I was about to say, the difference is tangible. They may be pushing for Tacos and 4runners, but the real gem is still the LC. I've now owned all three and the LC is a different animal. Not many would be opposed to a 300 series hybrid or electric, as long as the founding principals remain. Even if the 4runner is 40K, a stripped down LC might be able to see 50-60K new. I could also be completely wrong.
300 series rumors??? (3 Viewers)
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I was about to say, the difference is tangible. They may be pushing for Tacos and 4runners, but the real gem is still the LC. I've now owned all three and the LC is a different animal. Not many would be opposed to a 300 series hybrid or electric, as long as the founding principals remain. Even if the 4runner is 40K, a stripped down LC might be able to see 50-60K new. I could also be completely wrong.
CharlieS
GOLD Star
I've also owned multiple generations of landcruisers, tacos, tundras and 4Runners. The Landcruiser is definitely the gem in the crown, no matter which generation.
I'd also like to think a 50-60k usd stripper Landcruiser is possible. It seems like they spec this kind of rig for other markets all over the globe. I guess our focus groups don't support that offering...!?!
To be fair, the 4R is a Land Cruiser Prado 150 chassis, and the GX is very close kin.
Though I agree on the (relatively) tinny feel of the 5G4R. High sales counts affect CAFE and require lightness.
Though I agree on the (relatively) tinny feel of the 5G4R. High sales counts affect CAFE and require lightness.
CharlieS
GOLD Star
I can't dispute what you are saying, but I can tell you first hand the best 4Runner is worse than the crappiest Landcruiser, based on my personal experience.
Basically toyota will not bring in a stripped down 200. Shut up and import the 70 series you want...
Yeah, but the GX is a pretty solid ride.
If I had two kids and no dog it would definitely be a contender.
If I had two kids and no dog it would definitely be a contender.
bloc
SILVER Star
iForce, 8spd, LED headlights (standard everywhere on new 200s, AFAIK), KDSS.. we'd want to keep all of that.. basically they'd be stripping the leather, power seats (maybe? what do the vinyl ones in AUS have?) Nav, sound system, radar cruise, parking sensors (but not the backup cam..), power lift gate.. it can't give up the stability control (US regs), and crawl control is just a button and software within that system (no real savings). They WONT give up the standard equipment collision avoidance (making the truck "less safe" than it was in standard trim previously.
There's no way that adds up to a 50-60k cruiser. And even then, the vast majority of american buyers will look at the other options in that price range and see all those features and buy that instead.
At the end of the day there aren't enough people in the US that look at the offroad worthiness and durability of a landcruiser as making it worth even the 50-60k, which is already below what they'd realistically be priced at. Look at the typical 200 buyer currently. For the majority it has far more to do with wanting toyota's best SUV than offroad utility. Toyota knows this, and I think all of us do, which is why we believe rumors about there not being a 300 here.
There's no way that adds up to a 50-60k cruiser. And even then, the vast majority of american buyers will look at the other options in that price range and see all those features and buy that instead.
At the end of the day there aren't enough people in the US that look at the offroad worthiness and durability of a landcruiser as making it worth even the 50-60k, which is already below what they'd realistically be priced at. Look at the typical 200 buyer currently. For the majority it has far more to do with wanting toyota's best SUV than offroad utility. Toyota knows this, and I think all of us do, which is why we believe rumors about there not being a 300 here.
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Fiancee has a 460 - I love it. If it had a tailgate I would ditch my 100 for one.
Markuson
SILVER Star
Corporate knows...and anyone who crawls under the trucks knows too. The LC is built like a tank compared to the 4R.
Not knocking the 4R. It’s a great holdout of it’s own...but it would be sad if it became the US’ “top-of-the-line 4x4 off roader. Ya, the Sequoia can be had in a 4wd, but meh...
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Markuson
SILVER Star
Ya, seems like they were being generous when they added the “Land Cruiser” naming of the Prado. It’s a great vehicle wheeler, but always seemed (to my pea-brain anyway) like they were sorta taking advantage of the LC rep over there.
I actually like the swing doors; no reach over for bed access, option for a drop down table, and better clearance for a 270 awning.
What I don’t like about the 460 is how they integrated the 3rd row into the floor. Someone needs to come up with some fabrication to reclaim that trapped space...
bloc
SILVER Star
I intend to keep finding 16-whenever 200s until I'm old and gray. Which may only mean two or three given my age and how far these things go.
Markuson
SILVER Star
I love the hatch because it shelters you (and rear cargo) from the weather like a wee little awning... and because it’s great to have a usable tailgate to set things on...sit on...etc.
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Yeah, I know I’m the outlier here who’s not in love with the tailgate...
The one thing I will give it praise for is accessing gear when hitched. A full hatch or swing door wouldn’t always play nice with a short-tongued trailer. Even in this scenario I was able to get to the contents.
The one thing I will give it praise for is accessing gear when hitched. A full hatch or swing door wouldn’t always play nice with a short-tongued trailer. Even in this scenario I was able to get to the contents.
As a 4Runner owner who dreams of a 200 series one day, I agree with you on this. Cars don't get cheaper over time. They don't strip down or offer less options for the next generation. A 300 series Land Cruiser will only be more expensive and have more gadgetry and I doubt a stripped down version of it will be made available in the US. The 200 series era has come and gone, they will not offer some sort of stripped down 200 series as it's already a 10+ year old platform. If they wanted to offer a stripped down version they would have done so already.
The next generation of Toyota 4x4 SUVs will be interesting. The 300 series will either be too fancy, too expensive, or non-existent to wheel. I think Toyota has more of an opportunity in building a 4Runner to be a Wrangler, Bronco, Defender fighter. It too will also be seeing price increases with more features as well. I can see $40-$50k 6th gen 4Runners for the SR5 and TRD-OR trims as more common place with Limited and TRD Pro trims pushing $60k. Which is why a $50-$60k "stripped" down LC seems nearly impossible. Lets also remember that the 4Runner sells nearly as many in a week that a Land Cruiser sells in a year. Corporate recognizes this and I don't think they'll have any problems giving the Land Cruiser the axe here in the US.
As much as we all love and revere the Land Cruiser it too has lost it's way. Too big, too fancy, too expensive. It is an icon and heritage vehicle so hopefully Toyota will keep it around like Ford keeps the Mustang around but the sales numbers don't back up its existence or need here in the US. People might hate on the 5th gen 4Runner but the thing I love about it most is that it cost me $35k new, it has a pretty spartan interior that I don't mind getting dirty on the inside, everything is dead simple to operate, and all the trails I went on with the pin-stripping, rock scrapes, riding on skids or my sliders don't bother me as much. I've hacked away at the plastic, cut things on the frame without second guessing it. I would think double, triple, quadruple as much on doing that to a $85k vehicle. I probably would not have taken a Land Cruiser on some of the trails I've been on because of that too. So people may bag on the 4Runner as much as they want but the reality is is that it might be the only thing that makes it to the next round. My only regret is the number of asshats from the import car scene that all of a sudden discovered 4x4s, hopped on the "overlanding" trend and purchased 4Runners.
You would thinks so, but apparently, thats not the case with Toyotas current corporate infrastructure. Watch that Ward video, he talks about that.
Keep the personal attacks and jabs out of this or I will close this thread since it is basically chat anyways
Your friendly 200 series moderator
Your friendly 200 series moderator
Would you kindly keep the preaching to yourself? Not everyone agrees with you.
bloc
SILVER Star
Like it or not that is the direction the industry is moving.
Toyota has to adapt or be left behind.
Hopefully there will be plenty of 200s for us.
