Steering Gear Slop

[OGBeno]

The stabilizer is about a a year or two old. It should still be good... I would hope. It's an OME since those are cheaper than OEM.

I really do need to get my caster checked out, but I'm running the new Slee arms which should be good. Also the wheel re-centers well up to the slop point.

My current theory is that the tires catch a groove or a tilt to the road and goes that way. When this happens the wheels turn the knuckle which turns the draglink which pulls the pitman arm. The pitman arm then moves the sector shaft which rotates till it cinches up the slop in the direction that the arm moved. This could explain the center moving around since in essence it would be. I know I didn't explain this well but I'm having a hard time putting it to works.

Hmmm...well, as long as the nuts on the stabilizer are good and torqued down well, this is probably not the culprit.

The new Slee arms are made for the 6" lift, so caster is probably in range, though running big tires with an aggressive pattern will most definitly "grab" grooves and the like in the road and follow them...at least my 34.9" Dunlops do...

How are your TRE's by the way? Are they torqued down tight? Any issues with the PS system?

 

[Darwood]

Hmmm...well, as long as the nuts on the stabilizer are good and torqued down well, this is probably not the culprit.

The new Slee arms are made for the 6" lift, so caster is probably in range, though running big tires with an aggressive pattern will most definitly "grab" grooves and the like in the road and follow them...at least my 34.9" Dunlops do...

How are your TRE's by the way? Are they torqued down tight? Any issues with the PS system?

The new 315/75R16s also like to grab the groves a bit more than my old tires which is expected when going to a wider tire.

I'm planning on checking the TRE's when my wife gets back from her trip. They have about 50k miles on them.

The PS is OK. Sometimes at stopped to low speed turning like in a parking lot the power assist goes away. It's intermittent which is weird. Pretty much it's when I go full lock both ways while stopped. I haven't tried to diagnose that further.

 

[rockclmbr]

D,

My steering has approx. 15 deg of slop (I prefer to use degrees versus inches since the wheel is circular).

It is much looser than the 100series and i feel the same when cruising down 880 in the left lane next to the wall

I still need to replace my TREs to see if this will help, although after this coming weekend on the Rubicon I will probably have bigger issues to deal with!

I think this is the nature of a wheeled 80. I kind of like the slop so that I can't get into too much trouble during a knee-jerk reaction. The Honda Civic is too tight and I feel that I would flip the 80 when performing high speed maneuvers like this...

 

[Darwood]

D,

My steering has approx. 15 deg of slop (I prefer to use degrees versus inches since the wheel is circular).

It is much looser than the 100series and i feel the same when cruising down 880 in the left lane next to the wall

I still need to replace my TREs to see if this will help, although after this coming weekend on the Rubicon I will probably have bigger issues to deal with!

I think this is the nature of a wheeled 80. I kind of like the slop so that I can't get into too much trouble during a knee-jerk reaction. The Honda Civic is too tight and I feel that I would flip the 80 when performing high speed maneuvers like this...

Yeah I should have used degrees. I'm just not that bright however the FSM even uses inches.

I need to double check, but Devin's LX had very tight steering. I kinda wish I hadn't driven his truck. I think I'm going to play with the adjustment on my steering box this weekend.

So you're finally doing the Rubicon in the blue rig... nice!

 

[-Spike-]

I think I'm going to play with the adjustment on my steering box this weekend.

Be careful doing this. The steering box parts will wear at the point where they are most often in contact- with the wheels pointing straight ahead. If you adjust for this wear at that point, the parts may be way too tight throughout the rest of the movement. With power steering you won't even feel the binding, but you may be damaging your steering box, wearing it much faster.

-Spike

 

[Darwood]

Be careful doing this. The steering box parts will wear at the point where they are most often in contact- with the wheels pointing straight ahead. If you adjust for this wear at that point, the parts may be way too tight throughout the rest of the movement. With power steering you won't even feel the binding, but you may be damaging your steering box, wearing it much faster.

-Spike

Yeah this is a concern of mine. I'm actually using a remanned steering box that I put on about 15k miles ago. My old box had stranger tendencies. I'm getting to the point that I'm seriously thinking about buying one of CDan's gold steering boxes with the new and improved sector shaft.

 

[knorrena]

I have nearly the same issues as Darwood: engine off, at a standstill, the steering wheel moves back and forth about an inch. I dont buy into the steering stabilizer being part of the problem - under the stated conditions the steering stabilizer would have no effect on steering wheel play. I have also considered adjusting the steering box, but have not read up on how. I did adjust the box on a heep I once owned, and it did a world of good.

Karl

 

[-Spike-]

Mine both move about an inch (one at 100K and one at 180K), and I adjusted a friend's to move about the same from more 2 inches. His had been taken apart by someone who then left the adjustment bolt completely loose. With my wife's street tires, one inch of play (at the wheel, before feeling any resistance, engine off) feels perfect when driving, but with oversized tires on the other two trucks the same inch is noticeable while driving. Not dangerous, just apparent.

From what I understand the only way to do the adjustment correctly is to disconnect the box from both the wheel and the tie rod, similar to setting pre-load on wheel or knuckle bearings.

You may replace the box and find that ia brand new one performs exactly the same way. Before you do, maybe you could pull the reman'ed box you have and check it for play or wear per factory specs. You may find that an inch is as good as it gets.

-Spike

 

[CappyKD]

Do the LC's use a rag joint? On my Dodge ramcharger I had almost 3 inces of movement and I bought a $20 rag joint repair kit and the problem was solved. (I see someone mentiond a Ramcharger earlier apparently it is a common thing with them)

 

[-Spike-]

IIRC it's a u-joint. I could go outside and look, but then again so could you.

-Spike

 

[CappyKD]

Kinda directed at the OP not you. My steering is fine.

 

[-Spike-]

OK, so we're both lazy.

-Spike

 

[Darwood]

Do the LC's use a rag joint? On my Dodge ramcharger I had almost 3 inces of movement and I bought a $20 rag joint repair kit and the problem was solved. (I see someone mentiond a Ramcharger earlier apparently it is a common thing with them)

Yep there is a rag joint in there as well as a u-joint. Both have been replaced by me. Both were actually fine and did not require replacement.

I should probably add that I also rebuilt my steering column about a year ago.

 

[-Spike-]

Darwood, I hate you. Now I have to go look, I can't imagine how it could have both a rag joint and a u-joint. Damn you for making me leave my chair!

-Spike

 

[Darwood]

Darwood, I hate you. Now I have to go look, I can't imagine how it could have both a rag joint and a u-joint. Damn you for making me leave my chair!

-Spike

If I recall correctly the rag u joint goes from the steering column to the rag joint. The rag joint is then connected to the steering shaft that goes through the firewall to the steering box. Also if the steering shaft that goes to the steering box isn't as far forward in the steering box as possible the rag joint will make a clicking noise when the steering is rocked back and forth quickly i.e. off road.

 

[-Spike-]

Cripes, it has not one, but two u-joints AND a rag joint. No wonder there's so much slop. At least the rag joint is under the dash rather than in the engine compartment getting beat by the heat.
FTR- Steering wheel, shaft, rag joint, u-joint, shaft, u-joint, box.

-Spike

 

[Darwood]

Cripes, it has not one, but two u-joints AND a rag joint. No wonder there's so much slop. At least the rag joint is under the dash rather than in the engine compartment getting beat by the heat.
FTR- Steering wheel, shaft, rag joint, u-joint, shaft, u-joint, box.

-Spike

I had the order messed up. Well that's what I get for going off my memory.

I've done some experiments before and tried to see if any of those joints had some sort of slack in them. To date I haven't found that any of them do. I turn the wheel and everything else turns. The one place that doesn't happen is at the steering box. But like I've said I need to get my wife to help me to see if anything has changed since the last time I've looked.

 

[94 Newbie]

Dodge Joint Question

The Dodge uses a different style than anyone else's I know - see attached pic.

I had a '77 & 2 '79's. Sure was easy to pack the front wheel bearings, though - you used a grease gun !


I think the play on my LC w/ 174K is around an inch - I wonder if doing a wheel bearing repack & adjust would help any.



Britt

 

[-Spike-]

I've done some experiments before and tried to see if any of those joints had some sort of slack in them. To date I haven't found that any of them do.

You have a good mechanical advantage at the wheel over the shaft components. Off the top of my head, a way to check for play would be to lock the shaft at the box, perhaps with some Vice-grips (not often I think of a good use for those ) and see if the steering wheel moves at all.

In any case, I'd love to see the results of a similar poll, with the standard for measuring spelled out. Too much ambiguity for me to trust the 8 responses of less than 1 inch of play. When I was looking into this for a friend, it took me some trial and error to come up with a reliable and repeatable way to measure the slop, and if asked before I had done this I would have said my wife's truck had no slop. I don't believe it's possible for any car to have zero play at the steering wheel, but I might be wrong.

-Spike

 

[CappyKD]

OK, so we're both lazy.

-Spike

Bingo