TSM Split Tcase Disc Brake Prototype #2

[Tinker]

Found out the yoke bolt pattern on my tcase is different than Turtle60's (who supplied a tcase half & yoke for prototype #1) so the TSM FJ40 tcase disc fits. Originally thought of mounting the cable to the frame but decided it wouldn't be good for the tcase brake to be activating when the engine/trans/tcase torqued in their mounts. Answer: extend the caliper bracket to accept the cable.

The 1st 2 pics are the bracket & the 3rd is (obviously) it installed. The cable mount comes pretty close to my rear seat heater hoses, so I plan on getting a pair of new ones & bending the tubes from the engine compartment closer to the floor pan. I think the engine will torque to the right (passenger) side so the cable had better be under them.

Will order the cable tomorrow from Welcome to Madison Power Systems if I can verify a 5/16" bolt will fit through the existing cable end ferrule on the brake handle.

 

[Turtle60]

Progress looks great! Since the first version fits my old case - maybe they would let me have it!

 

[Tinker]

Paul -
I have the proto 1 rotor: it's 1/4" mild steel which I was more than willing to use, so it's yours. As far as the proto 1 bracket goes, it obviously doesn't have the cable attachment point, but TSM sold a couple of those setups in the meantime with no negative feedback. What's left is the caliper which I'm sure they'd sell separately.

Cliff said he'd like to hold onto your parts until I get the cable worked out, so maybe you could do a field trip in a couple weeks. They're about 10 min east of Exit 182.

 

[VTCruiser]

interesting...i have been thinking about going to a t-case e-brake on my 60 since i have aftermarket rear disks. Do you know if this setup would interfere with the OE cable locker mechanisms?

 

[Tapage]

this setup will really hold a 60 series big tires in hill .. ?

 

[Tinker]

Some of the aftermarket mechanical disc ebrake vendors advertise the amazing holding power of their offerings - TSM doesn't. I figure at 4.11:1 it's like having 2 17" rotors & calipers. Guess I'll find out.

It's pretty easy for me to drive over the stock SF rear drum ebrakes with the Vortec, so I'll try to devise some kind of "objective" test. Maybe reef up as hard as possible on the stock brakes & see how many rpms it takes to move it in 1st on a level surface. Then try with the tcase disc. Any other suggestions?

 

[ntsqd]

snippage......
Any other suggestions?

First thot was to put a tension gauge in a winching rig and see how much cable tension it takes to pull the 60. The problem would possibly making the rear tires roll instead of skid. Maybe a couple thousand pounds of weight in the back?
To be really be scientific you'll probably also need to figure out some way to measure how hard you pull up on the p-brake handle.

I'm guessing that someone at TSM knows the leverage ratio of the caliper. If the Coefficient of friction of the pads and their centroid distance is known, then the effective torque per pound of p-brake cable tension could be calc'd.
The hard part would be dealing with the drum type p-brake calcs. I've never seen anything on doing these calcs, including when I worked in wilwood's R&D.

 

[Tapage]

I'm barely know that my rear disc from TSM whit the pedal and the 80 master brake cilinder can lock my rear mtr in a instant .. easy .. but I need to pull as hard as I can the e-brake ( el do calipers ) and it dosent hold the Cruiser in a tiny hill ..

 

[Tinker]

Nt -
I don't really need to know theoretically, just empirically. TSM's 40 version apparently works well enough. Turns out a lot of their hot rod stuff uses go-kart calipers which apply a lot less force.

Tapage -
I'm hoping this works really well. If not, I guess I'll be using Supra rear calipers & my setup will be on fleabay. Can't imagine that: the TSM guys seem really consciencous.

 

[lcwizard]

I'm barely know that my rear disc from TSM whit the pedal and the 80 master brake cilinder can lock my rear mtr in a instant .. easy .. but I need to pull as hard as I can the e-brake ( el do calipers ) and it dosent hold the Cruiser in a tiny hill ..

The best way to make the eldo calipers work is to step on the brake with the motor running then apply the e-brake. This should work unless the internal e-brake mechanism is bad

 

[brownbear]

any e-brake should hold at idle in drive or stall it out in 2 or 3rd on a manual. If it can't do that it isn't worth while to me. Of course most ebrakes can be driven over if you put on torque.

 

[Tinker]

Brownie -
We'll be finding out this weekend.

Cable should ship this afternoon from MI & arrive Rastle Cock Friday morning. Already have comfy cardboard to lie on to install it.

 

[Tapage]

The best way to make the eldo calipers work is to step on the brake with the motor running then apply the e-brake. This should work unless the internal e-brake mechanism is bad

Thanks dude ... I will try it in my Tencha .. but I remember few times that I already done that ( by accident sure ) and wtill don't hold as I hope my Cruiser ..

 

[Tinker]

So the cable assembly works, but the strand could easily be 1-2" shorter. Since the handle end fitting is about twice as long the OEM, the "sleeve" on the handle should probably be moved forward & angled so it points toward the strand hub. The swage portion of the strand end fitting is also longer than the OEM, so it interferes with the hub & doesn't allow much adjustment.

Proceeded to the testing: was able to drive over the brake from rest on a 6% downhill at about 3K rpm in 1st (5.7 Vortec/"built" 4l60e). Held on a 20% incline where my stock '83 60 rolled halfway back (on reasonably good brakes).

So I guess it's a success. Using the ebrake to stop from 25 mph produces some groans which I guess are the pads oscillating on their mounts. Repeating the procedure in the stocker takes longer, but no groans.

 

[Tapage]

That it's a success compared to my eldo calipers .. e-braking power.

 

[Tapage]

The best way to make the eldo calipers work is to step on the brake with the motor running then apply the e-brake. This should work unless the internal e-brake mechanism is bad

I try it on sat when was working on my winch .. and make no diference in the braking capabilites of the calipers .. maybe there are bad from factory .. ( mines thought )

 

[VTCruiser]

any updates?

 

[Mace]

I try it on sat when was working on my winch .. and make no diference in the braking capabilites of the calipers .. maybe there are bad from factory .. ( mines thought )

I have yet to meet anyone that was sastified with the Eldo calipers..

 

[ntsqd]

I have yet to meet anyone that was sastified with the Eldo calipers..

I know one, over the short term of about a year. Made them work well too. Time worked it's magic and he was back to where he started. Then he switched to Exploders.

Tinker, does TSM offer the caliper only? I'm thinking my proposed SYE'd 241 is possibly going to need something like that.

 

[Tinker]

NT -
Just looked at this thread as I'm going to email TSM the link for their website.

Yes, they sell the caliper for $100 & the mounting adapter (can't see it in the pix but goes from the outside studs on the caliper to the big bracket) for $10 IIRC (was over there yesterday but didn't write this stuff down: CRS, ya know).