Should I sell my 200 for an 80?

[duganrec]

OK hear me out. I have a 2016 200 series, 2.5 inch lift on 295/70/R17s, snorkel, onboard air and a rear air locker. 107k miles, runs strong. I would say we do occasional moderate wheeling, plenty of other adventuring, and tow a small square-drop trailer (2500-3000 lbs all loaded) around the western US (live in UT). I’ve loved it, but I have a serious love for cruisers of old. I also miss driving something small and exciting.

I’ve started to entertain the idea of selling the 200 and buying an 80. Looking at one that’s triple-locked, excellent condition, lifted and well-built, 175k miles, well-maintained. Then I’d look at getting maybe an F80 or E46 M3 (has long been a dream car of mine, assuming the wife doesn’t lose her mind).

Yes, it’ll be slow. I’ve accepted that. But the 90’s child within me can’t stop thinking about this rig.

Crazy? Or send it?

 

[suzuguru]

For starters, you're in an 80 sub-forum. Of course the majority of people are going to be in favor of ditching the 200 for an 80. You just have to think long and hard about it, and do what's right for you. If you listen close enough, your gut will tell you what that is. If you can handle it financially, get an 80 while keeping your 200. After a while, decide which one you want to keep and sell the other. The 80 will certainly hold its value. As long as your purchase price is reasonable, you should be fine, should you decide to sell it.

 

[nikramos]

Drive one first and see if you like it . If you will not be doing any serious off-roading then No. I have a built S/C 80 and a built 200. I hardly use the 80. I can’t get use to the lack of power even with the supercharger compared to the 200. I like looking at my 80 though so she is a keeper for now.
Now if you buy an LS80 then it’s a game changer

 

[duganrec]

For starters, you're in an 80 sub-forum. Of course the majority of people are going to be in favor of ditching the 200 for an 80. You just have to think long and hard about it, and do what's right for you. If you listen close enough, your gut will tell you what that is. If you can handle it financially, get an 80 while keeping your 200. After a while, decide which one you want to keep and sell the other. The 80 will certainly hold its value. As long as your purchase price is reasonable, you should be fine, should you decide to sell it.

Yep. Cross-posted to the 200 forum as well. Good thoughts, and an interesting proposition there.

 

[Marvelicious]

Let me put it this way: if money were no object (say I hit one of those billion dollar powerball jackpots), I might get rid of my 80, but only because I'd probably get an imported diesel 80.

 

[voodu3]

If you haven’t already I’d spend some time driving an 80 like you currently use your 200. I think there is a company in salt lake that rents them for trail rides and camping. I’m sure there are some on Turo too. If a 30ish year old truck works for your use case then go for it. I love my 80 but it does take a different level of care and feeding that you don’t have with a low mileage 200. BTW an 80 and an M3 would be a pretty sweet two car solution. Good luck.

 

[ChaseTruck]

Small and small exciting the 80 is not. Are you sure you got the numbers right?
Didn’t you - deep down - mean to type 40?

 

[mudgudgeon]

80s are at the age where they are going to almost always have something needing fixing.
If you're a tinkerer and a half decent mechanic, an 80 will keep you entertained.
If your not inclined to do mechanical repairs, an 80 might just annoy the piss out of you, or nickle and dime you at the shop if you're paying for repairs/maintenance.

If you intend to daily drive it, be prepared to go through a lot of baselining to make it reliable, then keep it that way.

 

[mudgudgeon]

Small and small exciting the 80 is not. Are you sure you got the numbers right?
Didn’t you - deep down - mean to type 40?

Or miata?

 

[CharlieS]

First, I have a 2016 200 and a 1994 80. I've also owned a 2013 200 and a couple of other 80 series (including one that was supercharged).

If you don't offroad hard stuff, and you tow anything, my opinion is that the 200 is a much better platform.

The 80 shines when used in moderate to challenging offroad scenarios.

A 200, especially with aftermarket lockers, can do 95% of what an 80 can do, as long as you can tolerate body damage.

The 200 is heavy, wide, poor forward visibility, but it also has ungodly power, modern systems, and is vastly more comfortable. And it tows amazingly.

The 80, without a supercharger, is not a great tow platform for hilly/mountaious terrain. With a supercharger, it does okay. Still nowhere as well as a 200.

For the use case you describe, I'd say no.

If you didn't tow, were into hard wheeling, and could live with the reduced power, poorer braking, less comfort, can deal with older (or no) safety systems, the 80 wins all day long.

If you can get both, do it. Best of both worlds.

I live in a rural area of a rural state, and grab the 80 more often than the 200, but any time I have passengers, want more comfort, plan to tow, have a cross country road trip, etc., I hop in the 200. They're really dramatically different beasts.

 

[jpoole]

Good advice above esp. the try an 80 or buy an 80 and keep the 200 for a bit.

I love my 80 and have no expectation of replacing it but the towing and highway handling may be an issue for you. When I've headed West with our 3k lb camper and gear the 80 has had to work hard and this typically takes a lot of my attention on the driving days for me. Turbo/supercharger would certainly help but towing may still be a bigger difference than you are anticipating vs the 200. Highway driveability is also a relevant difference here and with the driving distances you might often see out West, cross-winds etc. longer trips will be more tiring in the 80, for the driver particularly.

Going slower with a NA inline 6, needing to pay more attention, increased driving feedback (noise, more visibility) are big parts of the 80s charm and are at reasonable levels if the 80 is in good shape or if they are compared to even earlier SUVs but these are all noticeably dialed up in an 80 vs. more modern options.

 

[oilbrnr]

Are you still going to be pulling that trailer with the 80? If so, then I'd say hell no.

That said, I just spent a week in my LX in Southern Utah (Mexican Hat, over to the south side of Hole in the Rock, up to Hanksville, over to Blanding and then some excursions around Bluff). The past seven years I've been using my 2016 Power Wagon with a Four Wheel Camper in the back for all my longer trips. It the PW fits, it will go virtually anywhere an 80 will go, and I have a nice dust free environment to get into at the end of the day. This year, it was back to the LX as I postponed getting the RAM's King shocks rebuilt in time for a planned trip, so I scrambled with some deferred maintainance on the old girl including replacing all of the suspension bushings and a few other items.

Seven days, well over 250 miles of just off-road. Flawless and too easy. With the PW, I really have to keep a mental note of my lines and where my rear is going to track on any kind of a sharp turns. So less time looking at scenery, more time on road focus.

As far as power in general goes, it is a bummer. Power of a four, thirst of an eight. Sucks, but you can flog on them pretty hard if the cooling system is up to par, and they will spin happily above 4k all day (providing enough fuel). They are kinda interesting in that even fully loaded, it doesn't feel much different.

I've never driven a 200, only sat in one at a local Copper State Cruiser meeting. I know it sounds stupid, but the the whole dash layout was a big turn off for me. We have a 2012 Highlander with those same style ringed gauge clusters, hurl. And the chrome trim rings. IFS is a big turn-off too.

IMHO, 80's in North America will always be the pinnacle of what we got as a Land Cruiser and I don't think I'm alone in that opinion. At 57, It is my forever vehicle at this point. I'd planned on doing an LT swap this fall, but after this past trip my plans changed. Im going to order a complete short block, and piece together the head and have a complete long block to put in when the time comes. She turn 272k on this trip, burnt 1/2 qt of oil in 5,500 miles. I just changed the plugs/wires/rotor/cap after 100k, and the plugs were all the same nice even color. Head gasket has 100k on it now (it went right after I got her in 2013). Biggest issue is oil weepage around the upper and lower pans as well as the rear main or more likely the rear pan bridge seal area.

Find someone in a local club that has a nice, well built (and maintained) 80 and see if they'll let you take it with them on a little test drive and see what you think.

 

[RobbyBoy32]

I'll just chime in about the lack of power towing. I have a lifted 100 and a 2015 200, and they are night and day in towing capacity. We just got back from the UP and the hills in Northern Michigan are a pain towing our pop up camper. Speeds drop to about 65mph on our Michigan stuff and stuggling even with the 100, so I can't imagine out west with an 80. If you are good with that then by all means go for it. As for the offroading capability, sure the 80 will be better, but with the right tires and your lifted 200 how can you go wrong. We went through a few muddy water trenches (water up to, at, or above the grill) with the old beat 2.5" lift 100, heard some rock scrapes underneath on the trails, new pinstripes on top of old pinstripes, and my wife said she would be horrified to do that to our 200. Only you can decide the amount of damage you're willing to do to a $30-40K vehicle vs a $10K-18K rig. My 100 is about $4500 all in as it sits, so it was a blast without worry.

 

[duganrec]

If you haven’t already I’d spend some time driving an 80 like you currently use your 200. I think there is a company in salt lake that rents them for trail rides and camping. I’m sure there are some on Turo too. If a 30ish year old truck works for your use case then go for it. I love my 80 but it does take a different level of care and feeding that you don’t have with a low mileage 200. BTW an 80 and an M3 would be a pretty sweet two car solution. Good luck.

Right? I figured they both are fabulous for different uses, and the duo would be awesome. But, I hadn’t considered renting one and that is a pretty good idea - much cheaper than buying one and realizing I am not in for the extra headache. My commute is 10-15 minutes, and I think either works well for that and the around town stuff - probably comes down to the ability to do longer trips more comfortably and quickly with the 200.

 

[CharlieS]

And towing, and driving over hills, and holding the right gear, and stopping quickly, and accelerating quickly, and having crawl control, and having side curtain airbags, and having camera, and having a (sort of) decent sound system, and having heated/ventilated seats, and having automatic climate control, and having a cabin air filter, and not needing all the maintenance our 30 year old 80s do (simply due to time, wear and tear).

The 80 is the choice your heart makes. The brain may differ.

There is an outfit in Moab that guides with a bunch of 80s that might be worth checking out too.

Ps. I my 80, but I ❤ 200 too. Just for different use cases and different reasons.

 

[duganrec]

@jpoole very good things to think about here; if I’m being truly honest with myself, I’m probably underplaying the impact that the highway manners of the 80 will have. Tough to be completely objective when the subjective looks so good, but this is a very important consideration.

@oilbrnr thanks for your input - and great avatar

@RobbyBoy32 yeah, not gonna lie the pin striping gets to me a little, despite me saying it doesn’t. Thanks for sharing your experience with towing.

@CharlieS I hate having to actually think with my brain and not be able to follow the heart, but your points are well-taken - it may not make as much sense as I have deluded myself into believing when it comes to towing and longer trips.

@Marvelicious oh I’ve spent some time dreaming of the “money is no object” situation, and it doesn’t help because then the 80 becomes a no-brainer for me.

 

[SNLC]

Beware most old used 80’s are dogs. Mine with a new engine has no probs doing 80-85mph. It pulls passes good up to maybe 5,000ft, above that probably not so great. The way I use it I am not pulling many passes in the mountains that are not two lane highways. So here in Idaho it’s fine, if I lived in the Rockies it would suck.

I did live in the Rockies at one time and had a v8 80. Towed 5,000lbs with it once through the mountains, not over steep passes but with the v8 it did fine.

An 80 with a 1HDFTE or v8 swap in my opinion is one of the best Cruisers you can own.

Cheers

 

[Heckraiser]

OK hear me out. I have a 2016 200 series, 2.5 inch lift on 295/70/R17s, snorkel, onboard air and a rear air locker. 107k miles, runs strong. I would say we do occasional moderate wheeling, plenty of other adventuring, and tow a small square-drop trailer (2500-3000 lbs all loaded) around the western US (live in UT). I’ve loved it, but I have a serious love for cruisers of old. I also miss driving something small and exciting.

I’ve started to entertain the idea of selling the 200 and buying an 80. Looking at one that’s triple-locked, excellent condition, lifted and well-built, 175k miles, well-maintained. Then I’d look at getting maybe an F80 or E46 M3 (has long been a dream car of mine, assuming the wife doesn’t lose her mind).

Yes, it’ll be slow. I’ve accepted that. But the 90’s child within me can’t stop thinking about this rig.

Crazy? Or send it?

I totally get this. I'm an 80 guy and I'm constantly thinking about picking up another one. Things to think about:

You do not want to tow your camper in the 80. Yes, it can technically do it, but it will suck especially on the highway. The 1fz is powerful enough to move the truck OK, but any extra weight or aero drag and it quickly becomes very unpleasant. I had a couple small trailers (Hiker and A-liner) both were awful to drag across Wyoming on I-80, but were fine on ~50mph country roads.

The 80 will need a lot more baselining and maintenance. It's always something cropping up, just a symptom of age.

The 200 is a really well-rounded rig. It's a decent wheeler and it can get back on the highway and rocket you home at 90mph if that's your thing. The 80 is superior off road and much easier to manage on the trail due to it's size and ground clearance, but then you'll be putting home at 65mph in 2nd gear with a lot of noise and high RPMs. I had a turbo on my 80 for a while and it kept up on the mountain passes much better, but still had to keep vigilant for leaks, smells and surprises, so it wasn't a total "peace of mind" solution. @SNLC is right, a V8 swapped 80 really is the best of both worlds. Still not as civilized as a 200 on the highway, but capable of doing most of what a 200 can do on pavement and much more than a 200 can do on the trail.

For me in my life now, the 200 is the logical choice. Every time I re-assess (which is frequently) I come to the same conclusion. But I don't feel the same way about my 200 as I did about my 80 or 60s or hilux for that matter. It doesn't give me the feels, it just quietly does it's job.

 

[ikarus]

I agree with everything everyone has said above.

In my experience the struggle between old vs new vehicle is eternal, until you can buy both. When I had a new truck I would start thinking "man I want something with some character and capability"

And then when I sold the new truck to buy an old truck I would start thinking "man I'm tired of maintenance on my daily, I should buy something new/safe/comfortable"

I have a 200 for daily driving and family adventures on easy trails, and the 80 for solo trips and more difficult trails. Another thing to consider is what your family likes. My boys love cruising around my 80 but anything over an hour gets old fast. But that's my fault for having a straight piped diesel with no additional sound deadening and blown speakers. So the 200 is a no brainer for longer trips. If I didn't go on solo trips the 80 just wouldn't get used much.

Also the 80 is pretty safe I think but it's no match for modern airbags and crash test ratings. That's something my wife cares about a lot

end of the day they're both relatively rare collector's vehicles and I say save up or get to a point where you can afford both. You'd probably regret selling the 200 and you'd probably regret selling an 80 if they're well-maintained and built.

 

[CharlieS]

My only beef with broad statements about v8 swapped 80s is that the swap needs to be done well and many aren't.

And then to do it right, better braking is on the table. Heaven forbid you need to take it to a mechanic, and even if they will look at it, have to reverse engineer whatever the person who did the swap used for parts. And you better be well versed in troubleshooting so you can diagnose problems on trail. And buying parts for any swap is always interesting. Been there, done that too many times.

I was on trail this weekend with a v8 swapped 80. It sounded amazing and had power for days (400+ hp). I was jealous, and felt self conscious about my puny stock rig. On the other side of the coin, he had more breakage and issues in a day and a half than I've had in decades of stock Toyotas. On the same trails and obstacles that I ran in my stock 1FZ-FE.

I personally am a huge fan of reliability. My first 200 had exactly one issue in the first 100k miles (at 99,800 miles ish), which was easily repaired by swapping a fuel pump ecu. My next 200 has had 0 issues in 120k miles. I've never had a stock land cruiser strand me anywhere.