What winch rope are you guys liking? (2 Viewers)

[FirstToy]

Oh it doesn’t bother me. It’s not my product.

I chose Yankum because it’s a very small outfit and he contacted me to help by using his product. I’ll never be contacted by anyone at MasterPull and especially not by anyone at Warn. That means something to me. I’ll always help the small guy. I’m the small guy and my customers are always helping me. If I’m going to pay extra, or even double, instead of from the big name brands so be it. We need more small business not more big business.

I heard of Yankum from Winder towing. They made a special yellow snatch rope for them.
They abuse those Yankum ropes and they always do the job.

Another thing about Yankum, they donate from every sale to some really important charities that are focused on children.

 

[FMC80]

I’m only using Yankum Ropes. I prefer made in USA

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This looks like my dogs “red rocket”

 

[Wrencher93]

I heard of Yankum from Winder towing. They made a special yellow snatch rope for them.
They abuse those Yankum ropes and they always do the job.

Another thing about Yankum, they donate from every sale to some really important charities that are focused on children.

My 80 *IS* a really important charity focused on children. I have a son that loves the "beep-beep" as he calls it.

 

[Wrencher93]

Dyneema 3/8 SK75 is rated for a 12K winch and has a breaking strength of over 17K (Amsteel Blue)
Dyneema 3/8 SK78 is rated for a 12K winch and has a breaking strength of over 19K.
Your standard 3/8 wire rope that came on your Warn M12K is rated lower than those.

FWIW, I am now on my 3rd synthetic line on my M12K. I have previously only used Amsteel, but I went with the SK78 last time around. I stopped using steel cable many years ago.

Thanks for this input. Devil is in the details...but I know what the published breaking strengths are and I've used my 3/8" winch line successfully. I was more pondering what a wise WLL is for 3/8. Supposedly, WLL is 1/5 of minimum breaking strength. That puts WLL for 3/8 between 3500 and 4000 lbs. So if I'm using a 3/8 for repeated pulls on a 6k vehicle - am I over-working the line? It won't break outright on the first pull, but am I reducing the life of the equipment because I'm using 1/3 of its MBS?

Essentially, am I over stressing the material?

 

[jonheld]

On those Amazon-sourced lines, I've noticed that - miraculously! - the advertised strength for a 3/8" line seems to creep upwards over the last few years, for the same product... @jonheld , 19k breaking strength for a 3/8" won't cut it on Amazon any longer LOL.Those Chinese manufacturer(s? - I bet it's all the same outfit) must have found magical new ways to improve their Dyneema products !?!

I'm not sure what you're implying, but I've never purchased any recovery gear from Amazon.
I had the SEO 3/8 previously and it's what got replaced with JMRigging 3/8 SK78.

The numbers I quoted came directly from Amsteel Blue (Masterpull) and JMRigging.
And I agree on the splicing, which is why I like JMRigging. He does excellent work.

 

[jonheld]

Thanks for this input. Devil is in the details...but I know what the published breaking strengths are and I've used my 3/8" winch line successfully. I was more pondering what a wise WLL is for 3/8. Supposedly, WLL is 1/5 of minimum breaking strength. That puts WLL for 3/8 between 3500 and 4000 lbs. So if I'm using a 3/8 for repeated pulls on a 6k vehicle - am I over-working the line? It won't break outright on the first pull, but am I reducing the life of the equipment because I'm using 1/3 of its MBS?

Essentially, am I over stressing the material?

Essentially, no.
The Warm M12K is fitted with 3/8 steel from the factory. 3/8 Dyneema of any variety will be stronger.
Synthetic is more susceptible to damage from pulling over rocks, but the weight savings and safety factor are more important to me. I consider any piece of recovery gear as a "consumable" and it all gets inspected yearly and replaced as needed.

 

[Wrencher93]

Essentially, no.
The Warm M12K is fitted with 3/8 steel from the factory. 3/8 Dyneema of any variety will be stronger.
Synthetic is more susceptible to damage from pulling over rocks, but the weight savings and safety factor are more important to me. I consider any piece of recovery gear as a "consumable" and it all gets inspected yearly and replaced as needed.

I agree on the consumable part and requiring regular unspection. Not sure I buy the argument that 3/8 will have an acceptable life cycle just because it has a higher tensile strength than the equivalent steel. Those to pieces of information are not necessarily related outside of the fact that the dyneema does indeed have a higher ultimate strength.

 

[Wrencher93]

Tension Fatigue Testing - Samson Rope

What is Tension Fatigue and why do we test it? This technical bulletin explains.

www.samsonrope.com

Found the above article. Granted, it is being published by Samson so there's bias. But assuming they are not wildly exaggerating then @jonheld it seems you were correct. Looks like the size of the load when performing cyclic loading of HMPE ropes has very little effect on their service life. Apparently the material just has a really high tolerance for that kind of use. Learned something new. ...also learned that it melts at 350 degrees F...so don't let it touch anything hot haha.

 

[jonheld]

I agree on the consumable part and requiring regular unspection. Not sure I buy the argument that 3/8 will have an acceptable life cycle just because it has a higher tensile strength than the equivalent steel. Those to pieces of information are not necessarily related outside of the fact that the dyneema does indeed have a higher ultimate strength.

Well, then I don't know what to tell you. Steel cable fatigues, steel cable can kink creating a weak spot, and steel cable can cut you off at the knees like a hot knife through butter. I've seen it take down saplings without being fully loaded when one snapped. Scared the literal crap out of me.

If your more comfortable with steel, then run steel. I've been using synthetic for at least the last 15 years and am now on my 3rd synthetic and 5th overall winchline since installing my M12K back in 1999. It gets used, inspected, and maintained like everything else on the vehicle. I've pulled some extremely heavy loads with it, to the point of stalling the winch during recovery. Never had an issue, at least with not the winch line

 

[jonheld]

.also learned that it melts at 350 degrees F...so don't let it touch anything hot haha.

Correct. Which is why there should be a heat resistant sleeve put on the first layer of the cable on the drum. This varies from manufacturer to manufacturer and should be considered when purchasing.

 

[woodsman 44]

I have Samson sk78 that bought in bulk and spliced my own end...super easy and I saved a bunch of cash this way..

 

[Wrencher93]

Well, then I don't know what to tell you. Steel cable fatigues, steel cable can kink creating a weak spot, and steel cable can cut you off at the knees like a hot knife through butter. I've seen it take down saplings without being fully loaded when one snapped. Scared the literal crap out of me.

If your more comfortable with steel, then run steel. I've been using synthetic for at least the last 15 years and am now on my 3rd synthetic and 5th overall winchline since installing my M12K back in 1999. It gets used, inspected, and maintained like everything else on the vehicle. I've pulled some extremely heavy loads with it, to the point of stalling the winch during recovery. Never had an issue, at least with not the winch line

I think you may have misunderstood me. I have no intention of running steel cable and I'm aware of how dangerous it can be when under load. I was simply trying to answer a specific question: is the load of a fully loaded 80 series, that the winchline is subjected to, high enough to jeopardize a 3/8 12 strand dyneema rope. If you'll see my last post, right above yours (I think we were typing at the same time) I linked an article that seems to give good reasons for that answer being "no". So you were correct and I have no issue admitting it. I just wanted some specific reasoning beyond "well, it should do better than the steel".

 

[Wrencher93]

I have Samson sk78 that bought in bulk and spliced my own end...super easy and I saved a bunch of cash this way..

Mind telling us where from? I've considered this but everywhere I've looked it's been about as. Cheap to purchase a pre-made winchline?

 

[ChaseTruck]

I'm not sure what you're implying, but I've never purchased any recovery gear from Amazon.
I had the SEO 3/8 previously and it's what got replaced with JMRigging 3/8 SK78.

The numbers I quoted came directly from Amsteel Blue (Masterpull) and JMRigging.
And I agree on the splicing, which is why I like JMRigging. He does excellent work.

Not doubting your numbers at all, quite to the contrary, and not insinuating anything.
I'm just saying that while I had good luck with the stuff from Amazon (some of my friends have, as well; everyone else's experience may vary...), I've noticed that the numbers advertised there are becoming really questionable - e.g. the same 3/8" rope I bought as 23k is suddenly 26k. It's turned into an advertising race, and I doubt that the advertised numbers relate much to any data. They try to make the numbers published by suppliers of quality rope seem outright low/small, and do anything to get the sale.

I think you may have misunderstood me. I have no intention of running steel cable and I'm aware of how dangerous it can be when under load. I was simply trying to answer a specific question: is the load of a fully loaded 80 series, that the winchline is subjected to, high enough to jeopardize a 3/8 12 strand dyneema rope. If you'll see my last post, right above yours (I think we were typing at the same time) I linked an article that seems to give good reasons for that answer being "no". So you were correct and I have no issue admitting it. I just wanted some specific reasoning beyond "well, it should do better than the steel".

If you are worried about strength, upsize from 3/8", have a shorter run of rope on the winch drum, and carry an extension. Depends of course on what trails you're running, and what length of winch pulls you might expect. The short length on drum/long extension works for the rock trails where I might need the winch to get unstuck. I can see that on longer stretches of muddy trails this could turn into a nightmare.

 

[Wrencher93]

Not doubting your numbers at all, quite to the contrary, and not insinuating anything.
I'm just saying that while I had good luck with the stuff from Amazon (some of my friends have, as well; everyone else's experience may vary...), I've noticed that the numbers advertised there are becoming really questionable - e.g. the same 3/8" rope I bought as 23k is suddenly 26k. It's turned into an advertising race, and I doubt that the advertised numbers relate much to any data. They try to make the numbers published by suppliers of quality rope seem outright low/small, and do anything to get the sale.

If you are worried about strength, upsize from 3/8", have a shorter run of rope on the winch drum, and carry an extension. Depends of course on what trails you're running, and what length of winch pulls you might expect. The short length on drum/long extension works for the rock trails where I might need the winch to get unstuck. I can see that on longer stretches of muddy trails this could turn into a nightmare.

I agree with this thought process (winchline + extension). And I wouldn't say "worried" but curious, yes. After reading about the cyclic fatigue testing though I think I'll stick with 3/8. I might be applying more than 20% MBS to the line in a single pull but those tests ran their dyneema ropes up to 90% MBS for 1,000 cycles before failure. If I use my winch line 1000 times I will abrade it or cut it before it fails simply from fatigue. So what everyone has echoed about regular inspection makes sense to me. If you check your line and it doesn't have any physical damage and you ensure no exposure to extreme heat - there's no reason to suspect premature failure.

 

[SNLC]

MP 3/8’s is 29.7klbs.

You will never stress that rope.


Cheers

 

[mudgudgeon]

@NLXTACY I didn't think your skin was that thin. I was more bothered by my own behavior. I hate it when someone asks for something and then whines when they are given what they ask for. But that's essentially what I did, so I wanted to apologize to everyone reading this thread.

I hate it when someone whines about their own whining





Sorry, cheap shot


Actually interested in the comments. I've wondered if there any real differences, or is dyneema, dyneema?

I'd like to put a winch on my current rig and will probably add a spare winch rope to my recovery kit to double as an extension line.

 

[ChaseTruck]

I agree with this thought process (winchline + extension). And I wouldn't say "worried" but curious, yes. After reading about the cyclic fatigue testing though I think I'll stick with 3/8. I might be applying more than 20% MBS to the line in a single pull but those tests ran their dyneema ropes up to 90% MBS for 1,000 cycles before failure. If I use my winch line 1000 times I will abrade it or cut it before it fails simply from fatigue. So what everyone has echoed about regular inspection makes sense to me. If you check your line and it doesn't have any physical damage and you ensure no exposure to extreme heat - there's no reason to suspect premature failure.

My Ramsey 9.5 came with 5/16 steel cable. That accumulated a couple of kinks, and so I initially replaced it with 5/16 synthetic, and haven't looked back.

And regarding inspections: I was quite astonished how much sand or silt can accumulate in a 3/8" rope in a recovery through water; in this case a running desert wash. I spooled out the rope the next day to let it dry, noticed it felt gritty, and stuck it in a 10 gal bucket of water. Quite a lot of dirt/sand/silt came out. Repeated that twice before letting the rope dry and spooling it back up.

 

[retrofive]

My Ramsey 9.5 came with 5/16 steel cable. That accumulated a couple of kinks, and so I initially replaced it with 5/16 synthetic, and haven't looked back.

And regarding inspections: I was quite astonished how much sand or silt can accumulate in a 3/8" rope in a recovery through water; in this a running desert wash. I spooled out the rope the next day to let it dry, noticed it felt gritty, and stuck it in a 10 gal bucket of water. Quite a lot of dirt/sand/silt came out. Repeated that twice before letting the rope dry and spooling it back up.

Yup There is a great little swimming hole we like to camp at nearby, perfect place to pull you truck up and let out the line in to the river to get a nice clean and then dry.

 

[nukegoat]

It's all the same, save for quality of splices, shipping time, color, fairy dust, etc.

This stuff has far more customers in the maritime world and there's a tiny number of manufacturers of the raw material. All these vendors are just buying giant spools and selling chunks. Up to you if you care about the value add, but it's all essentially the same.

Dyneema is so amazing IMO that it's just one of those things that should entirely take over the winch line market. The end