2014 52k miles. Leaking head gasket

[Moby]

Sorry for this. I unfortunately know the feeling all too well.

I know it isn't cheap, but I also would have stroked and bored way over with Darton sleeves and a Unichip for tuning. Or more likely just bored it over with sleeves and lowered compression and upgraded rods for a supercharger. Why? I've been down the head gasket road before and it ended with a rebuild anyway. And with this engine you're a good ways into having the engine out already. Even just having them tear down the short block and inspecting the crank and rod bearings might be worth considering. But nothing is free, and I get the trade offs.

I will say that having dealt with machine shops in the past I would do some independent research on the shop. Even if it is just for the head check. Give them a call and ask for their opinion on the short block. See what kind of vibe you get. It's not like dealerships do a lot of send out for engine building. So you don't know if they use the shop for convenience/price or because they can make 1000 horsepower hold together in a drag car and regularly put together "custom" builds. Not saying there is a right/wrong here, just that there are differences.

Either way, if you bring up the question of the short block and they tell you not to bother (likely) and then you have a problem, you may be able to negotiate on future work. When my short block started going after the headgasket the shop I was using comp'd me the labor of the headgasket job (which is predominantly labor of course). The next time I have to pull an engine I will do it myself.

At least have them agree to both a full compression and leakdown test after the heads are back on. Maybe after you've put some miles on it. Also keep an eye on coolant level.

 

[JohnJB]

Even just having them tear down the short block and inspecting the crank and rod bearings might be worth considering. But nothing is free, and I get the trade offs.

I know it's no real assistance but I completely agree with what Moby is saying here, particularly if you intend to keep this vehicle for the long haul. But I also realize nothing is free.

 

[jeep2cruiser]

Sorry for this. I unfortunately know the feeling all too well.

I know it isn't cheap, but I also would have stroked and bored way over with Darton sleeves and a Unichip for tuning. Or more likely just bored it over with sleeves and lowered compression and upgraded rods for a supercharger. Why? I've been down the head gasket road before and it ended with a rebuild anyway. And with this engine you're a good ways into having the engine out already. Even just having them tear down the short block and inspecting the crank and rod bearings might be worth considering. But nothing is free, and I get the trade offs.

I will say that having dealt with machine shops in the past I would do some independent research on the shop. Even if it is just for the head check. Give them a call and ask for their opinion on the short block. See what kind of vibe you get. It's not like dealerships do a lot of send out for engine building. So you don't know if they use the shop for convenience/price or because they can make 1000 horsepower hold together in a drag car and regularly put together "custom" builds. Not saying there is a right/wrong here, just that there are differences.

Either way, if you bring up the question of the short block and they tell you not to bother (likely) and then you have a problem, you may be able to negotiate on future work. When my short block started going after the headgasket the shop I was using comp'd me the labor of the headgasket job (which is predominantly labor of course). The next time I have to pull an engine I will do it myself.

At least have them agree to both a full compression and leakdown test after the heads are back on. Maybe after you've put some miles on it. Also keep an eye on coolant level.

I definitely have considered this... the issue at this point is primarily how much I’m willing to sink into the rebuild. I have asked and the machine shop is the top rated in our area and have had friends with high horsepower LS builds vouch for their work. Since this is the primary family vehicle, I simply can’t be without the car for much longer...

Was the engine you are talking about a 3UR FE or something else?

 

[jeep2cruiser]

That looks like an awful lot of carbon deposit on the cylinder heads that show and the valves for an engine with such low mileage. I'm also confused why some of the valves are dirty and some are spotless... artifact of a leaky head gasket? Then again I've never broken down a Toyota 5.7L

Indeed from the leaky gasket

 

[Moby]

Was the engine you are talking about a 3UR FE or something else?

I hear you on the question of how much to sink in. Never an easy decision, and probably no "right" answer. I guess I would also factor in how long you want the truck and how good of shape it is overall.

Mine was the 3FE in my FJ-62, which was no longer a primary vehicle (it really became a rolling science experience after the first rebuild, as I decided after that I was just going to teach myself to do everything except when I couldn't afford the necessary tooling - i.e. engine machining). I drove it all the time, but I also didn't have to if I was working on a big project for it.

Anyway... had a "good" shop pull the head based on their advise, found out a few months later that wasn't really the issue, let them rebuild it and got a so-so job. A few years, and a lot more experience later I worked with Over the Hill 4x4 Portland to build a 2FE (fuel injected 3FE head mated to the earlier, longer stroke 2F short block). Used their regular machine shop (i.e. a shop that regular dealt with performance F/2F/3FE engine builds). Pocket ported the head, upgraded the valves and valve springs, they did a custom ground cam, bored the new to me 2F short block .030 over, giving me about 4.3L of displacement with the slightly higher compression 3FE head.

I TIG welded a full exhaust myself out of mandrel bends. Ceramic coated the stock exhaust manifolds (I had already tried the only headers available and flange design leaked). Ported the TB and ported the intake to match the TB as well as port matching each runner. I had already done a Ron Davis radiator and converted to dual SPAL fans.

For tuning I had already built a CarPC with an in dash touch screen that ran music, HD radio, phone integration, etc via an "extensible" UI (meaning that I could write code to extend the functionality - I'm a long time software engineer). I used an Innovate wideband O2 over a serial port and wrote the code to display A/F ration on the screen so that I could monitor at all times. Later I converted the AFM to a programmable Split Second MAF, and also used the CarPC to tune it and display status. And then added a J&S Vampire knock sensor so that I could crank up the timing. This was also tied into the CarPC front end. Everything managed by the onboard PC and touchscreen.

I went through a trans rebuild, custom stalled converter and 3 different valve bodies before ditching the auto and swapping in a H55F. I was planning an LS swap when the truck was destroyed.

 

[kcjaz]

I may have missed it in the thread above but were you not able to get anywhere on the Toyota Goodwill approach? I ask because early 90's I bought an 87 FJ60. About a 6 weeks after I bought it blew its head gasket when I started the truck in a parking lot (big plume of white "smoke" from the tail pipe. Ended up needing to rebuild the engine and bore the cylinders (long story, keeping it short). Dealer initially says its past the factory and 30 day used car warranty. I complain and Toyota "good wills" the repair and I pay nothing (I actually believe the factory power train warranty was still in place but again, long story about dealing with a shady dealer). One year and a month later (one year warranty on engine repair), I notice an oil drip from crank pulley seal. I take the pulley off to replace the seal and find the keyway on the crank shaft messed up and no way to reinstall the pulley without it wobbling. Take it to a different dealer and they say the crank needs o be replaced. Their initial low cost suggestion is to replace the seal, weld the pulley on and sell the truck. I talk to the head guy at the dealer and he says, "let me call Toyota, this is a Land Cruiser". Toyota agrees to "good will" the second repair. When they get into it, the seal failed because the front bearing web was deformed and once again major repair (this time a new factory short block installed). This was 1992 and an 87 FJ60. The repair invoice was $10,000 and I paid nothing. The truck ran with no engine issues until I sold it in 2001 at 180,000 miles. Only sold it after I bought a second 87 FJ60 with a Chevy conversion. That was a mistake (thought pretty fun for a while) and another very long story.

 

[SWUtah]

This is like the first one I’ve ever heard of on a 200 series

 

[jeep2cruiser]

I may have missed it in the thread above but were you not able to get anywhere on the Toyota Goodwill approach? I ask because early 90's I bought an 87 FJ60. About a 6 weeks after I bought it blew its head gasket when I started the truck in a parking lot (big plume of white "smoke" from the tail pipe. Ended up needing to rebuild the engine and bore the cylinders (long story, keeping it short). Dealer initially says its past the factory and 30 day used car warranty. I complain and Toyota "good wills" the repair and I pay nothing (I actually believe the factory power train warranty was still in place but again, long story about dealing with a shady dealer). One year and a month later (one year warranty on engine repair), I notice an oil drip from crank pulley seal. I take the pulley off to replace the seal and find the keyway on the crank shaft messed up and no way to reinstall the pulley without it wobbling. Take it to a different dealer and they say the crank needs o be replaced. Their initial low cost suggestion is to replace the seal, weld the pulley on and sell the truck. I talk to the head guy at the dealer and he says, "let me call Toyota, this is a Land Cruiser". Toyota agrees to "good will" the second repair. When they get into it, the seal failed because the front bearing web was deformed and once again major repair (this time a new factory short block installed). This was 1992 and an 87 FJ60. The repair invoice was $10,000 and I paid nothing. The truck ran with no engine issues until I sold it in 2001 at 180,000 miles. Only sold it after I bought a second 87 FJ60 with a Chevy conversion. That was a mistake (thought pretty fun for a while) and another very long story.

I asked the shop foreman at the dealership and he said that it would be unlikely due to the weird history of the truck... after your story I will likely bring it back up and have him go through the necessary avenues. No point in taking a no from someone who can’t say yes.

 

[jeep2cruiser]

This is like the first one I’ve ever heard of on a 200 series

You and me both...

 

[Romer]

Do the service records show the radiator was replaced and if so under warranty/ If so thats an opening that they did not evaluate the collateral impacts at the time and this should have been investigated at the same time. This would only work if they did it under warranty. Just trying to think of something that might help. You can go to Welcome to Toyota Owners - https://www.toyota.com/owners/

Create a login and add the VIN for your truck and you will be able to see all the service history done by any dealer

 

[jeep2cruiser]

Hey friends. New development, while there’s no possibility of Toyota good will at least I know the cause of the head gasket failure. While we figure we knew the car was in an accident, we now have verification because the tech noticed that the radiator is aftermarket, not OEM. Given that it’s 100% been replaced, we know that the previous was compromised at some point which most likely caused the overheating. The headgasket showed definite signs of stress from heat and there was about 2oz of coolant in cylinder 8. A stark difference from bank number 1 which was pristine. Also good news, no crack in the heads, as we speak they are cleaning and refinishing them. Also am replacing the aftermarket radiator with an OE one. I’ve got some new small mods for the big girl when she’s out of surgery. Ready to have her back

 

[unclemat]

Thanks for updating us! That pretty much explains everything.

 

[32cls6speedmt]

Thank you for the updates. Can also let us know approximately the cost of repairs. Also the number of hours billed.

 

[renyon99]

Just curious; who did you end up having do all the work?

Hey friends. New development, while there’s no possibility of Toyota good will at least I know the cause of the head gasket failure. While we figure we knew the car was in an accident, we now have verification because the tech noticed that the radiator is aftermarket, not OEM. Given that it’s 100% been replaced, we know that the previous was compromised at some point which most likely caused the overheating. The headgasket showed definite signs of stress from heat and there was about 2oz of coolant in cylinder 8. A stark difference from bank number 1 which was pristine. Also good news, no crack in the heads, as we speak they are cleaning and refinishing them. Also am replacing the aftermarket radiator with an OE one. I’ve got some new small mods for the big girl when she’s out of surgery. Ready to have her back

 

[jeep2cruiser]

Thank you for the updates. Can also let us know approximately the cost of repairs. Also the number of hours billed.

Since I’m in the car business and already had a corporate account with them my actual total will be around $6k. 28hrs billed

 

[jeep2cruiser]

Just curious; who did you end up having do all the work?

Gullo Toyota. They’ve been great so far. Been texting with the shop foreman throughout the process to keep me updated. My service guy is great too. Would recommend them if you have to go to a dealer.

 

[jeep2cruiser]

Heads are back on. Shiny.

 

[SWUtah]

I wrecked my 2015 LX 570 and basically took out the front headlights, radar didn’t even dent any metal and it didn’t overheat but they replaced the radiator with a new Toyota radiator because a couple of the fins on the radiator were bent a little bit which I thought was funny since the car only had like 30,000 miles on it. I think it cost the insurance company about $20,000 to fix it all that radar and cameras the headlights were like crazy expensive headlights and all the plastic front bumper and support brackets, no sheet metal needed painting just needed all that front end supports replaced. these babies aren’t cheap especially the electronics

 

[jeep2cruiser]

She’s back! Dec 8th-Jan 20th at the dealer.

 

[Chewbacca]

She’s back! Dec 8th-Jan 20th at the dealer.

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What is your wheel/tire combo on there? Looks great.