I want to add front and rear lockers and to change the gear ratios on my 2016 Cruiser with 285/75x18 (35-inch) tires, which I use for both daily driving and rock crawling. The more I read and talk to people about lockers, the more questions I have. First, I am leaning toward a 4.88 gear ratio, but what would be your recommended ratio? Second, there are many discussions about the benefits of ARB vs. e-lockers but I cannot come to a decision; what are your experiences and recommendations? Third, and probably most important, what modifications are required to be able to install the lockers? From what I've read, the front differential should present few problems other than changing the gearing and adding the locker. The rear differential seems to be another matter. It seems that the differential housing (41101-60180?) is too small and must be replaced with a Tacoma housing. Is this the case, or have I misunderstood what needs to be done? Were different housings used on the 2016s? If the housing must be replaced, what replacement parts would you recommend?
2016 Front / Rear Lockers
- Thread starter ArkansasOvrland
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There’s a thread around with some good conversation regarding ratio.
I thought it was the gen3 front housing that required full replacement, but I didn’t really pay to much attention, I have a gen 1. It is documented on one of the swap threads though.
Personally Im on 35s and 4.88 and wouldn’t change a thing, but there are some good arguments for 4.3 too.
For the gen 3 with the 8 speed transmission your staring ratio is lower, so 3.9 is your 4.3 and 4.3 is your 4.88 (on the six speed).
Lots of 3rd gens pass on gear ratio changes due to the already deep 1st gear on the transmission.
I thought it was the gen3 front housing that required full replacement, but I didn’t really pay to much attention, I have a gen 1. It is documented on one of the swap threads though.
Personally Im on 35s and 4.88 and wouldn’t change a thing, but there are some good arguments for 4.3 too.
For the gen 3 with the 8 speed transmission your staring ratio is lower, so 3.9 is your 4.3 and 4.3 is your 4.88 (on the six speed).
Lots of 3rd gens pass on gear ratio changes due to the already deep 1st gear on the transmission.
- Thread starter
- #3
Thanks for your comments, but I'm confused by "For the gen 3 with the 8 speed transmission your staring ratio is lower, so 3.9 is your 4.3 and 4.3 is your 4.88 (on the six speed)." Can you help clarify it for me? Thanks,
I also see on the Nitro site it says that I need the older Dropout Housing USEDOTLC, but I cannot find any information about this part. Are you familiar with it? Thanks again.
I also see on the Nitro site it says that I need the older Dropout Housing USEDOTLC, but I cannot find any information about this part. Are you familiar with it? Thanks again.
What you're looking for is "4.88 like" gearing for a 2016+. You don't actually ever want to fit 4.88s with the 8-speed. Gearing includes transmission and diff. So it's important to understand the 8-speed trannies already have hugely more internal gearing than the earlier LC200s with 6-speed. It relies less on the differential to do all the gearing multiplication.
Short answers
- The 8-speed stock with 3.307 diff, already has a first gear that's on par with the 6-speed and aftermarket 4.88s.
- What your gearing for is correction of the 35s to have good cruiser ratio.
- 3.9s is your answer.
- If your particularly heavy with lots of aero loads, maaaybe 4.1 and that's probably more equivelent to a 5.29 gear for the 6-speed.
- On the 8-speed, 3.9s are more extreme than 4.88s to the 6-speed
Here's the math
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- #5
Thanks for the information. I think I now understand why you are recommending either staying with the factory ratio or going with only a small increase. I appreciate your effort and quick response.
DesmoPilot
SILVER Star
I am running 4.30s with ARBs in a 2021 w/ 8spd and 34" tires. As @TeCKis300 stated, if you desire to get back to almost identical final drive as stock, then 3.90. If you have any additional weight, you can benefit from a higher final drive to be a little higher in the torque curve of the engine. I chose 4.30 for this particular reason. In my opinion, the 4.30 feels perfect on my rig.
Depending on which locker you go with will determine if you need a housing or not. Eaton makes a locker that fits the front 2016+ diff, so no need for anything extra. If you go with ARB, then you will need to source a front housing from a pre-2016. I got one from junkyard for a couple of hundred dollars. For the rear, you will need the housing. I bought mine from Just Differentials at the time of ordering the gear sets. I would recommend giving them a call.
Depending on which locker you go with will determine if you need a housing or not. Eaton makes a locker that fits the front 2016+ diff, so no need for anything extra. If you go with ARB, then you will need to source a front housing from a pre-2016. I got one from junkyard for a couple of hundred dollars. For the rear, you will need the housing. I bought mine from Just Differentials at the time of ordering the gear sets. I would recommend giving them a call.
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- #7
Thanks for the info; very helpful. I will give Just Differentials a call tomorrow morning.
- Thread starter
- #8
I talked to the Just Differential guys yesterday. They are out of a lot of the required parts: the rear differential housing, front and rear bearings, and ARB lockers. It appears that they only have the Nitro parts and gears. They don't have an estimate for when the other parts will be available.
The required rear differential housing is the one used on 2007+ Tundras with the 4.7 liter engine, not the 5.7 liter. From what I can find at the Toyota site, the required part number is 41101-0C010 or 41101-0C020. Can anyone verify that these are the correct required part numbers?
I’m just curious what front and rear lockers would cost installed? I don’t have the skills to do it myself so it would be my local Toyota guy. I don’t want to waste his time for an estimate because I’m not ready yet, but curious what y’all’s ballpark estimates are.
- Thread starter
- #10
I haven't got far enough to get an install quote. I, too, would be interested in what others have paid.
- Thread starter
- #11
There seems to be some confusion about the need to change front and/or rear differential housings. From what I've read and learned talking to the folks at Just Differentials, it appears that there is no need to change the front differential housing when using ARBs. The rear housing needs to be replaced with one from a 2007+ 4.6/4.7 liter Tundra. I think that either a 41101-0C010 or 41101-0C020 will fit.
Will someone who has done the conversion, verify that this is correct?
Will someone who has done the conversion, verify that this is correct?
bloc
SILVER Star
This has been discussed in detail, but I don’t remember the specifics, beyond the flange on the 2016+ diff carrier being in a different place. Probably because the stock gearing is so tall, the pinion had to be pretty large, and they moved the flange over to allow the ring gear to be thick enough.
Either way, if I were you I’d start searching what has been posted on the topic. It has all been covered, multiple times. To my knowledge no one is using tundra rear housings. A front or rear chunk from a 2008-2015 Landcruiser/LX will drop in, and the rear from a 97-2007 will as well.
Also I’d advise reading into ARB vs the newer generation e-lockers. The air lockers have a lot of problems, many of which were caused by poor attention to detail on install. But, it’s not just that, the design itself is prone to problems and newer tech is proving it’s case. Even the rockstar diff setup man Zuk is getting away from ARBs, if I remember correctly. And his capacity for detail is in a different universe than Just Differentials.
Either way, if I were you I’d start searching what has been posted on the topic. It has all been covered, multiple times. To my knowledge no one is using tundra rear housings. A front or rear chunk from a 2008-2015 Landcruiser/LX will drop in, and the rear from a 97-2007 will as well.
Also I’d advise reading into ARB vs the newer generation e-lockers. The air lockers have a lot of problems, many of which were caused by poor attention to detail on install. But, it’s not just that, the design itself is prone to problems and newer tech is proving it’s case. Even the rockstar diff setup man Zuk is getting away from ARBs, if I remember correctly. And his capacity for detail is in a different universe than Just Differentials.
DesmoPilot
SILVER Star
@bloc is correct that the housing was changed. We actually tried to install the ARB into the '21 housing. It goes in, however you are only able to get about two threads on one side or the other of the carrier. Swapped to the older housing and perfect.
There are plenty of opinions on e-locker vs air locker....mine included.
Air lockers have been around for years and ultimately it comes down to proper setup. Setting up gears and properly drilling and tapping a housing for no leaks are two different things. Finding the right person who can properly install the fitting is key. If have more questions on this, feel free to send me a PM and I am happy to share my experience.
Anyone have the part numbers for the Eaton E-Lockers for the 2017 and if it still requires the rear 3rd member as well?
No rush - trying to prevent asking again when I start buying parts.
No rush - trying to prevent asking again when I start buying parts.
- Thread starter
- #16
Thanks for your comments. They are reinforcing what others are says and what I've read. I agree that the proper installer is key for success. I just have one question (actually two): Do you have the part number for the housing you finally used, and did you find it in a salvage yard?@bloc is correct that the housing was changed. We actually tried to install the ARB into the '21 housing. It goes in, however you are only able to get about two threads on one side or the other of the carrier. Swapped to the older housing and perfect.
There are plenty of opinions on e-locker vs air locker....mine included.
