what else look a little like a nv4500? (1 Viewer)

[lurch]

I'm looking at a transmission out of a 93 chevy 3/4 pickup that should be a NV4500. I believe the vehicle was a DOT truck...It's got the 6.34:1 first gear but can't get it to shift into 5th. My friend says it's a 4 speed...is there another transmission that looks like a 4500 and has the same first gear but is a 4speed?

 

[lowenbrau]

That doesn't look like a NV4500... SM465 I'll bet

 

[lowenbrau]

NV4500

SM465

 

[Cruiserdrew]

Looks like a LATE SM465. Only the last 2 years got the aluminum top cover, prior to that they were cast iron.

They made that tranny from 69-92 or so, so if its a truck from that era, that would be correct.

It's an excellent transmission. How many splines on the output? If it has a yoke it should be 35. The desirable ones for swaps have 10 splines, but the shaft is available and can be swapped out.

Really rusty though. Where is it from?

 

[inkpot]

Howdy! Yup, I agree that it looks like a late model NP 465. I had an early one in my 72 FJ 40. The good news is low (granny) gear is about 6.58 : 1, but the bad news is that 4th gear (hight) is only 1:1. It does not have an overdrive (5th gear). John

 

[lurch]

SM465

oooooohhh! Now I see, amazing the similarities until you look at the right spots. I was paying attention to the plate on the side plus the bell housing mounts. And well being drunk on the idea of finding a great deal on a 4500 from a buddy.

I agree it's still a great transmission with better crawling ratio than my stock 4 speed. Whats a fair price for this transmission?

Looks like a LATE SM465. Only the last 2 years got the aluminum top cover, prior to that they were cast iron.

They made that tranny from 69-92 or so, so if its a truck from that era, that would be correct.

It's an excellent transmission. How many splines on the output? If it has a yoke it should be 35. The desirable ones for swaps have 10 splines, but the shaft is available and can be swapped out.

Really rusty though. Where is it from?

Not sure what the output shaft spline count is...I'll have to look into that.



It's in WV where the winter roads are salty.

 

[Cruiserdrew]

I agree it's still a great transmission with better crawling ratio than my stock 4 speed. Whats a fair price for this transmission?



It's in WV where the winter roads are salty.

$100-$200. They go for about that around here. You'll have to rebuild it and purchase and install a 10 spline main shaft to make it useful in a Cruiser Application.

The best overall write up is the one from TreeRoot in the tech links.

SM420s and SM465 make great swaps into FJ40s. If you are serious, you will be time and $$ ahead to get one that has a 10 spline output shaft from an earlier 4WD truck.

 

[orangefj45]

late 465 so it should have a 35 spline output shaft.

 

[GarageRat]

Year and aluminum top cover point to a 35 spline output SM465, predecessor to the NV4500. Around here you can get the early 10 spliners for 50-100 dollars if you keep an eye out, later ones aren't as desirable so probably about the same. Got mine with an NP205 and adapter for 200.

 

[lurch]

well i think i'm going to continue the hunt for a nv4500...I'm shooting for a dual purpose rig thats great on the highway and creepy crawl on the trail.

The plan is to mate a nv4500 with a split case, put in mark's gears and run 4.88s That gets me to the neighborhood of 100:1final crawl and about 2300rpm @ 70mph with 35s

 

[orangefj45]

do you really need 100:1 with 35s?! imho, you could do a lot more with the $2k the marks gear would cost you. and the gearing without them would be 75:1 with the stock split case gear. plenty low for anything but the toughest spots depending on where you live. if you were running larger tires then i'd say run the lower gears, but with 35s you'll be just fine.


ps: what engine are you running?

 

[lowenbrau]

well i think i'm going to continue the hunt for a nv4500...I'm shooting for a dual purpose rig thats great on the highway and creepy crawl on the trail.

The plan is to mate a nv4500 with a split case, put in mark's gears and run 4.88s That gets me to the neighborhood of 100:1final crawl and about 2300rpm @ 70mph with 35s

I have a plan to use an nv4500 behind a 12v Cummins in my lastest project (2004 HZJ79) but rather than a spitcase I'm thinking about using a Rover LT231 case. That'll get me about a 3:1 low range and my choice of 1:1, 1.2:1, or 1.4:1 high range depending on which case I choose. It also gives me a locking center diff and a giant drum parking brake. I just need someone to broach the t-case input gear to accept the splines of whatever NV 4500 I choose. I'll keep the factory 4:30 gears in the diffs and the whole project will be very economical.

 

[Tapage]

do you really need 100:1 with 35s?! imho, you could do a lot more with the $2k the marks gear would cost you. and the gearing without them would be 75:1 with the stock split case gear.

using the SM465 .. coz with a Toy tranny you will need the Marks gearset to reach close to the 70:1 with 4.8 8 on the axles ..

 

[lurch]

do you really need 100:1 with 35s?! imho, you could do a lot more with the $2k the marks gear would cost you. and the gearing without them would be 75:1 with the stock split case gear. plenty low for anything but the toughest spots depending on where you live. if you were running larger tires then i'd say run the lower gears, but with 35s you'll be just fine.


ps: what engine are you running?

Well not sure if I do need 100:1 but ... I would be about 45:1 in 2nd and 25:1 in 3rd. So I would end up with a good array of gear options...the marks gears would be the final piece of the puzzle. I'd put everything else together, run it and then decide.

But what I do know is 29:1 is great for mud, hills and minor trail obstacles but is horrible for most rock crawling and black trails at Ruasch Creek (roasted my clutch at fall crawl.)

I'm running a CSB 305 with a few tricks...headers, intake, cam holley truck avenger

 

[VETTE60]

i would go with a toy Box before the marks gears, and actually i did.... way more options and less expensive. i am running an Nv4500 with (early 6.34 gear set) 2.28 toy box, and split case. 4.88 rp's 37's. 70mph on the highway and silly slow crawl ratio of 160:1. yes that is very slow, however it is in my fj60 and let me tell you it is very nice with a heavy, long wheelbase. also nice because i only use it when i need it. lots of options. I also have a thumb throttle on my shifter and literally do not need to touch the gas or brakes. love the set up.

 

[Cruiserdrew]

i would go with a toy Box before the marks gears, and actually i did.... way more options and less expensive. i am running an Nv4500 with (early 6.34 gear set) 2.28 toy box, and split case. 4.88 rp's 37's. 70mph on the highway and silly slow crawl ratio of 160:1. yes that is very slow, however it is in my fj60 and let me tell you it is very nice with a heavy, long wheelbase. also nice because i only use it when i need it. lots of options. I also have a thumb throttle on my shifter and literally do not need to touch the gas or brakes. love the set up.

I agree with this. Do not bother with the Mark's gear set, it just isn't needed and is small bang for the buck. An SM465 with 2.28 Toybox and split case would be about as perfect as you can get and it would fit in a fairly short package, which is more important than you might think. An NV4500 would be awesome, but adds to the length and the expense as they are not cheap like the 420/465 family.

The only down side of an SM465 that I can think of is that the first gear is not syncronized, so you need to be at a dead stop to shift into it. I've driven an SM420 for years (which is basically the same) and you adapt and don't even think about it.

 

[lurch]

I do like the idea of a doubler but i haven't found a 5 speed setup that will work for the length of a FJ40. Found a thread on Marlin from a few years ago and it said the NV4500 with a toybox, 2 adapters + split case would only work in a FJ60.

AA doesn't make anything to put a doubler on a NV4500...

So I figure my options for a 5speed setup would be a NV4500 w/marks gears or a H55 with the Marlin setup which would be awsome but $$$$

Then of course if we're talking $$$$ a NV4500 with a Atlas 4 would be freakn sweet...then Id have trouble making a decision on which gear to choose

 

[VETTE60]

I agree with this. Do not bother with the Mark's gear set, it just isn't needed and is small bang for the buck. An SM465 with 2.28 Toybox and split case would be about as perfect as you can get and it would fit in a fairly short package, which is more important than you might think. An NV4500 would be awesome, but adds to the length and the expense as they are not cheap like the 420/465 family.

The only down side of an SM465 that I can think of is that the first gear is not syncronized, so you need to be at a dead stop to shift into it. I've driven an SM420 for years (which is basically the same) and you adapt and don't even think about it.

I thought the 465 was synchronized, and that was one of the improvements of the 420, but it has been several years since i have had one and can't really remember.

the nv4500 combo I have is way long and probably way to long for a 40 series.

also. if you go atlas then you need a centered rear diff, you could go a few ways

nv4500 or h55f+orion

np203 doubler

 

[orangefj45]

I thought the 465 was synchronized, and that was one of the improvements of the 420, but it has been several years since i have had one and can't really remember.

the nv4500 combo I have is way long and probably way to long for a 40 series.

also. if you go atlas then you need a centered rear diff, you could go a few ways

nv4500 or h55f+orion

np203 doubler

465 is synchronized

nv4500 doubler in a 40 would be waaaaay long

h55f-orion combo can not be done; no adapter and no input gear available

if i were to run a 4spd with a doubler, then it'd be an h42 or h41 with the toybox and split case. you can't beat the toyota transmissions for smooth shifting, long lasting and very user-friendly gear-splits. even with a 42. stock toybox and stock split case that'll get you 18.2:1 plus whatever diffs you're running. swap out for an h41 and you're at 26:1 and put some 4:1 gears in the toybox and you're at "silly low" with either other combo.

if you were to run a 5spd, then the physical length would be your biggest limitation which would force you to run an NV ( not a huge fan ) along with an orion in order to get some serious crawl ratios. running a doubler with an OD trans in a 40 is damn near impossible unless you're gonna stretch it. a lot.

 

[orangefj45]

I have a plan to use an nv4500 behind a 12v Cummins in my lastest project (2004 HZJ79) but rather than a spitcase I'm thinking about using a Rover LT231 case. That'll get me about a 3:1 low range and my choice of 1:1, 1.2:1, or 1.4:1 high range depending on which case I choose. It also gives me a locking center diff and a giant drum parking brake. I just need someone to broach the t-case input gear to accept the splines of whatever NV 4500 I choose. I'll keep the factory 4:30 gears in the diffs and the whole project will be very economical.

something like this?!