2001LC
SILVER Star
They don't ship to my zip code. City tax report requirement BS. So do you have a brand name you received and like?
Poll on total brake failure in 100 series (2 Viewers)
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if you have autozone around, ive seen firsthand the brand they carry as their house brand and is pretty quality. They claim they are OEM rebuilds but I doubt that. They are also around $50-60 per caliper. PM me if you want me to buy and ship out to you. I’ll be putting in an order in the spring and will have a few brands to compare. Maybe I’ll make a post here about them.
Also, what do you mean the pump doesn’t prime any more? It might be what I noticed with my stock setup that once the calipers and brakes were serviced the pedal became much smoother and the sound of the pump running was practically silent and ran less frequently.Show off.
A few days ago I woke up to a puddle of brake fluid under the truck and was hoping it was a leaking master cylinder seal. My local toyota/lexus mechanic just confirmed that it is leaking from the ABS unit and will need to be replaced. At least he is ok with me ordering the part on Toyotapartsdeal.com and having it delivered to the shop. Hopefully will walk away from this for around $2700. The truck is a 2000 with 230k on it.
$2700? sounds high
Really? I found the part online for $2200 (retail is $3200 from the dealer) and figured install/bleed the system would be around $500.
why not a rebuilt? just curious
I didnt think they were rebuildable to be honest. Now Ive done some searching and it does seem like people have installed rebuilt units with some success. I may look into that route this weekend. Im just not real confidant a rebuilt unit would last another 200k plus miles like an OEM will.
They fit the brakes. My spindle with gussets and extended travel however. Doh!Be sure and show us the new wheels on there so we can see the clearance with the BBK.
That’s exactly what I mean
2001LC
SILVER Star
I can say I had a lot of luck rebuilding and replace just bad parts of brake system of the 100 series for years, without a signal come back. But now I've seen two in a row with issues. One was never bleed for sure the other likely the same.
On the later I found after flush 2 gallons of brake fluid through the system (including ABS and Accumulator).Fluid was black again in reservoir in just 6 months. I suspect, this bad fluid leads too issues with seals, diagram in accumulator and switches.
In first, I found rear bleeders frozen in. No bleeder caps. The rig had been at Slee 4 yrs ago, and then two different shops subsequently of the years for pads and flushes, one a Dealership. I can assure this rig had not been flushed or bleed at rears in over a decade if ever.
I did find at closer look, Slee noted the rear bleeders frozen and only topped reservoir. No other shop said anything and charge for flush/bleed
Took me three days to get rear bleeders out and replace them with new OEM bleeders. But we suspected the caliper are weeping on cold mornings. The piston must be pitted. I say this because moisture build up in system brake fluid is very damaging and this one the rears fluid when I flushed look very very bad. This is not the very first out which look even muddier. Bad stuff!
We were seeing very long run time of booster motor, from non stop to 45 seconds at best. The improve times were with use. Brake control wire was corroded. Also we got the screeching with bubbles in reservoir a few time for just a moment. Also peddle fade while stopped.
I was willing to work on and replace part by part of booster assembly, to see effect of each and keep cost down. Owner Brain, elected to just have me install new OEM booster assembly in one shot (good choices). I also installed a new master plunger/seals kit while I had master out, flushed the system and bleed.
Pre booster assembly (includes accumulator, pump, motor and wire) R&R. I noticed it took 39 or more pumps of peddle to evacuate accumulator. After R&R, it only took 22 pumps. I've notice the higher the mileage/age the more I'm pumping peddle. Most HM in the low 30's. In my low mileage rigs, I'm in the mid to upper 20 pumps. These longer peddle pump times, is a clue of health of accumulator and seals IMHO.
Brake peddle fads is also clue of weeps and seals.
After R&R of booster assemble motor was whisper quiet, with only 22 pumps of peddle to evacuate and time to charge was constant at 32 seconds. Beautiful right.
Well it's back, my first come back OUCH! As OAT (outside air temps) drops to the below ~18 F. The pump will not stop running, that's bad. Under 25F the alarms will come on briefly when first starting out a drive during cold mornings.
I went up to Toyota Dealership and spoke with a Master Diagnostician of more than 20 years. He's been very helpful over the years. He's the guy, when I ask hard question in the shop, others always walk me over to..
He said the cold morning intermittent alarms are very common in the winter cold. They see it all the time. He said it's the old seal shrinkage with age, then more in the cold. As we work the brakes the seals heat and expanded then alarms go off as pressure come up
But any alarm, we should stop driving and investigate. If we loose all pressure, we loose brakes for the most part. Number on reason we loose pressure is booster motor failure. Number two is loose of brake fluid from a bad leak.
So our issue of alarms is likely just the calipers and or master plunger need rebuilding with new kit and piston or replaced.
But we've one more issue of non stop on booster motor on very cold morning. No amount of using brake gets the motor to stop. WHY?
Well we don't know. I suspect the old weak pressure switch can't handle the high pressure the new booster assemble is delivering. The system even with just a new motor brake control wire, may spin faster than old increase pressure more than old switch can handle.
I'm waiting on a used switch to install now, as a test. If it stops motors excessive run times during very cold temp. Will know. If not I'll need to R&R calipers to further give switch a fair test and get new switch. Brian is being patient with me. He'd just assume I put all new and be done with it. I'm trying to save him money. But he's losing use time. I'll not charge him for any addition time I spent on master. After switch and caliper, if still any issue, it will be the Master/ABS assembly I'll be R&R. We'll likely replace all six the flexible brake line with SS braided before where done and all caliper.
In Brains' rig, we know brake fluid and age did a lot of damage. The rusty brake control wire, I'm sure damage the motor. It may also have damage the ABS unit power comes through. I've been told we have addition pressure switch inside the ABS unit which makes senses. The current flow with corroded wires high resistance, may also effect the electrics relays in the ABS, IDK. The bad brake fluid will damage it and the master cylinder. We've some evidence now, it damages pump and accumulator. Piston there is no doubt bad fluid pits them, I see that all the time.
Bottom line at Dealerships, this is number one reason they just replace the whole unit. Their customer pay the a lot of money and only know one thing. Either it works or it does not. They do not get into this at stuff at all. It as all or non deal. They not going to chase it.
Toyota give use very little info on the master/ABS unit. So were on are own. They will not sell us two components separably, the of Master/ABS unit except plunger. I'm beginning to understand why!
Number one guys, keep fluid flushed and never overfill. Keep those bleed caps on and in good condition. Check run time of booster motor now and then. Excessive run time, will greatly reduce life of motor. Motor failure is our main concern.
By the time we're done these brakes on Brian's rig will be spot on, peddle will be hard as a rock with the use of just one toe to stop on a dime. Just like the Unicorn was, one of my restore projects.
But this not a Land Cruiser issues of defective brake IMHO. It the case with all aged and neglected brake system.
On the later I found after flush 2 gallons of brake fluid through the system (including ABS and Accumulator).Fluid was black again in reservoir in just 6 months. I suspect, this bad fluid leads too issues with seals, diagram in accumulator and switches.
In first, I found rear bleeders frozen in. No bleeder caps. The rig had been at Slee 4 yrs ago, and then two different shops subsequently of the years for pads and flushes, one a Dealership. I can assure this rig had not been flushed or bleed at rears in over a decade if ever.
I did find at closer look, Slee noted the rear bleeders frozen and only topped reservoir. No other shop said anything and charge for flush/bleed
Took me three days to get rear bleeders out and replace them with new OEM bleeders. But we suspected the caliper are weeping on cold mornings. The piston must be pitted. I say this because moisture build up in system brake fluid is very damaging and this one the rears fluid when I flushed look very very bad. This is not the very first out which look even muddier. Bad stuff!
We were seeing very long run time of booster motor, from non stop to 45 seconds at best. The improve times were with use. Brake control wire was corroded. Also we got the screeching with bubbles in reservoir a few time for just a moment. Also peddle fade while stopped.
I was willing to work on and replace part by part of booster assembly, to see effect of each and keep cost down. Owner Brain, elected to just have me install new OEM booster assembly in one shot (good choices). I also installed a new master plunger/seals kit while I had master out, flushed the system and bleed.
Pre booster assembly (includes accumulator, pump, motor and wire) R&R. I noticed it took 39 or more pumps of peddle to evacuate accumulator. After R&R, it only took 22 pumps. I've notice the higher the mileage/age the more I'm pumping peddle. Most HM in the low 30's. In my low mileage rigs, I'm in the mid to upper 20 pumps. These longer peddle pump times, is a clue of health of accumulator and seals IMHO.
Brake peddle fads is also clue of weeps and seals.
After R&R of booster assemble motor was whisper quiet, with only 22 pumps of peddle to evacuate and time to charge was constant at 32 seconds. Beautiful right.
Well it's back, my first come back OUCH! As OAT (outside air temps) drops to the below ~18 F. The pump will not stop running, that's bad. Under 25F the alarms will come on briefly when first starting out a drive during cold mornings.
I went up to Toyota Dealership and spoke with a Master Diagnostician of more than 20 years. He's been very helpful over the years. He's the guy, when I ask hard question in the shop, others always walk me over to..
He said the cold morning intermittent alarms are very common in the winter cold. They see it all the time. He said it's the old seal shrinkage with age, then more in the cold. As we work the brakes the seals heat and expanded then alarms go off as pressure come up
But any alarm, we should stop driving and investigate. If we loose all pressure, we loose brakes for the most part. Number on reason we loose pressure is booster motor failure. Number two is loose of brake fluid from a bad leak.
So our issue of alarms is likely just the calipers and or master plunger need rebuilding with new kit and piston or replaced.
But we've one more issue of non stop on booster motor on very cold morning. No amount of using brake gets the motor to stop. WHY?
Well we don't know. I suspect the old weak pressure switch can't handle the high pressure the new booster assemble is delivering. The system even with just a new motor brake control wire, may spin faster than old increase pressure more than old switch can handle.
I'm waiting on a used switch to install now, as a test. If it stops motors excessive run times during very cold temp. Will know. If not I'll need to R&R calipers to further give switch a fair test and get new switch. Brian is being patient with me. He'd just assume I put all new and be done with it. I'm trying to save him money. But he's losing use time. I'll not charge him for any addition time I spent on master. After switch and caliper, if still any issue, it will be the Master/ABS assembly I'll be R&R. We'll likely replace all six the flexible brake line with SS braided before where done and all caliper.
In Brains' rig, we know brake fluid and age did a lot of damage. The rusty brake control wire, I'm sure damage the motor. It may also have damage the ABS unit power comes through. I've been told we have addition pressure switch inside the ABS unit which makes senses. The current flow with corroded wires high resistance, may also effect the electrics relays in the ABS, IDK. The bad brake fluid will damage it and the master cylinder. We've some evidence now, it damages pump and accumulator. Piston there is no doubt bad fluid pits them, I see that all the time.
Bottom line at Dealerships, this is number one reason they just replace the whole unit. Their customer pay the a lot of money and only know one thing. Either it works or it does not. They do not get into this at stuff at all. It as all or non deal. They not going to chase it.
Toyota give use very little info on the master/ABS unit. So were on are own. They will not sell us two components separably, the of Master/ABS unit except plunger. I'm beginning to understand why!
Number one guys, keep fluid flushed and never overfill. Keep those bleed caps on and in good condition. Check run time of booster motor now and then. Excessive run time, will greatly reduce life of motor. Motor failure is our main concern.
By the time we're done these brakes on Brian's rig will be spot on, peddle will be hard as a rock with the use of just one toe to stop on a dime. Just like the Unicorn was, one of my restore projects.
But this not a Land Cruiser issues of defective brake IMHO. It the case with all aged and neglected brake system.
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Awesome write up
2001LC
SILVER Star
Thanks!
I've a lot to learn. It's really trial and error, along with tearing down the old master assemblies people are sending me, that is slow revealing some clues. Clues to how to predict failures and best to approach. But I've a long way to go.
I've a lot to learn. It's really trial and error, along with tearing down the old master assemblies people are sending me, that is slow revealing some clues. Clues to how to predict failures and best to approach. But I've a long way to go.
Great info. Excellent to have your explanation.
Are you saying that all of the seals and ABS module are repairable?
Just based on your experience...if fluid is leaking from the entire master cylinder/abs unit...is there a fix or are the internals still a “no go” for repair? Or is that generally from the reservoir grommets?
I guess I’m asking having never torn apart the ABS unit unit, only dealt with accumulator, pump, brake lines, etc.
2001LC
SILVER Star
The seal within ABS unit are not available. That said I have bust one apart. The only seal I recall or saw was around front plate and a seal plate in-between IIRC. None are sold by Toyota
Most leak at master is from over filling. It comes out the cap and grommets in bottom of reservoir. Almost nobody reads the topping instruction on reservoir.
Other leak I've seen is pump. That happens when vent to motor clogged. Motor then such form passage to seal in back of pump.
We can fix some:
O-ring at bottom of accumulator could leak. So could O-ring at pressure switch in front.
Mast cylinder leak, leaks into boot near pedal/foot. That one we can get a kit.
I am done chasing with mine.
Noise alarm today startup when it was about 25F outside. I just put in a new accumulator and o-ring, stem, and spring 2 weeks ago. Did a full bleed as well.
One year ago, I put in a rebuilt booster motor, and now a accumulator and oring. I've got about $900 into this now and quite frustrated. Brakes feel really nice and firm, but this ABS alarm and the same C1252, C1223, C1256 codes are making me hate my 02 LX with 172k miles on it. Rebuilt calipers were put on at 142k by PO. What an ongoing PITA.
Noise alarm today startup when it was about 25F outside. I just put in a new accumulator and o-ring, stem, and spring 2 weeks ago. Did a full bleed as well.
One year ago, I put in a rebuilt booster motor, and now a accumulator and oring. I've got about $900 into this now and quite frustrated. Brakes feel really nice and firm, but this ABS alarm and the same C1252, C1223, C1256 codes are making me hate my 02 LX with 172k miles on it. Rebuilt calipers were put on at 142k by PO. What an ongoing PITA.
2001LC
SILVER Star
I'm working on one of these now. Works great until temp drops to 15 F. I'm may have a big revelation, something very big and so cool if I'm right. But I'll not post yet, I need more testing.
@hickuptruck if you'd like to talk PM with phone #, I'll call you.
@hickuptruck if you'd like to talk PM with phone #, I'll call you.
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I know this will sound dumb...but can someone please explain the pressure test by depressing the brake pedal 40 times? I’ve tried it a couple times now but the pedal depresses the same distance every pump and doesn’t go any lower even when pumping 50-60 times. I do hear a “whooshing” sound though that sounds like air being either pushed through the cylinders or being pushed out of something. Not sure if that’s normal.
2001LC
SILVER Star
IG key OFF?
