4 banger LC, thoughts?

[NTTD]

Would I want the Chevy 2.7T or Toyota 2.4T if I was going to be towing 3000-5000lb weekly, or even monthly? Eh probably not. Couple times a year, yeah itll be fine.

If you're towing 3-5K weekly then you'd want a work truck, not this LC.

The problem I see is…
55k with High interest rates
Ok I can handle that

Yet a additional $7k for a premium package?

Don't forget dealer markups. All of this talk of pricing is moot in the current market.

They are absolutely going to mark these up. Until demand falls off and dealers are sitting on inventory they will continue to pull this $hiz.

 

[Brown98LC]

Not much we don't already know
But its nice to see someone from Toyota selling this as what it is and admitting it is the LC Prado and not a successor to the 200.

 

[pawnthatdude]

Toyota hybrids operate in such ways…. I’m sure

My 2022 sienna can be on and operate the hvac system off the battery , as it starts up to charge battery occasionally

Does the Sienna have an inverter that works this way?

If you're towing 3-5K weekly then you'd want a work truck, not this LC.



Don't forget dealer markups. All of this talk of pricing is moot in the current market.

They are absolutely going to mark these up. Until demand falls off and dealers are sitting on inventory they will continue to pull this $hiz.

Multiple dealers in my area committed to MSRP. There's a separate Wait List thread for people discussing it.

 

[Brown98LC]

Prado first edition

 

[M1911]

Of course, it’s about “area under the curve” for real world performance.
A 4 cyl turbo is not going to have the flat torque curve of a high displacement V8, it will be seeing those peak numbers briefly at a high rpm. But again, big improvements have been made compared to 4 cyl turbos from 20 years ago with turbo design, valve timing, etc, the torque curve is able to be much flatter. Plus the electric motor torque will help tremendously pulling off the line.
I think it will be fine for incidental towing.

I disagree. First, turbo engines these days are designed to have large, flatter torque curves at low rpms. These aren’t designed like performance cars in the 1980s where the turbo only came to life at 3000 rpm. Second, the 2.5 turbo hybrid has the electric motor which will fill in the torque at low rpm. Electric motors produce peak torque at 0 rpm. By the time the electric motor is starting run out of its peak range, the turbo will be spoiled up and you will be into the meat of the engine’s torque curve.

My wife’s Mercedes C300 has a turbo 4. It is a better engine in every way except sound than the V6 of her previous C300. It has a great deal of low end and mid range torque. It is faster and more fuel efficient than the V6. It is quiet unless you have to use high revs but I’ve rarely had to do that as the midrange power is so good.

 

[Knowbuddy]

Not much we don't already know
But its nice to see someone from Toyota selling this as what it is and admitting it is the LC Prado and not a successor to the 200.

Lol I’m still blown away with how bent out of shape people are about this. Toyota never said it was a 200 successor. Watch the Toyota international press release. Says it fits in between the 300 and the 70.

 

[UZJ100LC]

Don't forget dealer markups. All of this talk of pricing is moot in the current market.

They are absolutely going to mark these up. Until demand falls off and dealers are sitting on inventory they will continue to pull this $hiz.

its really not difficult to find a dealer who sticks to msrp. it might involve some driving though.

 

[Brown98LC]

Lol I’m still blown away with how bent out of shape people are about this. Toyota never said it was a 200 successor. Watch the Toyota international press release. Says it fits in between the 300 and the 70.

I just liked the guys vibe generally.
He could have skimmed over the other ones and ignored their existence. Seems like a cool guy.

I like that even Toyota USA is acknowledging other LCs that are not being sold in the US market.

I genuinely have high hopes that if this thing sells really well, we may see more additions to the cruiser family in the US. Not necessarily anytime soon but possibly with future model changes.
It is a slow build up and if things work out it will be great.

The hype the Land Cruiser name plate has generated over the past month or so globally is very impressive and I hope it translates into great sales.

 

[Jetboy]

The turbo 4 makes roughly the same power at 2k rpms as the 5.7 and a lot more power than the 4.7 did. The ttv6 is about double the 5.7 output at low rpms. The torque curve is almost perfectly flat because it's ecu limited to be flat from 1600-4500 rpms. The T4 should out pull the 100 across the full rpm range even without the hybrid. It's not until about 3000 rpms that the 5.7 starts to pull away. On the long passes the T4 is going to struggle with big trailers. Just like the smaller v8s and v6s do.

Open question on fuel efficiency when towing. Turbo gas engines need rich afrs to manage exhaust temps so they tend to burn a lot of fuel. But compared to the outgoing v8s it should still be better.

 

[OldCarSmell]

I just liked the guys vibe generally.
He could have skimmed over the other ones and ignored their existence. Seems like a cool guy.

I like that even Toyota USA is acknowledging other LCs that are not being sold in the US market.

I genuinely have high hopes that if this thing sells really well, we may see more additions to the cruiser family in the US. Not necessarily anytime soon but possibly with future model changes.
It is a slow build up and if things work out it will be great.

The hype the Land Cruiser name plate has generated over the past month or so globally is very impressive and I hope it translates into great sales.

It’s true Toyota doesn’t pander to American-centric vehicle enthusiasts.

And I agree, once they can replicate power and extend range in a large SUV or truck they’ll be another model of LC brought to NA Americans to satisfy our taste for/obsession with oversized powerful things.

 

[Land Caesar]

Does the Sienna have an inverter that works this way?



Multiple dealers in my area committed to MSRP. There's a separate Wait List thread for people discussing it.

My Sport model had that option… yet I didn’t want to pay for getting screwed by the Additional package price

My dealer said $1000 additional mark up above msrp price.

A used Tundra and A FWC is looking more promising for bang for Buck… oh and few thousand left over for fuel.

 

[on the rocks]

Not much we don't already know
But its nice to see someone from Toyota selling this as what it is and admitting it is the LC Prado and not a successor to the 200.

"Even though it looks unexciting, it gets you where you need to go"
I'm thinking a Toyota rep shouldn't be saying this on camera... Just thought this was funny but also my thoughts while standing there.

It’s true Toyota doesn’t pander to American-centric vehicle enthusiasts.

And I agree, once they can replicate power and extend range in a large SUV or truck they’ll be another model of LC brought to NA Americans to satisfy our taste for/obsession with oversized powerful things.

Pretty sure they already did, I just sat in one...

 

[M1911]

its really not difficult to find a dealer who sticks to msrp. it might involve some driving though.

And some waiting. If you don’t have to be the first kid on the block to have one, you are more likely to find one without ADM.

Personally, I usually avoid the first year of any vehicle, even a Toyota. By the second or third year a lot of small glitches will have been worked out, any big problems will likely have surfaced, and the excitement should have died down so the prices will be closer to normal.

 

[OldCarSmell]

"Even though it looks unexciting, it gets you where you need to go"
I'm thinking a Toyota rep shouldn't be saying this on camera... Just thought this was funny but also my thoughts while standing there.


Pretty sure they already did, I just sat in one...
View attachment 3414430

Fair point, though that’s a pretty niche vehicle that they don’t produce in huge quantities bc it doesn’t sell in huge quantities.

 

[malden]

I think the term “4 banger” leads people the wrong way in thought relative to this vehicle and many others. The original and proceeding 4 cylinder engines that the term was used to (lightly) mockingly describe just don’t compare to current 4 cylinder engines (of this variety). The technology is advanced to a degree that the fact that each have 4 cylinders leads one to think they’ll perform similarly when that is patently untrue. I know everyone is reckoning with the change and wondering how it’ll play out - none of us know at this point - but I wonder what another term could be to capture the performance of these newly designed engines? I put this challenge to all the Mudders out there reading!

It took 30 pages to get seven words of truth….”none of us know at this point.” Thank you! Hmm instead of 4 Banger…

4 TRD Mice?

 

[OldCarSmell]

It took 30 pages to get seven words of truth….”none of us know at this point.” Thank you! Hmm instead of 4 Banger…

4 TRD Mice?

We REALLY don’t like uncertainly as a species.

 

[Phillyd2]

Nothing wrong with uncertainty as most people would appreciate the honesty of I Don't Know.

The problem is the pushing of PR talking points in unison by those with a financial incentive to do so and the cult like acceptance by so many of the gospel.

 

[NTTD]

Multiple dealers in my area committed to MSRP.

How fortunate for you.

Plus there's "committed' and there's "committed". I've already heard of dealers "promising" MSRP and then backpedaling once they realized there is bigger interest.

Also as manufacturers have asked dealers to "stick to list price" dealers are doing tricks like "suggested retail prices" or "distributor suggested retail prices" not "MSRP" so they add markup BEFORE and "sell at retail" or "discount to retail". For popular models they add markup before AND after.

Not to mention forced "dealer added accessories".

Anyone saying they're saying they're "at MSRP" is selling you something, pun intended.

Lol I’m still blown away with how bent out of shape people are about this. Toyota never said it was a 200 successor.

On the flip side of this is how everyone is saying this is a "bargain" when compared to the debut price of the 100 and 200 (when adjusted for inflation).

Yah it's not 90K but is not that kind of Cruiser. It's closest Toy model is a 4Runner and under that lense a stripped down one at 55K is pricey IMO.
I still want it of course but I was hoping for a truly affordable stripped down Cruiser not an air quote "affordable" Cruiser.

 

[pawnthatdude]

How fortunate for you.

Plus there's "committed' and there's "committed". I've already heard of dealers "promising" MSRP and then backpedaling once they realized there is bigger interest.

Also as manufacturers have asked dealers to "stick to list price" dealers are doing tricks like "suggested retail prices" or "distributor suggested retail prices" not "MSRP" so they add markup BEFORE and "sell at retail" or "discount to retail". For popular models they add markup before AND after.

Not to mention forced "dealer added accessories".

Anyone saying they're saying they're "at MSRP" is selling you something, pun intended.


On the flip side of this is how everyone is saying this is a "bargain" when compared to the debut price of the 100 and 200 (when adjusted for inflation).

Yah it's not 90K but is not that kind of Cruiser. It's closest Toy model is a 4Runner and under that lense a stripped down one at 55K is pricey IMO.
I still want it of course but I was hoping for a truly affordable stripped down Cruiser not an air quote "affordable" Cruiser.

MSRP is whatever price the Toyota website will show on the configurator. If the dealer try to tell you differently it's not MSRP and they were just lying. I guess we will see but seeing as no one even knows actual pricing or timelines I doubt further conjecturing is useful. If you do have a time machine please let us know the actual price, availability timeline, and if it will fit 35s.. thanks.

 

[NTTD]

MSRP is whatever price the Toyota website will show on the configurator. If the dealer try to tell you differently it's not MSRP and they were just lying. I guess we will see but seeing as no one even knows actual pricing or timelines I doubt further conjecturing is useful. If you do have a time machine please let us know the actual price, availability timeline, and if it will fit 35s.. thanks.

That's exactly my point. This is happening right now, TODAY, with RAV4s, Highlanders... it's not "conjecture".

There's shady $h!7 going on at the dealers. Should come as no surprise. Check the video I posted a few comments back.