2024 GX/Prado Release and Discussion (1 Viewer)

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I feel the 4R was always the odd ball for Japan. They didn’t expect it to be as successful as it is. It’s redundant in their lineup. Maybe this is their way of finally killing off the 4R w an upscale but comparable vehicle. The price points seem to be inline as adjusted for market and inflation.
 
I think I love it but need time. Toyota stakes their reputation on every car they make and a failure of their power train in this product and the Taco will be crowed about for years by the jeep crowd. It's the reason to buy a Toyota and it's the reason to buy a LC. They figured it out in a big way with the Prius and I have to believe that the longevity, reliability, and efficiency will be there.

As far as what it is, it's a Land Cruiser. It's a little more than a 4runner and certainly less than an Excursion or Suburban or Tahoe. It's also infinitely more capable than the last three out of the box. Toyota has competitors for the great land yacht battle and doesn't need more. I don't want a Grand Cherokee or Wagoneer and neither do many others. I don't think anyone should define themselves by their competition and Toyota have followed that here. To me it is right sized, right powered, capable of doing real things as configured, and the price makes it a real middle class competitor at asking.
 
I feel the 4R was always the odd ball for Japan. They didn’t expect it to be as successful as it is. It’s redundant in their lineup. Maybe this is their way of finally killing off the 4R w an upscale but comparable vehicle. The price points seem to be inline as adjusted for market and inflation.

Its not comparable at all when you look at drive train, features, relative simplicity etc
 
My guess is that, given its price point, the 250 will cannibalize the 4runner more than the reverse. Where 4runner will be marketed to the hopped up off-roader bros to compete with Jeep and Bronco, the 250 offers a more reserved and still capable alternative for grown ups, one better suited to both touring and daily life.
It'll be really interesting to see. Presumably the 4Runner will still come with 3 rows since they won't offer in the LC. And probably non-hybrid model. The non-hybrid is more desirable for me. Both for urban and off road use. I use mine as a utility vehicle, not just a commuter. I don't think the space and weight for slightly faster 0-60 is a good trade off for my use. But if I were using it as a commuter and didn't intend to use it to carry big stuff or load up the cargo area for long trips, the hybrid makes more sense. A lot will depend on the 4Runner design and specs.
 
They have less KDSS across the whole Toyota lineup now.

Kdss used to be available on a larger number of 120/150/200.

Today with 250/300
It is only on the GX overtrail and the GR sport 300.

Australians really want it back though so I assume more versions of the 300 will probably end up getting e kdss down the line.

Don't forget guys
These trucks have a long life ahead of them.
Lots of time to fix and update certain things.
Customer feedback from the first year will definitely not be ignored.
 
I feel the 4R was always the odd ball for Japan. They didn’t expect it to be as successful as it is. It’s redundant in their lineup. Maybe this is their way of finally killing off the 4R w an upscale but comparable vehicle. The price points seem to be inline as adjusted for market and inflation.
But the majority of the 100,000 they sell in the US are well below the $55k 1958. The LC250 does not go far enough down market to replace the 4Runner.

My problem with the LC250 is not truck but the price and the looming possibility that the next 4Runner could be better. Toyota is going to have to actively degrade the 4Runner to keep it away from the LC250. Based on the Tacoma the 4Runner should be superior to the LC250 in many ways. If Toyota does cripple the 4Runner I would probably buy the Tacoma Trailhunter over the LC250.
 
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My guess is that, given its price point, the 250 will cannibalize the 4runner more than the reverse. Where 4runner will be marketed to the hopped up off-roader bros to compete with Jeep and Bronco, the 250 offers a more reserved and still capable alternative for grown ups, one better suited to both touring and daily life.

I’m guessing the opposite unless they do something really drastic with the 4R. Hell, they can make it a Unibody without that much of a sales drop.

At least 95% of owners won’t ever even drive on a mild dirt road so it will come down to price – with all things being marketed somewhat similar. The 4R, Jeep, Bronco and now the LC are aspirational vehicles akin to those in NYC who wear cowboy boats. They are trying to make a statement more than anything else.
 
Dont hold your breath

Devils in the details and the fact that its ONLY offered as a hyp-brid is going to alienate a lot of people

That alone distinguishes it from the 4R and who will and will not be a customer
Exactly
We just had this convo with my buddies who were all waiting to see this unveil to decide what the next fun suv would be (none of us use these as DD)
GX550 by a mile over Prado solely because of the engine
 
This, and the other quote below. I was trying to explain to someone the hybrid implementation in the LC, and big trucks in general. I am not expert at all, but it is clear that this LC hybrids are not your Prius line. I bet the biggest pie of improvement in the 27 MPG comes from the Turbo part of the engine, the smaller displacement, and the reductions in weight due to "more" plastic and "more" aluminium, and other materials, rather than the "hybrid" part of it.

It's only a mild hybrid, basically a big starter motor installed between the engine and transmission that can give some kicks. No driving only on electrical.

Dont hold your breath
Devils in the details and the fact that its ONLY offered as a hyp-brid is going to alienate a lot of people
That alone distinguishes it from the 4R and who will and will not be a customer



Believe it !!!!

The Subaru has many decent things to offer, and specially if you dont need a big floating boat and thirsty animal like the LC's. Are they rock crawlers, nope they aint. But they are great vehicles for what they offer !

Lol wonderful. Landcruiser is cross shopped with Subaru. We have arrived.
 
The fact that Toyota has released the FJ70 into Japan indicates that they think there is a market for urban/suburban drivers there. Should be interesting to follow the sales results. And sales results for INEOS will also bring clarity as to the actual demand for a FJ70 or FJ70 like vehicle. INEOS has been able to design a 4x4 that meets US standards from the getgo and that is an advantage over Toyota. But if the Grenadier sells and is well received, it would bolster an argument for a US FJ70 (or something very much like it.)


While I don’t suppose a FJ70 is best suited to life in Manhattan, though the UES is crawling with Range Rovers, Broncos and Wranglers, it is very well suited for Suburban drivers who want to “go places” on the weekends. That being said, the FJ70 shines brightest in use by large property owners, farmers, fruit growers, people in rural work environments, the environment where the FJ70, Defender and others were designed and built to thrive. I get the feeling you have rural environments like that somewhere tucked away in the USA? A few square miles here or there?

Not a lot of those rural folk spend their days on internet forums, so there is a disproportionate voice on the Net from Urbanites in favor of more tame Suburban vehicles. I think that imbalance is perfectly fine, but do realize that it is a virtual imbalance and does not disprove the existence of other potential realities.

If any one of you love the roar of an air cooled 911, the rush of a BMW flat twin, the growl of any exotic sports car, or the raucous fun of a Harley, trust me, you have nothing to fear from the NVH of an FJ70. It is loud and you will love it. It is a kick in the arse to drive! I am shouting now! But then again I have the advantage of having spent time in the same area code, city, nation, continent and universe as a modern FJ70, have driven one for months and may have to own one soon.

Frank speaking, had the LC250 been the vehicle some of us hoped for, we would not be having this FJ70 conversation at all.
I happen to thing a 70 fits right in in Manhattan.

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As a current 40 owner and 2013 200, and having just sold a 60, I like it!
  • I love my 200 and the luxury matched with size and capability, but I also love a return more to the 60/80/100 series approach that this one seems to have.
  • I like the modern drivetrain and retro 60s-styling. Checks most of the boxes for me.
  • The only miss in my opinion, and it's HUGE!, is the rear hatch. Why have a rear window the lifts up if you're going to have a hatch? Bring back the CLAM SHELL!! of have the window go down into the rest of the hatch. Makes no sense this way.
  • I enjoy having the 3rd row seats in my 200, but also wouldn't mind if they weren't there most of the time (either not there at all, or more easily removed).
  • It's competing against 4 door Jeeps and new Broncos and as an LC-phile, I think it will do very well against those two.
  • Others swear by the 4R and Tacoma and Tundas. Different strokes for different folks and I don't care about the impact to the 4Runner model AT ALL. .

I'm glad the Land Cruiser is back! Can't wait to see it on 35s with bumpers, body armor, and swing out spare tire on the back and roof rack.
 
I also wish the same as you, I do. However, reality is that either we will see turbos, or hybrids, or turbo-hybrids. As I said before, then the only thing I hold on to is the Toyota reliability the brand has built, that after about 20 or so very reliable Toyotas/Lexus, never had failed me.

Heres hoping for a 'dumbed down' 4runner with less gadgets and MAYBE a normal engine/trans combo

I don't need or want turbos or batteries
 
I actually like the look. I think it looks like an updated 60 series (my favorite). Assuming its reliable, I like the idea of the 4 cylinder hybrid. They brought back the "poverty" package with cloth seats and basic interior which I think is great. What I'm most worried about is if it "feels" like a land cruiser. I know that is a stupid rating system but when i look at a land cruiser I expect it to be beefy, overbuilt, and feel like I can roll it off a cliff and drive it away. That's my biggest concern with this one. It looks like it feels like a 4runner, if that makes sense? My second biggest gripe is that it doesn't have a split tailgate. That has been a land cruiser feature from the very beginning that everyone loves. Its a small thing but really annoying. I don't think I'd give up my 200 to buy this but I'd probably get it as an addition.
 
My guess is that, given its price point, the 250 will cannibalize the 4runner more than the reverse. Where 4runner will be marketed to the hopped up off-roader bros to compete with Jeep and Bronco, the 250 offers a more reserved and still capable alternative for grown ups, one better suited to both touring and daily life.
Historically there have been other QOL differences between the two as well. Things like ride refinement and noise insulation in particular have been better in whatever current LC was out at the same time as the current 4R. Those two things alone for me at least are worth more $$$
 
I think
One way they can attact 200 owners who don't want to switch to a 250
Is release a triple locked over trail LX600
I seem to recall reading or hearing some places that it might happen.
It'll cost alot of money though. Alot.

After hearing the Tacoma lead engineer explain that essentially they believe if we have a front locker and IFS, we'll "break stuff" so we get A-trac/MTS instead, that killed any fantasy of getting triple locked here. Strange how they still put it on the 300 series though. Maybe totally different engineering departments/teams with different philosophies.
 
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  • The only miss in my opinion, and it's HUGE!, is the rear hatch. Why have a rear window the lifts up if you're going to have a hatch? Bring back the CLAM SHELL!! of have the window go down into the rest of the hatch. Makes no sense this way.
I disagree. It makes a lot of sense this way. You can open the rear window more easily than opening the entire hatch -- the rear window is much lighter and easier to move faster. If you are just putting a bag of groceries in, you can open the rear window, drop in the groceries, and close the rear window.

While I like the split tailgate, I've had a rear hatch before on my 4th gen 4Runner. I'm fine with the rear hatch. It has the advantage that if you are putting something heavy in the back, that you can get closer to the rear, rather than having to lean over the lower split tailgate.
 
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