well - FJ40's with stock, manual steering tend to want about 1 degree positive caster. Power steering tends to want a little more (2-4 degrees seems to be the agreed upon range). For example, I just installed slightly longer shackles on my FJ40, which pushed my caster from 1 degree positive to about 0.2-0.3 degrees positive (almost 0). I'll be adding 2 degree caster shims to get the angle back out to around 2.2 or 2.3 degrees, which should provide a nicer, firmer steering feel with the saginaw box. As it is, it feels very overboosted, and won't return to center out of a turn (caster has a lot to do with this).

 

[Yellow Jacket]

Thanks for the comments guys. Is this what I need for the offset rear spring hanger?

http://www.ruffstuffspecialties.com...arch_Begin_Only=&sort=&range_low=&range_high=

I'm having a hard time picturing it in my head. Anyone have some photos of it installed.

Thanks.

Rick - thanks for the tips on your sag.

 

[Yellow Jacket]

So no one has done this? Guess I'll venture over to the 60 section and ask for pics of their offset spring hangers.

 

[tls3601]

I believe the 1979 and later 40’s have similar perches as the FJ60 had