Most simple diesel engine
- Thread starter LAMBCRUSHER
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Crushers, I see what you're getting at. Driving a 1HZ @ 100kmph gives similar fuel economy to driving a 1HD-* at 120kmph. Impressive.
not mine which it's part time and manual ..
it's an HDJ80 that came with A442F and HF1A t-case .. which I keept with my actual H150 tranny ..
Tapage, just out of curiosity, and because it's relevant to the thread, how many kms are you at now, with your 2H?
Half a million is already quite good. I've seen lots of 2Hs and 12HTs that never made it that far.
Half a million is already quite good. I've seen lots of 2Hs and 12HTs that never made it that far.
you want a simple/reliable engine in the US get an engine you can get parts for anywhere in the US.
Cummings 4bt (needs an SOA or 6+ inches of lift)
isuzu 4bt1t or 2 (needs a 4" lift)
both are industurial engines, you'll get 300+k between rebuilds easily if you take proper care of them.
I have to say that the million mile OM167 engines may a little more rare than MB advertises, at least when it comes to the factory turbo motors.
I was looking at the OM617.xxx, i can't remember the code for the turbo motor, so went to a few junk yards to look at varoious 300D's.
What i found was a little dis heartening. Out of the 5-7 i looked at all were under 250,000 miles. Almost all of them were blowing large amounts of oil out of the charge pipe and lall of them had lots of oil built up on the intake fins of the turbo.
If these were truely million mile engines they either had the leakiest turbos i've ever seen or the engines were truely on their last leg.
on at least 2 of the engines the turbo was locked down.
all of these were in various junk yards around the southeast.
The NA OM617 may be a better engine, but from what i seen of the turbo motor i was not impressed.
I could find very little info on getting more HP out of the om617. For the price of an LKQ pick a part i wouldn't have minded rebuilding one. However i don't think this engine would be a good choice for a wagon.
i did no compression tests on any of these engines. The large amounts of oil in the charge pipe/intake prevented me from wanting to go any further.
Cummings 4bt (needs an SOA or 6+ inches of lift)
isuzu 4bt1t or 2 (needs a 4" lift)
both are industurial engines, you'll get 300+k between rebuilds easily if you take proper care of them.
I have to say that the million mile OM167 engines may a little more rare than MB advertises, at least when it comes to the factory turbo motors.
I was looking at the OM617.xxx, i can't remember the code for the turbo motor, so went to a few junk yards to look at varoious 300D's.
What i found was a little dis heartening. Out of the 5-7 i looked at all were under 250,000 miles. Almost all of them were blowing large amounts of oil out of the charge pipe and lall of them had lots of oil built up on the intake fins of the turbo.
If these were truely million mile engines they either had the leakiest turbos i've ever seen or the engines were truely on their last leg.
on at least 2 of the engines the turbo was locked down.
all of these were in various junk yards around the southeast.
The NA OM617 may be a better engine, but from what i seen of the turbo motor i was not impressed.
I could find very little info on getting more HP out of the om617. For the price of an LKQ pick a part i wouldn't have minded rebuilding one. However i don't think this engine would be a good choice for a wagon.
i did no compression tests on any of these engines. The large amounts of oil in the charge pipe/intake prevented me from wanting to go any further.
remember, you were looking at the junkyard. god knows what sort of care they got before getting there. the 617s do generally last 500,000 between major service, and the 603 (vast design improvements over the 617) are a real nice runner. for a donor, i would be looking for a high mile unit that is still on the road, as opposed to a dead one in the scrapyard. more power?
i don't think that one will last 500,000 miles...
i never said that they were commonplace, just that they exist.
i don't think that one will last 500,000 miles...
i never said that they were commonplace, just that they exist.
I heard that engine blew up very early on. Just internet rumour though. You're talking thousands just for the injector pump mods if you want more than a little increase from those, seems the factory injector pump has little head-room over stock.
these vehicles still had good bodies and fairly good overall interiors. I'm in the upstate of S.Car, not along the beach or anywhere near salted roads.
They were in the junk yard because of mechanical issues.
I would think that if everyone of these engines lived up to their reputation they would not have been junked because of engine issues.
Again, i'm not saying that all OM617's are bad but i found a rather large amount of their turbo variants in the junk yard well before they hit the 500,000 mile marker.
what does nice interior and no rust have to do with anything? maybe they had it detailed often enough but how long between oil changes? or timing chain? or valve train adjustment? or injector service? if you have an engine with nailing injectors, worn out timing chain, and valve lash out of whack, it's not going to last very long. lots of owners think these are "lifetime" items, if you don't mind the lifetime being less than 250,000 miles.
like i said, much of longevity (of any engine) depends on pm and driving habits. just because you found seven dead units at the junkyard doesn't offer a lot of evidence towards their lack of longevity is all i'm saying. the scrapyard back in bc had about a half-dozen fried fj40's, does that mean the 2f engine is crap? (the last 2f i had lasted about 230,000 miles)
and that vid i posted was an over-the-top example. i wouldn't be surprised if they spent $5,000+ to get it to do that. speed is just a question of money, how fast do you want to go? in reality a guy can usually get about a 25hp increase with stock items and a bit of adjusting to the wastegate system and the alda (boost/altitude compensator), and not have it be a time bomb. they are a good engine, and parts availability/price are of little issue here in the us being the biggest advantage.
It says a lot about their usual lifespan. Sure you can baby an engine to a very long life, but that's not normal or even realistic. Engine makers talk about 10% and 20% failure rates. Basically how many miles before 10 or 20% of the engines have failed. These numbers mean a whole lot more than finding the 1% that made 500,000, the 0.1% that made 750k and the 0.01% that made 1000k.
I'd say 5 times your estimate.
Some more photos here: Custom Parts
your in BC, the rust belt. You guys salt the road for more than 6 months out of the year. I'd imagine most vehicles in your area see the junk yards because of rust than any other reason. It would be silly to assume that any car with age in any rust belt junk yard is in there because of a bad engine. Many of your cars simply do not live long enough to wear out higher milage engines.
I live in a part of the south with no road salt, no sea salt and we tend to drive vehicles until they drive no more. If you find a vehicle in our junk yards you will maybe only find on in twenty to thirty that are in there because of rust and usually it's a car from the ocean or up north. Most of the vehicles in our scrap yards are from accidents or major mechanical damage.
no body damage at all noticable on any of the MB turbo diesels i inspected. From the looks of the paint/interior i'd say it's a safe bet to say half of them were were well taken care of and still met the same fate.
all of them between 130k and none over 250K.
go through those same junk yards and i'm sure you'll find plenty of SBC (4.3, 5.0, 5.7) and they will almost all have over 200K and proably saw half the maintience of the MB's. I don't usually look to GM for reliability but the same chevy engines are all in vehicles that are toatled out, not because they were mechanicaly cost prohibitive to repair. Granted more than a few were cash for clunker cars.
MB, an engine i'd tinker with if i got one for next to nothing.
If you got one and rebuilt it, taking care of it yourself, it will probably live a long time.
To go to a junk yard and get one that god only knows what its seen...i'd do a compression/leak down test first.
From what i've seen of them they did not last a lonng time in a passenger vehicle, how well would it last putting it in an oversized land cruiser and beating it up on the hwy or off road?
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indeed they might not be quite enough for a landcruiser/prado, but a hilux or 4rubber on the other hand...
all i'm saying is that the reputation of the om617 and 603 engines isn't entirely urban legend, much like the 3b it's not unusual to get 500,000 out of them. benz made a damn good product up until about 1990. another thing to consider is how many 603 engines fell victim to the trap oxidizer (head cracking, turbo damge, and general oil-puking catastrophic failure), but i'm not sure if you were looking exclusively at 617 units. the 603 was introduced in '86, if i remember correctly.
all i'm saying is that the reputation of the om617 and 603 engines isn't entirely urban legend, much like the 3b it's not unusual to get 500,000 out of them. benz made a damn good product up until about 1990. another thing to consider is how many 603 engines fell victim to the trap oxidizer (head cracking, turbo damge, and general oil-puking catastrophic failure), but i'm not sure if you were looking exclusively at 617 units. the 603 was introduced in '86, if i remember correctly.
i was only looking at the tubo om617 I think 87 or 89 was the latest year i looked at.
this was the only MB engine i could find an adapter to match it up to a SBC tranny.
this was the only MB engine i could find an adapter to match it up to a SBC tranny.
well, according to Dougal, it is rare to see any IDI make 500,000 ...
so it is probably rare to see a Benz to see the same.
many of us that work on the Land Cruisers in Canada know that most of the IDI owners do not baby their engines, they are used, abused and still see them turn 500K. it seems also that the ones in South America are also ... enjoyed ... to their full extent and return high mileage before a rebuild or retirement.
sadly, experience means little to those that have no experience nor the ability to gain the experience.
so it is probably rare to see a Benz to see the same.
many of us that work on the Land Cruisers in Canada know that most of the IDI owners do not baby their engines, they are used, abused and still see them turn 500K. it seems also that the ones in South America are also ... enjoyed ... to their full extent and return high mileage before a rebuild or retirement.
sadly, experience means little to those that have no experience nor the ability to gain the experience.
i don't consider regular scheduled service "babying", but i'm stupid like that.
I'm always looking on ebay for 2Hs and OM617s, and saw an example of each that made it past 600,000km.
And my 2H is going to reach 1,000,000km.
But it'll take a few decades. Changing the oil and filter every 3000-4000km, I'm convinced it'll succeed.