Hi folks, I usually buy my cars private party but I found a good one at a dealer. Downside is I have to support a dealer, and of course they won't fib on the bill of sale. What I'm wondering is, is there anything 'more' I can get - in terms of getting maintenance items fixed, mismatched tires, windshield chips and things like that - since it's a Toyota dealer? I don't anticipate much bargaining power cause even now the 100 series is selling pretty well. Just wondering.
On buying an LX from a Toyota dealer...
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These days I feel like all the dealers do the whole “low price no negotiate guarantee “ bs. But I have heard of people having them basically pay the tax and dmv fees included in the sale price.
Your other items you listed (maybe minus tires) would be good as well.
I would start aggressive with offering less than asking. If they don’t bite then go the other routes.
Your other items you listed (maybe minus tires) would be good as well.
I would start aggressive with offering less than asking. If they don’t bite then go the other routes.
Everything is negotiable. However prepare to walk away. Any car lot or dealership wants the highest profit with the least amount of work out any vehicle they are selling, the longer it sits in their lot the more money they are losing everyday. I would say know your comparables and start from there.
$0.02 from a car dealer:
If you like the car after seeing it, checking it out and test driving it, just buy it.
Tax season is near, auction prices are stupid high and available inventory is still low.
You can try and get something from them like a windshield if cracked, or if something is wrong and they prefer discounting some instead of dealing with the repair, but if you get too deep into the dealer’s profits, they won’t have a problem letting you pass, specially if you’re going to buy cash, no incentive in cash purchase for a dealership when replacement availability is low. They have to keep rolling units for a healthy cash flow, but they have to consider profits as well.
Also, never understood the idea that “everything is negotiable” when dealing with cars, and we still pay whatever price we get asked for when we go buy a sweatshop built electronic, or clothing.. do we go to Lacoste to negotiate their price because the shirt was made in Peru? When was the last time you asked for a discount when you bought a $800!phone that costs $25 to make?
Sorry for the little rant..
Online advertising made almost impossible for dealers to make money on the front, they HAVE to compensate on the finance and aftermarket products sales.
As mentioned, don’t think there isn’t another guy waiting in line for the car. If you like it, and seems a good deal in your eyes, don’t think for too long. If the defects make it a headache more than an enjoyable experience, just keep looking for the right one.
Now I’m going to hide under a chair and wait for it..
If you like the car after seeing it, checking it out and test driving it, just buy it.
Tax season is near, auction prices are stupid high and available inventory is still low.
You can try and get something from them like a windshield if cracked, or if something is wrong and they prefer discounting some instead of dealing with the repair, but if you get too deep into the dealer’s profits, they won’t have a problem letting you pass, specially if you’re going to buy cash, no incentive in cash purchase for a dealership when replacement availability is low. They have to keep rolling units for a healthy cash flow, but they have to consider profits as well.
Also, never understood the idea that “everything is negotiable” when dealing with cars, and we still pay whatever price we get asked for when we go buy a sweatshop built electronic, or clothing.. do we go to Lacoste to negotiate their price because the shirt was made in Peru? When was the last time you asked for a discount when you bought a $800!phone that costs $25 to make?
Sorry for the little rant..
Online advertising made almost impossible for dealers to make money on the front, they HAVE to compensate on the finance and aftermarket products sales.
As mentioned, don’t think there isn’t another guy waiting in line for the car. If you like it, and seems a good deal in your eyes, don’t think for too long. If the defects make it a headache more than an enjoyable experience, just keep looking for the right one.
Now I’m going to hide under a chair and wait for it..
Thanks for the good advice. It's true for Toyota/Lexus or other popular brands. But negotiation may still work for Alfa Romeo, Mitsubishi, Buick etc.
You can't get mad at the customer for playing the game when the dealer created the game. And, that game has gotten out of hand recently - Broncos, 'Vettes and other "rare" vehicles with massive "Market Value Suggested Price" stickers (dealer addendums), then the pandemic supply issues took that to a whole new level.
Window etching, service plans, (maintenance, dings, paint protection, interior protection) warranties... anything to bake in more profit. I get it. The internet made it easy to see the cost of cars. Granted, not all buyers see the loaded cost, e.g., PDI, shipping, etc. But the info is out there.
Used cars are even worse. We have NO idea what a dealer paid. Arguably, it's not any of our business. But if Dealer A "stole" a car on a trade and dealer B overpaid at an auction, how much room there is in that price is only discovered by negotiating... back to playing by the rules that the dealers (long ago) set forth.
This.
Yep - know what its worth, then add the little bit of dealer premium and then if thats still in what its worth to you...bite.
And then ten years will pass, and youll have enjoyed it and can maybe sell it for hardly any less than you bought it for....a grand or two up front will be insignificant.
And then ten years will pass, and youll have enjoyed it and can maybe sell it for hardly any less than you bought it for....a grand or two up front will be insignificant.
Is this a 100 Series with 150,000 miles but needs the TB service, and is otherwise in great shape? What would I do? It's simple math really. Figure out what that truck is worth or what you're willing to pay for in its current state - and assume you're going to spend $2,000 the next day. The full timing belt service should be every bit of $1,500. Assume the techs will find $500 worth of "while we've got it apart" items.
But, a 100 that's 60,000 miles past the TB service should be looked at HARD. That owner hasn't really be on top of things.
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On new cars, where MSRPs are just a made up number that no one is following, like those you mentioned, or the new LX600 for example, it's all about supply and demand. There was a situation where money kept flowing and supply was "supposedly" choked, and that situation created a bubble, either real or manufactured, that allowed dealerships to charge whatever they wanted for the product regardless of the suggested price.
Regarding the optional products, all are optional and they're given to you as a customer to choose if you need them or not. All those products will make the finance amount higher, meaning that the higher bank's finance charge will benefit the dealership some, and also will have some kickback to the dealer as profit, which will eventually even out a flat sale, so a dealer can advertise lower and still survive. If a person signed a contract without looking at it, then it's on them.
I've been a finance manager for 12 yrs and finance director at a big dealer for 6, and I still get F&^% every time my wife takes me to rooms to go for a new couch!
I never dealt with new cars, I'm not a 'corporate" type, so my business is used only. And yes, we USED to make a killing, before the smart phone became mainstream.
We pay a pretty penny on systems that allow us to price a vehicle based on local and national market values, before the car is bought we know what price we should ask for it to be competitive in the market, either if at auction or as a trade in, AND you can't blame a business that tries it's best to make a bigger profit. So if we "steal" a car in trade, we still going to publish it at a competitive price and try to get that difference as profit.
What business isn't trying to reduce material cost to increase profit of finished product??
BUT.. to OP, since this car is sold by a Toyota franchise dealer, and it's an OLD car (we look at it as new to us, but anything with over 5 years on the road is considered old and 10 yrs is Very old) probably it was a trade in, and you can check that fact either by asking the sales rep, if he has a clue, or search for yourself with the vin number through your state's data (easy in FL, not sure elsewhere). Carfax sometimes publishes if this car was an auction sale too..
IF it was a trade in, you might be able to lower their initial asking price a bit since they just want to move it to close the initial deal it was traded in for, that's if it didn't receive too many inquiries from different customers. IF it's a hot car, forget it, they'll wait for the one that will pay in full.
If it was an auction car, that means THAT specific Toyota dealership is Very short in inventory to be looking at 15yo cars, and they won't play your game so much..
If it doesn't have a record of a timing belt done recently, I'm guessing that's your question since without timing belt it won't start..
I'd consider it a baseline. You're buying a very used car, base lining is priority if you want it to last, and I'd prefer to do it myself while checking for other items that might need refreshing, than giving it to a dealership that's looking to cut corners on expenses just to stick a sticker on the filter box.
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- #13
Alright re: timing belt/baselining, noted. Just add a couple thou to the price.
So the truck I'm looking at is in the dealer's service department, I had a salesman go and take some pictures. It looks like when he turned the car on the AHC 'OFF' light on the dash lights up. He said he didn't press any buttons - does this for sure mean that either someone got rid of the AHC or that there's something broken? Or does AHC stay off after you turn the car off? Also of note: dash glass is busted - maybe someone was trying to open up the dash to get rid of some lights? Doesn't bode well!
Anyone know what's going on under the glove compartment?
I asked him to check under the hood for a timing belt sticker, but that's pending, and no timing belt service shows up in the carfax, so we'll see. It's weird cause otherwise it looks like there's a decent service record both before and after it was sold as a CPO.
Really annoying that the Lexus drivers' website no longer works - can't add VINs to look up Lexus' internal service history.
So the truck I'm looking at is in the dealer's service department, I had a salesman go and take some pictures. It looks like when he turned the car on the AHC 'OFF' light on the dash lights up. He said he didn't press any buttons - does this for sure mean that either someone got rid of the AHC or that there's something broken? Or does AHC stay off after you turn the car off? Also of note: dash glass is busted - maybe someone was trying to open up the dash to get rid of some lights? Doesn't bode well!
Anyone know what's going on under the glove compartment?
I asked him to check under the hood for a timing belt sticker, but that's pending, and no timing belt service shows up in the carfax, so we'll see. It's weird cause otherwise it looks like there's a decent service record both before and after it was sold as a CPO.
Really annoying that the Lexus drivers' website no longer works - can't add VINs to look up Lexus' internal service history.
That must be an expensive '06/'07 LX with that low mileage and non-beige leather and probably rust-free in NorCal 
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- #15
Ha, is non-biege preferred? I like biege, matches my LS430.That must be an expensive '06/'07 LX with that low mileage and non-beige leather and probably rust-free in NorCal
Are you too far away to go see it in person? The inside looks clean besides that mess on the cluster. The right side kick panel houses a bunch of electronics, including door locks, alarm, audio and some immobilizer systems if not mistaken. It's a pain to deal with water intrusion in that panel, guess how I know..
Sorry, can't help with AHC since I have an LC with conventional suspension and I’m not really familiar with the system..
Sorry, can't help with AHC since I have an LC with conventional suspension and I’m not really familiar with the system..
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Seats look in great shape. Almost too good for 150k miles.
Once the AHC has been turned off it stays off through an ignition off / on cycle. The light will go off when you push the button on the console again. A flashing AHC light indicates a problem. This is explained in the owner manual if you can get your hands on it.
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