modify family car or buy a dedicated car for off roading?

[ducktapeguy]

finally managed to persuade my wife to let me trim the front bumper after she busted it on her first off road excursion. the current plan is to cut it off and if we do not like it we will buy the cbi bumper.

is there anything i should be aware of when trimming the front bumper?

You're going to lose some rigidity on the front bumper when you trim it because you'll have to lose the front brackets that mount to the cross beam. Other than that I haven't had an issue.

I've got a new DV8 front bumper for a GX if you're interested. Bought it a few years ago and never installed it

 

[GXO]

High level advice: If you want to do those things, I would do what you are planning. Take a course. Get a lift and tires. Sliders and skids. Go wheel.

That isn't a new SUV and I think a lot of folks find wheeling a GX as "beating on it" but I have wheeled my 2003 since 2010 and it has done just fine and been a GREAT project truck and opened up my whole world by starting GXOR.

When you go in on something, do it right. If you dedicate the rig to wheeling it will become a project you will likely not drive much and sell. Daily wheelers get the most attention and the most urgency because you need them every day. I still think Toyota products don't leak much when you use them more.

Road noise? Get an AT or RT tire and you are fine.

If ride matters get a better suspension than entry level. If you aren't touching $3000 on the lift you are in the entry level arena.

The rest is up to you. The more stuff you put on top and inside the more you have to do underneath. Gears, armor, spring rates, etc all change as you need more space.

I'd say just have fun! Enjoy your ride. Go explore. Keep up on maintenance. Welcome to GXOR!

 

[captainva]

High level advice: If you want to do those things, I would do what you are planning. Take a course. Get a lift and tires. Sliders and skids. Go wheel.

That isn't a new SUV and I think a lot of folks find wheeling a GX as "beating on it" but I have wheeled my 2003 since 2010 and it has done just fine and been a GREAT project truck and opened up my whole world by starting GXOR.

When you go in on something, do it right. If you dedicate the rig to wheeling it will become a project you will likely not drive much and sell. Daily wheelers get the most attention and the most urgency because you need them every day. I still think Toyota products don't leak much when you use them more.

Road noise? Get an AT or RT tire and you are fine.

If ride matters get a better suspension than entry level. If you aren't touching $3000 on the lift you are in the entry level arena.

The rest is up to you. The more stuff you put on top and inside the more you have to do underneath. Gears, armor, spring rates, etc all change as you need more space.

I'd say just have fun! Enjoy your ride. Go explore. Keep up on maintenance. Welcome to GXOR!

This is really great advice

 

[r2m]

High level advice: If you want to do those things, I would do what you are planning. Take a course. Get a lift and tires. Sliders and skids. Go wheel.

That isn't a new SUV and I think a lot of folks find wheeling a GX as "beating on it" but I have wheeled my 2003 since 2010 and it has done just fine and been a GREAT project truck and opened up my whole world by starting GXOR.

When you go in on something, do it right. If you dedicate the rig to wheeling it will become a project you will likely not drive much and sell. Daily wheelers get the most attention and the most urgency because you need them every day. I still think Toyota products don't leak much when you use them more.

Road noise? Get an AT or RT tire and you are fine.

If ride matters get a better suspension than entry level. If you aren't touching $3000 on the lift you are in the entry level arena.

The rest is up to you. The more stuff you put on top and inside the more you have to do underneath. Gears, armor, spring rates, etc all change as you need more space.

I'd say just have fun! Enjoy your ride. Go explore. Keep up on maintenance. Welcome to GXOR!

Agreed with GXO.
Also, with a dedicated off roader, when push comes to shove, the budget is tight, guess what goes first.
If you have a well built daily driver (like mine), you shouldn't ever have to be hit by that question, of what do I get rid of first.
As GXO said, off roading a GX does not necessarily mean "beating on it". My wife and I go wheeling all the time and belong to an off road club, but I don't beat up my rig. Yeah, I can do severe rock crawling with my front & rear lockers, all my armor and suspension, but all that functionality and armor is more for worst case scenario/emergencies. I don't purposely go looking for trails to flog my rig.
I don't mind some brush "pin striping" from trails but draw the line at buckling body panels.
My wife and I truly enjoy the performance, ride, comfort, handling and all the capabilities I've built into it and want to keep it that way.

Also, again, agree with GXO about tires, I usually would get BFG M/T's which were some of the most quiet mud terrains one can get, but at about half wear, they do get noisy. Now I've opted for BFG A/T's. They're much quieter (and will stay that way through their life span) and better for most conditions.

 

[GXO]

Agreed with GXO.
Also, with a dedicated off roader, when push comes to shove, the budget is tight, guess what goes first.
If you have a well built daily driver (like mine), you shouldn't ever have to be hit by that question, of what do I get rid of first.
As GXO said, off roading a GX does not necessarily mean "beating on it". My wife go wheeling all the time and belong to an off road club, but I don't beat up my rig. Yeah, I can do severe rock crawling with my front & rear lockers, all my armor and suspension, but all that functionality and armor is more for worst case scenario/emergencies. I don't purposely go looking for trails to flog my rig.
I don't mind some brush "pin striping" from trails but draw the line at buckling body panels.
My wife and I truly enjoy the performance, ride, comfort, handling and all the capabilities I've built into it and want to keep it that way.

Also, again, agree with GXO about tires, I usually would get BFG M/T's which were some of the most quiet mud terrains one can get, but at about half wear, they do get noisy. Now I've opted for BFG A/T's. They're much quieter (and will stay that way through their life span) and better for most conditions.

I just came here to say you have a great perspective haha

 

[ypyun]

bumper trim:

in the front of the bumper i made the cut on the bottom of the tape below. if you look closely you will see a faint line.

after cutting the bumper you will need to unbolt the lower bumper supports.

my wife hit the bumper hard enough to break part of one of these supports.

view after the bumper has been cut and unbolted. at this point you have to trim the mud guards that hang down in front of the wheels.

i used zip ties to secure the mud guards to the aluminum bumper.

 

[ypyun]

bumper trim: end result

 

[ypyun]

status report:

• no increase in wind noise that i can discern
• front bumper height is now 16 9/16 inches which makes the approach angle ~24.7° = tan⁻¹(16.5625/36)
• it gives the gx a more angular look which i like

 

[r2m]

status report:

• no increase in wind noise that i can discern
• front bumper height is now 16 9/16 inches which makes the approach angle ~24.7° = tan⁻¹(16.5625/36)
• it gives the gx a more angular look which i like

Now she's look'n like a trail rig!

 

[ypyun]

i did not touch the front bumper at all in the recent trip to death valley and mojave preserve. i'd recommend trimming the bumper first and see how you like it before buying a bumper.

by far the most difficult trail i did recently was mail spring to sagamore canyon in the mojave preserve new york mountains. in retrospect i should have done more research before exploring a random mining road. in addition to knowing the road was sketchy i would have known that there are some ruins to checkout.

here is a picture going down watson wash.

my wife complained about the suspension when going over moderate size rocks when driving up butte valley. she said the ride was "jaring." my son loved the bumpy ride and kept saying bumpy (he is 2). to my surprise he fell asleep a lot easier on this road than when we are on tarmac. as a result i'm looking into upgrading the suspension. my main motivation is to improve the ride.

my next project is removing the 3rd row. i'm leaning towards buying an off the shelf product instead of creating my own out of plywood.

questions:

1) for suspension i'm considering ims dobinsons, kings, or radflo. are kings and radflo worth 2-3x the cost? do they increase performance by 2-3x? how often do kings and radflo need to be rebuilt (i've heard 10k some places and 50k others)?

3) goose gear, american adventure lab, and air down gear up all make platforms for the 3rd row. goose gear looks overpriced for some plywood. does anyone have any experience with the other platforms? my motivation is to get more space i do not want drawers or a sleep system.

 

[r2m]

i did not touch the front bumper at all in the recent trip to death valley and mojave preserve. i'd recommend trimming the bumper first and see how you like it before buying a bumper.

by far the most difficult trail i did recently was mail spring to sagamore canyon in the mojave preserve new york mountains. in retrospect i should have done more research before exploring a random mining road. in addition to knowing the road was sketchy i would have known that there are some ruins to checkout.

here is a picture going down watson wash.

View attachment 3204037

my wife complained about the suspension when going over moderate size rocks when driving up butte valley. she said the ride was "jaring." my son loved the bumpy ride and kept saying bumpy (he is 2). to my surprise he fell asleep a lot easier on this road than when we are on tarmac. as a result i'm looking into upgrading the suspension. my main motivation is to improve the ride.

my next project is removing the 3rd row. i'm leaning towards buying an off the shelf product instead of creating my own out of plywood.

questions:

1) for suspension i'm considering ims dobinsons, kings, or radflo. are kings and radflo worth 2-3x the cost? do they increase performance by 2-3x? how often do kings and radflo need to be rebuilt (i've heard 10k some places and 50k others)?

3) goose gear, american adventure lab, and air down gear up all make platforms for the 3rd row. goose gear looks overpriced for some plywood. does anyone have any experience with the other platforms? my motivation is to get more space i do not want drawers or a sleep system.

Pretty much any suspension that increases your travel will be a huge improvement for your wife.
My guess is all that jarring your wife didn't like was a result of hitting bump stops and not having enough travel, especially looking at how stuffed your drivers rear tire is.
Great pic!

 

[GrizzlyClint]

my wife complained about the suspension when going over moderate size rocks when driving up butte valley. she said the ride was "jaring." my son loved the bumpy ride and kept saying bumpy (he is 2)

Forget what the wife thinks, the 2 year old is what matters.

 

[Rednexus]

Regarding the bumpy ride, what tire psi did you run? Off-road comfort is affected by tire pressure more than anything else (including fancy shocks/suspension). If you're up higher than say 25 psi I'd expect the ride to be pretty rough.

 

[ypyun]

> Regarding the bumpy ride, what tire psi did you run?
i think it was between 22 to 24 that day

 

[Rednexus]

Might want to try dropping it more. I run as low as 15 psi on really rough stuff, albeit on a 17" rim.

 

[Banandalorian]

What do you consider "moderate sized rocks" and how fast were you going? Tire pressure and OEM bumpstops are definitely a factor, but I also find when KDSS is in stiff mode it can feel pretty rough. We have a lot of "15mph" trails/sections out here where I still cruise along at 10 and get left behind because its so much more comfortable.

I have a Dr. KDSS controller sitting in my garage for this reason. I also have a set of Dobinson MRAs, bumpstops, UCAs, etc sitting out there. I should probably find time to install these things.

 

[ypyun]

> What do you consider "moderate sized rocks"
most of the rocks where about the size of a softball (<8inch) with some kids size soccer balls (>8inch) interspersed. the road was recently graded which kicked up a bunch of rocks.

> how fast were you going?
pretty sure i was going over 10mph most of the time. i was in 4H the entire time.

> Might want to try dropping it more.
under 20psi i start worrying about my tire pinching. unfortunately i do not have a picture. i'll try to remember to take one the next time i air down.

 

[Rednexus]

You'll always be fighting rough ride at 22-24 psi and short-sidewall tires (looks you're on 18s or 20s). I've ran 15 psi, with 4 ply 265/70R17 Wildpeaks, on lots of rocky trails, and have not pinch flatted. I run 18 psi when the trails aren't super-rocky and when I know I'll be getting up to 35 mph or so on groomed sections.

I'd suggest 17" wheels to gain sidewall, so you can run at lower PSIs and have a smoother ride off-road. You could either do it now on stock suspension and run 32's or wait until you lift and run 33's to gain even more sidewall and comfort.

 

[captainva]

18 psi is considered safe for stock wheels. I wouldn't go below 15psi but I've never had a problem at 15.

 

[r2m]

PSI, tire ratio (e.g. 60, 65, 70, 75, 80 series) and type of tire (e.g. A/T, M/T, side wall ply's, etc.), vehicle weight and terrain all impact how low you can air down.
There is not any one optimal pressure setting that can be used on all tires.
Generally a shorter side wall (40, 50, etc. series) tire, you won't be able air down very much.
The higher/taller side walls, and depending upon how many ply's and type of material the ply's are made of, and if your tire is a "light truck" rating, you should be able to air down to a much lesser pressure.
Rock crawlers can usually air down to sub 10 psi without bead locks. With bead locks, as low as 5 psi.

To recap about airing down.
Have as small diameter rim, for our GX's that'll be 17", AND as narrow as possible rim, like 8" - 8.5". ALL off roaders (who know anything about off roading) do this. A narrower rim will keep your tire from blowing off the rim lip when you air down.
A smaller rim, as mentioned above will allow a much larger side wall. A larger side wall is like having an extra long travel shock. It gives more cushion travel, hence a smother ride.
A "small truck" tire will have a much stiffer side wall and be able to air down to at least 12 psi. (Ask how I know...)
Depending upon how many ply's and what material (Kevlar, polyester, etc.) there are in your side walls, that too will impact how little pressure you can run.

So with all due respect to all the people posting what PSI to run, please consider what I've posted.
Here's a reference: The Best Tire Air Pressure for Off-Roading | Inside Line - https://www.drivingline.com/articles/the-best-tire-air-pressure-for-off-roading-inside-line/