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Poll: header or orig exhaust manifold for '78 40

Discussion in '40- & 55-Series Tech' started by Fast Eddy, Aug 14, 2006.

Manifold or Header

  1. Original exhaust manifold

    19 vote(s)
    43.2%
  2. Smog-legal header

    25 vote(s)
    56.8%
  1. Fast Eddy

    Fast Eddy

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    I'm going up against the CA smog man next year. My current 3x2 (ancient) header has sprung a couple substantial leaks at the head that I think are due to the flange warping, and I don't think will be fixed by a new gasket, so I'm accelerating a repair that I was going to put off.

    I have an original '78 exhaust manifold that's rusty, but complete. It is a giant heavy beast, but I think with a sand blast it will clean up ok.

    The alternative is new a smog-legal header. Not as original, but it will save me at least 50 lbs off the front axle.

    My truck is very original, including paint. I'm leaning towards the original manifold. It should be cheaper as well.

    Edt: I have a nice stock carb that will be heading out to JimC for some massaging. It has a craptastic Holley on it now that likes to dump gas into the engine when you hit a bump going uphill.

    Thoughts?
     
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2006
  2. F-junker

    F-junker

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    I stayed with the manifold, just make sure you have the downpipe or collector. It's hard to find. I like headers, but they are loud and generate alot of heat, did I mention they are loud? There are some performance gains but I think they are nominal. I want a quiet ride with the top off, afterall the tires are going to be loud enough! Good luck.

    Also remember these can be more expensive to refurb than buying a header, there are machining costs (an absolute neccessity) for flatness of the manifolds and gaskets and rings and spacers at each end where the manifolds all connect together. sometimes your money ahead with a cheap header.
     
  3. CruiserMax

    CruiserMax

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    I don't have a California 78 truck. My 1978 FJ40 has been desmogged but I too was in need of either a header or a stock manifold. I was also getting my carb rebuilt by Jim C at the time as well. After talking to both Jim and a friend who is a Master Totoyta mechanic(and cruiser owner) I decided to go with the Totoata manifold. I am glad I did. I think the header route became one of those fashionable "upgrades" that many really did not need to do. One of the well known cruiser vendor catalogs listed a header system and used flowery language like "seat of you pants power" etc. I have read reports by guys whose opinions I trust and it seems like headers really don't produce noticeable power gains. They are noisier. They produce more heat and rust faster. A good used manifold can be machined quite cheaply and if installed correctly will serve you well. I think it also makes good sense in the state of Kalifornia where pollution laws are constantly changing...

    Max
     
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2006
  4. Ian Rogers

    Ian Rogers

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    the stock manifold is so low flow its stupid
     
  5. Fast Eddy

    Fast Eddy

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    Where'd you get it? I posted to your thread on the wanted board about the ring. I'd need both, unless my muffler guy can get or make the pipe. To you think it's the same as any other Toyotas? There are ton's of celicas etc at the junkyard, but few trucks.


    I like the sound I have now. It's a true dual exhaust with two glass packs on each pipe. I don't think it's that loud.
     
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2006
  6. Fast Eddy

    Fast Eddy

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    Max, When you redid your manifold, did you use two gaskets and a heat riser insulator #12 where the intake and exhaust connect? There are two gaskets #8 and a thin sheetmetal piece #12 with a couple holes between them. The insulator I have is bad, the CA version is discontinued and new Fed ones are $50. :eek: I'd be tempted to either leave it out, or fabricate one out of sheetmetal. SOR offers one for $31 on the link below that's non-us. It is solid; no holes.

    Where'd you get the downpipe and bolt-on retainer?

    Luckily I have the #78 bracket. $67. Ouch.

    http://www.sor.com/sor/cat044.tam?c...&lpt=1155604716&xax=13250&page.ctx=cat044.tam

    [​IMG]
     
  7. Fast Eddy

    Fast Eddy

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    That's true of the whole engine though...
     
  8. Josie'sLandCruiser

    Josie'sLandCruiser Stop calling it a "FJ."

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    Hi All:

    Like everything in life, exhaust components are a compromise! ;)

    The 2F in my FJ40 has a "header" on it courtesy of the infamous P.O. The "header" seems to work well, but is loud and *hot* which is fine b/c I don't have a top or doors on it during the warmer months of the year. I don't like how loud it it is but lets' face it - the whole rig is loud! :grinpimp:

    I think that the stock exhaust manifolds run quieter and cooler than the "headers" do, but they are also known for crackinging sometimes, and needing maching before instalation.

    Honestly, either will work fine on your rig, but each requires a compromise in one direction or other.

    Good luck on your rig! Sorry my advice is so unhelpful! :D

    Regards,

    Alan
     
  9. Cruzerman

    Cruzerman

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    Seems to me if your rig needs to be smogged by the smog nazis, then go oem. Gives them one less thing to hassle you about.
     
  10. Tunnelratt

    Tunnelratt

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    i live in So Cal, Sorry, I dont have a 78, I run a 75/40 with a 76 engine, so I am smog exempt, was in the same boat as you, mine has the humongus thermo nuclear reactor for an exaust manifold, it cracked, decided to do the entire de-smog thing, installed a header as I didnt want to hunt for the correct manifold, let alone try to get it back in the engine bay, it's a bit on the loud side when you are up to speed on the freeway, on the trail it's pretty mellow,I run a 2 1/2" magnaflow, no seat of the pants change in performance until I swapped out the dizzy to a correctly rebuilt Vac Advance unit with a pertronix. If you are totally stock, keep it that way, the header was a pain to mate up, the stocker will be as well, and you still have to play with the smog police, by the way, I still kept all the smog stuff, just in case. My 2c:cool:
     
  11. Hangtowncruzr

    Hangtowncruzr

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    One thing to consider is if you ever decide to do a SOA the header collector sits almost exactly where the shackle through the frame bolt is located.
     
  12. bsevans

    bsevans Focus on the Journey

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    I have to go through emissions testing here in Tucson yearly. After my trials and tribulations of leakage due to the warpage of my exhaust manifold which warped again after being resurfaced (intake & the 3 piece exhaust at one time) I gave up on the factory exhaust and put a set of street legal tuned ceramic coated headers from MAF in. There was an obvious performance improvement, especially in the upper RPM's. It pulls hills on the freeway 5-10mph faster than with the stock setup. The other tripping point for me was the fact that the heat riser system is a very poor design and will eventually stop funtioning on most FJ's causing an overheating of the intake manifold that leads to cracking. I had to have my intake rewelded on both sides of the bowl.

    The vehicle just went through emissions with readings of 68 out of 250 allowed for hydrocarbons and .10 out of 2.00 allowed for Carbon Monoxide. The inspectors only cared about the fact that the number 6 header pipe was connected to the EGR box (FJ60 EGR pipe) making it emission legal.

    The ceramic coating does an excellent job of passing the heat out the tail pipe reducing the buildup of heat in the engine compartment. Here in the southwest, I expect it will last for a number of years, however no steel header will last as long as a cast iron exhaust manifold.
     
  13. CruiserMax

    CruiserMax

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    I got lucky in that the manifolds I used came as a really great mated pair. They were in good condition and were super straight. I used a long metal straight edge with a tiny flashlight behind it to make sure that the manifolds did not need any machine work. So far so good: no problems. Prior to this set of manifolds I had been wrestling with a burned out heat riser. I guess all of this is easier with the Federal model as apposed to the California model.

    Good luck!

    Max
     
  14. Fast Eddy

    Fast Eddy

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    Is that true of all of AZ? I thought that over 25 years old was exempt? I've been saving my address in Surprise (W. Phoenix) as a backup potential registration if I had trouble here in CA. Maybe not, eh?
     
  15. bsevans

    bsevans Focus on the Journey

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    Just in the Pima County (Tucson) & Maricopa County (metro Phoenix) area.
     
  16. IDave

    IDave

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    Just putting in my thought!
     
  17. F-junker

    F-junker

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    Eddy,
    You asked me where I go the collector above. I finally found a saint way up north (Artic circle north) who sent me one, I had to have it welded up to fit a regular pipe as it is a double walled pipe (one inside another) for heat shielding I guess. I couldn't find a replacement anywhere. SOR etc etc. Exhaust shops here looked at me like I was from another planet. If you can't find one in good shape then do yourself a favor and get a good quality header and higher quality gasket. The factory stuff is great if you've got all of it, if not go buy a header. good Luck
     
  18. lobo loco

    lobo loco

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    Header or stock

    I have the Downey smog legal chrome header on my 78 CA FJ40. No hassel with the smog Nazi's if you have the CARB exemption sticker. The original sticker was in pretty bad shape after the repaint, so I called Downey and they sent me a new one. Really good folks!!

    Yeah, it's a bit louder than stock, but it sounds good and motor runs great with it. Have 2.5 inch pipes and a Flowmaster muffler...If there was anything I'd want to change it's the muffler. It's plenty tuff, but loud. Had people ask me what kinda motor my truck had...When I told them it was the stock 2F, they seemed suprised...thought it was a hot V8!! :eek: Probably will put a Magnaflow on but have other things that need attention sooner. I'd got with the header again if I need a new one. My $.02...:cheers:
     
  19. gpx433

    gpx433 SILVER Star

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    My 78 had a header on it when I bought it -brand unknown. Reason it was put on was because the butterfly valve in exhaust under the carb stuck closed, cracked the manifold, and fried the carb. I live in Montana so heat from exhaust is a good thing in the winter. Loud? My work truck and DD is a '02 2500 Dodge Cummins HO with a 4" straight exhaust:D. I find the Land Cruiser kind of quiet.

    On a rig that has already seen modification I would go with a header. But if it is an all original, putt it down main street on a Sunday afernoon type rig go OEM.

    Of course I don't have to deal with the emissions crap so unfamiliar with those requirements.

    Josh
     
  20. Fast Eddy

    Fast Eddy

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    I just bought mine from SOR. An '80s fj60 downpipe is the right bolt pattern, but it turns out towards the frame. My muffler shop cut it off very short and welded it up. They seemed to think they could find a flange and weld up a collector for me, but I beat them to it.
     
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