2FE vs 3FE (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter woytovich
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I'll bet I have a title and VIN tag around here somewhere for an FJ60...
Sure, go ahead and drop that truck off. I'll let you know when I'm done with it.
Nick
Sure, go ahead and drop that truck off. I'll let you know when I'm done with it.
Nick
DickM
SILVER Star
For me, there are more "variables" when you start combining two different motors together for a swap, but I have only done the 2FE.
Some of these "variables" are common to both swaps, as these previous post point out.. gas pedal, exhaust, wiring harness tie in, etc.
My biggest frustrations came from trying to adapt a fuel supply system to work with the auxiliary tank setup. Which ever way you go, my advice is to use the 62 tank and pump-it was, after all, designed by Toyota engineers to feed the fuel injection system.... and has been trouble free since I installed it.
I echo Frank's (@elripster ) summary in post #10.
And the rabbit hole can get deep when you start taking motors and parts to the machine shop, not only in money but in time and complications from changing pieces of the puzzle. I needed bottom end work on the 2f, so I got into the "while I was there mode". Avoiding that will simplify your swap.
Either way, you will love the loss of your carb.
Some of these "variables" are common to both swaps, as these previous post point out.. gas pedal, exhaust, wiring harness tie in, etc.
My biggest frustrations came from trying to adapt a fuel supply system to work with the auxiliary tank setup. Which ever way you go, my advice is to use the 62 tank and pump-it was, after all, designed by Toyota engineers to feed the fuel injection system.... and has been trouble free since I installed it.
I echo Frank's (@elripster ) summary in post #10.
And the rabbit hole can get deep when you start taking motors and parts to the machine shop, not only in money but in time and complications from changing pieces of the puzzle. I needed bottom end work on the 2f, so I got into the "while I was there mode". Avoiding that will simplify your swap.
Either way, you will love the loss of your carb.
DickM, would be able to relate some driving impressions with the 2FE.? It looks like we have very similar 60's both with the H55f but you have the 2FE. You definitely have some more armor to haul than I do.
Frank
Frank
gregnash
Anal Retentive Analyst
TBI would be a great kit if they were readily available for the 2F. However, there were people (think Marshall was one) working on kits but they never really came to fruition. I have seen a couple of articles out there about taking an old TBI from certain chevy S10s and modifying it to work but it takes quite a bit of tinkering going that "pure DIY" route if I remember correctly. For me I would probably drop the 3FE in first and foremost, depending on how much downtime I can handle.
- Thread starter
- #26
This APPEARS to be a complete TBI solution:
TOYOTA Complete TBI System
although I THINK i'd be most inclined to stuck with the 3FE swap or a 2FE conversion....
TOYOTA Complete TBI System
although I THINK i'd be most inclined to stuck with the 3FE swap or a 2FE conversion....
um - Toyota did do the 2Fe.......it started development in japan in 1984 and its called the 1fz - earliest versions were carbd(1fz-f) and then the 1fz-fe soon followed. 1fz development/performance and testing was already showing Toyota that it was the true F successor for the future. Hence why 3fe was so short lived. And its been the longest produced engine(23 years)by toyota for a reason. (ending in 2007)
1fz-fe 212hp/275 tq. and a true 350k+ engine. the latest version( which U.S. didnt get) had direct injection- no dizzy- and improved intake-throttle body-head and 4nozzle injectors produced 240hp/300tq. (fzj100 engine)
id venture to say you could easily sell off both 2f and 3fe and have alot less headache/ and about same amount of work dropping in a 1fz/a442 not to mention a ton more reliability.
1fz-fe 212hp/275 tq. and a true 350k+ engine. the latest version( which U.S. didnt get) had direct injection- no dizzy- and improved intake-throttle body-head and 4nozzle injectors produced 240hp/300tq. (fzj100 engine)
id venture to say you could easily sell off both 2f and 3fe and have alot less headache/ and about same amount of work dropping in a 1fz/a442 not to mention a ton more reliability.
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cwwfj60
Supporting Vendor
Key word there is a442, you had a compelling argument until that point....gotta keep it a stick shift, great motor either way
definitely dont have to keep a stickshift in the original posters 60 series. as far as reliability......any toyota stick h55 or 4 spd will go thru 2-3 clutches before vs 1 tranny fluid flush. Offroad theres some very real advantages to auto. torque converter 1.88 lockup stall speed in the a442 practically doubles the final low gear ratio from 30ish:1 to 56:1 with 4:11s. if he really wanted to go stick.......the h151f could be swapped in and gain a few mpgs.
also recall: the a442 (in 93-94 1fzs)often known as bus tranny was designed for the Japanese Coaster bus - an 11,ooo lb bus that carried between 26-30passengers or an additional 4000-5000lbs. Its in a different league as far as durability compared to h55f or the 4spd.
also recall: the a442 (in 93-94 1fzs)often known as bus tranny was designed for the Japanese Coaster bus - an 11,ooo lb bus that carried between 26-30passengers or an additional 4000-5000lbs. Its in a different league as far as durability compared to h55f or the 4spd.
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cwwfj60
Supporting Vendor
I'm just partial to stick shift, didn't mean to imply it's a bad tranny, automatic = less fun
- Thread starter
- #31
From earlier in this thread:
"To clarify: my goal is to run fuel injected, nothing more is necessary. I want/need to keep my H55f/Marlin ToyBox/Split Case so whatever solution I end up with needs to mate to that."
"To clarify: my goal is to run fuel injected, nothing more is necessary. I want/need to keep my H55f/Marlin ToyBox/Split Case so whatever solution I end up with needs to mate to that."
Yes their are 2 or 3 different kits available for tbi. If your going to stick toyota, go with the 2fe equipped with a delta cam grind, no sense doing a normal 3fe. Not that much more work to go 2fe.
gregnash
Anal Retentive Analyst
LOL... love that sticker!!!!
I completely forgot about the AFI guys. I do remember looking at them at one point. But would you be gaining anything through TBI vs. going with the 3FE head? At most I would think simplicity of install due to the fact that the engine is remaining stock and the TBI is an add-on. But at the cost of $1k then you are looking at close to what you would be spending on a 3FE or 2F-E swap (minus fuel tank of course).
I completely forgot about the AFI guys. I do remember looking at them at one point. But would you be gaining anything through TBI vs. going with the 3FE head? At most I would think simplicity of install due to the fact that the engine is remaining stock and the TBI is an add-on. But at the cost of $1k then you are looking at close to what you would be spending on a 3FE or 2F-E swap (minus fuel tank of course).
- Thread starter
- #36
Actual installation labor is less installing tbi. Its like bolting on a different carbuerator, coil, and distributor. The rest is running some wires.
cwwfj60
Supporting Vendor
It's a top end gasket set, usually everything to due a proper head gasket job, valve stem seals, manifold gaskets, other associated small parts like valve cover grommets, throttle body gaskets, etc.
- Thread starter
- #39
This is really a case of time vs money... if one believes the end result of 2FE is about equal to a bolt-on TBI.
$1400 for a full TBI set-up vs $500 for the 3FE components + $? extras for the gaskets etc + more labor
gregnash
Anal Retentive Analyst
Again, people always seem to focus on the $$$ that something costs. While that may be a main influencer it is not the only COST that is associated with the project. $1400 for the full TBI setup from AFI ($1800+ from Redline) with maybe 20hrs of install vs. $500 for the 3FE components and maybe $100-$200 extra for random stuff but 100+hrs of install. But for me as a project manager/project portfolio manager this is where my training kicks in... the devil is in the details.
So back to my first sentence.... How much time are you willing to have the truck down? And then to add on, what is your ROI for the swap? And what is your Cost Benefit Analysis (CBA) of going TBI kit vs. 3FE swap vs. 2F-E mod??
