LX570-Tire type/size/ride and overall useablity recommendations

[Heckraiser]

I was disappointed with the ride/handling of my 285/75r18 (35x11) Nittos and found the LX likes a wider than stock tire (for the larger diameters). 35x12.5 solved all my issues except mpg, lol. LX is a big heavy rig (2 humans heavier than an LC200), I would not step down the width. Just my two cents, I know others like skinny tires.

 

[cubaniche]

I was disappointed with the ride/handling of my 285/75r18 (35x11) Nittos and found the LX likes a wider than stock tire (for the larger diameters). 35x12.5 solved all my issues except mpg, lol. LX is a big heavy rig (2 humans heavier than an LC200), I would not step down the width. Just my two cents, I know others like skinny tires.

Thanks for the input and sharing your experience. Im happy to hear some sort of confirmation that a wider tire will positively impact driving experience. I wouldn't be stepping down in width, I'd be going up from the skinny 35s Kendas I have now. These are a 10.50 section width, with an actual tread width of about 8.5-9 inches. Stock is around 11.2. Going from these skinny 35s to a 285/75r17 id be stwpping down In height by about 1in but increasing width by about 1 inch, bringing me back to what oem width is.

 

[TeCKis300]

Ive been running Kenda Klever RTs in theb35x10.50r17 size on multiple rigs (gx470/460) without issues. Awesome tire. When I got my 14 LX 2 years ago, I was exited to install these too. So I did, on icon vector 5 wheels which have +25 offset. However, they never been as trouble-free as they were on the two other rigs. I get vibration at higher speeds around 70, and slightly uneven tire wear. Ive had them road forced several times and each time they've needed minimal balancing with low force numbers, which is supposed to be a good sign. Suspension components that matter have all been replaced with oem parts. Ive had it aligned twice, with the second time confirming the first realignment after the tires were installed, was good and no real changes were needed. I suspect that the variable geometry changes that happen at speed as the vehicle rates and lowers itself is impacting wear on these tires. Also, being that they are almost a full inch narrower than stock, maybe thats also affecting ride quality/handling. Im experiencing symptoms that others with wider tires aren't. The combined weight of these kendas and the icons are roughly 98lbs at each corner, which is about 21-24lbs more per corner vs stock.

My new goal is to try and achieve a bigger tires vs stock but maintain close to stock width. Also dropping down to an AT from the RT. Looking at going with the Toyo Open Country AT3s in 285/75r17 LT/C. These should be just shy of an inch shorter than the Kendas, which are actually 34.7 in tall uninstalled, and be wider by almost a full inch bringing me back in line with the stock 11.3 wide 285/55r20s. Im hoping the small drop in height and wider footprint will alleviate some of the symptoms. One thing I've always experienced after moving to the narrower kendas is traction control activating when slowing down to turn onto a street (during the actual cornering, it will activate for a split second). It also does this off road when a tire drops into a dip at slow speeds (under 8 mph). The kendas are a D load range whereas the Toyos are a C. The LX suspension settings are also less evident on the Kendas vs the stock wheel/tire combo.

Im disappointed that my experience with these doesnt match up with my previous experience on the other rigs. My conclusion is that what is making the difference here is the LX is much heavier and has hydraulic suspension vs the lighter 04 GX and newer 460 I had these tires on. Both had upgraded suspensions (470 was on Dobinsons MRR with heavy springs in the rear and 460 was on Dobinsons IMS with medium springs all around). As mentioned in the beginning of the post, the LX has new lca/uca's, front oem 10mm strut spacer, rear 20mm spring spacers, ee offroad shock height relocation spacer, drkdss panhard correction, and max sensor lift all around. All of that should technically have the AHC happy and close to stock pressures.

Nice writeup and its always useful when there is context and symptoms to walk through.

I would attribute most of your symptoms down to two things. Offset combined with narrows. I know +25 is something that most say works but for someone that's more aggressive in their use cases and more perceptive, the symptoms you describe like traction control kicking in and uneven wear will show.

Probably not a surprise but I've been an opponent of narrows. This platform at its weight level needs proper footprint for braking and cornering. Aggressive R/Ts further compromise contact area with its more aggressive voids. Ride quality suffers with higher pressure requirements and squared shoulders especially in R/Ts that typically have 3-ply sidewalls.

Using a wide fitment with proper offset, my 37 RTs ride like butter. The family nods off on extended roadtrips at 90mph as a proper cruiser should.

I like where you're headed. As you have an LX, don't hesitate to consider wider still like a LT295/70R17 or LT305/70R17.

 

[grinchy]

I don’t think there is much science saying an appropriate alignment and functional suspension would wear correctly inflated tires of different widths and brands and tread profiles differently.

Tire wear is an inflation or suspension or both issue. Wider tires won’t solve inflation or geometry issues. Narrower tires won’t solve inflation or geometry issues.

 

[PhilipJPhry]

Nice writeup and its always useful when there is context and symptoms to walk through.

I would attribute most of your symptoms down to two things. Offset combined with narrows. I know +25 is something that most say works but for someone that's more aggressive in their use cases and more perceptive, the symptoms you describe like traction control kicking in and uneven wear will show.

Probably not a surprise but I've been an opponent of narrows. This platform at its weight level needs proper footprint for braking and cornering. Aggressive R/Ts further compromise contact area with its more aggressive voids. Ride quality suffers with higher pressure requirements and squared shoulders especially in R/Ts that typically have 3-ply sidewalls.

Using a wide fitment with proper offset, my 37 RTs ride like butter. The family nods off on extended roadtrips at 90mph as a proper cruiser should.

I like where you're headed. As you have an LX, don't hesitate to consider wider still like a LT295/70R17 or LT305/70R17.

Just curious - at what tire height did you think it was worth it to do a re-gear? I'm currently debating between a 33.4" (275/70-18) and a 34.3" (295/70-18) tire.

 

[riffman12]

Probably not a surprise but I've been an opponent of narrows. This platform at its weight level needs proper footprint for braking and cornering. Aggressive R/Ts further compromise contact area with its more aggressive voids. Ride quality suffers with higher pressure requirements and squared shoulders especially in R/Ts that typically have 3-ply sidewalls.

What's the narrowest tire you've run on your LX? I only ask because my only two data points are the OEM 20" 285 tire size, and my more recent LT275/70R18s

Ride is obviously a bit a harsher going from a street tire to an LT all terrain, but I wouldn't say I've felt any difference in stability or performance.

 

[TeCKis300]

I don’t think there is much science saying an appropriate alignment and functional suspension would wear correctly inflated tires of different widths and brands and tread profiles differently.

Tire wear is an inflation or suspension or both issue. Wider tires won’t solve inflation or geometry issues. Narrower tires won’t solve inflation or geometry issues.

Appreciate the counterpoint. Maybe the discussion is worthwhile.

Scrub radius is a direct result of offset which is integral to geometry. To its namesake, it implies tires scrubbing (breaking traction) with aggressive offsets.

Traction issues especially when cornering become more pointed when combining narrows, aggressive offsets, and off-road focused tires.

You're right that wider tires won't solve geometry issues (which is why I call out offset as one of the root issue), but it will help increase the margin of useful traction versus a narrow that inherently gives up handling traction.

What's the narrowest tire you've run on your LX? I only ask because my only two data points are the OEM 20" 285 tire size, and my more recent LT275/70R18s

Ride is obviously a bit a harsher going from a street tire to an LT all terrain, but I wouldn't say I've felt any difference in stability or performance.

The goal in my builds is for all around performance. Gaining off-road performance while maintaining as much on-road goodness as possible. 275s is going down from stock width, and giving up on-road cornering and braking traction. So are A/T tires relative to stock highway tires. YMMV but for those that drive aggressively, wider tires will help compensate for losses elsewhere.

No knock on those that like 275s for their use case, but it shouldn't be a surprise that narrows give up handling performance (all else being equal like tire type and compound). My other hobby is sports cars and track days where I've been through tons of cars and wheel/tire setups. Yes, I have run narrower track tires but in race compounds which can work great. These topics are fundamental to any vehicle. Off-road, these things may not matter much driving slow over some rocks or fire roads, but in aggressive driving off-road Baja style, good fundamentals will also show through.

 

[highfructose]

I’ve got Kenda 35x10.5r17’s on 15et. Seems to ride fine

Ive been running Kenda Klever RTs in theb35x10.50r17 size on multiple rigs (gx470/460) without issues. Awesome tire. When I got my 14 LX 2 years ago, I was exited to install these too. So I did, on icon vector 5 wheels which have +25 offset. However, they never been as trouble-free as they were on the two other rigs. I get vibration at higher speeds around 70, and slightly uneven tire wear. Ive had them road forced several times and each time they've needed minimal balancing with low force numbers, which is supposed to be a good sign. Suspension components that matter have all been replaced with oem parts. Ive had it aligned twice, with the second time confirming the first realignment after the tires were installed, was good and no real changes were needed. I suspect that the variable geometry changes that happen at speed as the vehicle rates and lowers itself is impacting wear on these tires. Also, being that they are almost a full inch narrower than stock, maybe thats also affecting ride quality/handling. Im experiencing symptoms that others with wider tires aren't. The combined weight of these kendas and the icons are roughly 98lbs at each corner, which is about 21-24lbs more per corner vs stock.

My new goal is to try and achieve a bigger tires vs stock but maintain close to stock width. Also dropping down to an AT from the RT. Looking at going with the Toyo Open Country AT3s in 285/75r17 LT/C. These should be just shy of an inch shorter than the Kendas, which are actually 34.7 in tall uninstalled, and be wider by almost a full inch bringing me back in line with the stock 11.3 wide 285/55r20s. Im hoping the small drop in height and wider footprint will alleviate some of the symptoms. One thing I've always experienced after moving to the narrower kendas is traction control activating when slowing down to turn onto a street (during the actual cornering, it will activate for a split second). It also does this off road when a tire drops into a dip at slow speeds (under 8 mph). The kendas are a D load range whereas the Toyos are a C. The LX suspension settings are also less evident on the Kendas vs the stock wheel/tire combo.

Im disappointed that my experience with these doesnt match up with my previous experience on the other rigs. My conclusion is that what is making the difference here is the LX is much heavier and has hydraulic suspension vs the lighter 04 GX and newer 460 I had these tires on. Both had upgraded suspensions (470 was on Dobinsons MRR with heavy springs in the rear and 460 was on Dobinsons IMS with medium springs all around). As mentioned in the beginning of the post, the LX has new lca/uca's, front oem 10mm strut spacer, rear 20mm spring spacers, ee offroad shock height relocation spacer, drkdss panhard correction, and max sensor lift all around. All of that should technically have the AHC happy and close to stock pressures.

I’ve got these kenda’s on 28 lb wheels at 15et. Haven’t really had any issues to speak of. I run 35 lbs of pressure and my vehicle is relatively heavy w bumpers, sliders, recovery gear, tools, stuff on roof, etc
I did put some 80 series coils in the back to help with the extra weight. I don’t have much of a sensor lift anymore…hard to say since I’ve messed w them so much.

The tires seem relatively supple, all things considered…I don’t have handling issues..,I plan to go to Toyo at3 load c 285 75 17’s mostly so I don’t have to monkey with a spare that won’t fit like the 35’s originally were (a slightly worn spare fits under the car but a new one won’t)…but also because I think they’ll be even more supple/quiet on the road.

They did take a lot of weight to balance…maybe you got a bad tire or two? Kendas are inexpensive enough that I bet they pump out lemons here and there.

 

[cubaniche]

I don’t think there is much science saying an appropriate alignment and functional suspension would wear correctly inflated tires of different widths and brands and tread profiles differently.

Tire wear is an inflation or suspension or both issue. Wider tires won’t solve inflation or geometry issues. Narrower tires won’t solve inflation or geometry issues.

I think the narrower tires are making the suspension work harder/differently, coupled with the max sensor lift. Air pressures are around 38 psi which for the current state of my rig, shows a nice flat line on a chalk test. I will run 42 psi in the rear when towing my boat/trailer. The issues im experiencing, the most evident one is the vibration over 65-70 mph. Its not violent, but its there. Its not driveline as ive checked everything, greased everything, and even mounted a gopro on different occasions at differ3nt angles to see if I could catch something bouncing, out of round, etc. Didn't see anything alarming. So that leaves the tires and maybe how the suspension is reacting to them.

I’ve got Kenda 35x10.5r17’s on 15et. Seems to ride fine

I’ve got these kenda’s on 28 lb wheels at 15et. Haven’t really had any issues to speak of. I run 35 lbs of pressure and my vehicle is relatively heavy w bumpers, sliders, recovery gear, tools, stuff on roof, etc
I did put some 80 series coils in the back to help with the extra weight. I don’t have much of a sensor lift anymore…hard to say since I’ve messed w them so much.

The tires seem relatively supple, all things considered…I don’t have handling issues..,I plan to go to Toyo at3 load c 285 75 17’s mostly so I don’t have to monkey with a spare that won’t fit like the 35’s originally were (a slightly worn spare fits under the car but a new one won’t)…but also because I think they’ll be even more supple/quiet on the road.

They did take a lot of weight to balance…maybe you got a bad tire or two? Kendas are inexpensive enough that I bet they pump out lemons here and there.

Tha ks foenthe feedback. Like I said, these tires saved me well, were not uncomfortable at all, on the two previous rigs. They felt totally fine. No vibrations etc. I did have one replaced under warranty that would not balance out, on the LX two years ago when I got them installed (just after purchasing the LX). The only conclusion I can come to is that these skinnies on this rig just dont mesh like they did on the previous two. Withbthat said, you also have to consider that we each have different definitions on whats acceptable, whats "plush" etc. Having experienced the tires on two other rigs, I know what I was expecting vs what I'm actually experiencing, and it doesnt match. Again, only conclusion I can come to is the difference in size of the vehicles and weight plus different suspension characteristics. Oh, globes are all new as well as fresh fluid as of a year and half ago.

Nice writeup and its always useful when there is context and symptoms to walk through.

I would attribute most of your symptoms down to two things. Offset combined with narrows. I know +25 is something that most say works but for someone that's more aggressive in their use cases and more perceptive, the symptoms you describe like traction control kicking in and uneven wear will show.

Probably not a surprise but I've been an opponent of narrows. This platform at its weight level needs proper footprint for braking and cornering. Aggressive R/Ts further compromise contact area with its more aggressive voids. Ride quality suffers with higher pressure requirements and squared shoulders especially in R/Ts that typically have 3-ply sidewalls.

Using a wide fitment with proper offset, my 37 RTs ride like butter. The family nods off on extended roadtrips at 90mph as a proper cruiser should.

I like where you're headed. As you have an LX, don't hesitate to consider wider still like a LT295/70R17 or LT305/70R17.

Thanks for the info! I used to track cars as well. Don't get to much anymore though I still have fun cars to play with in the streets (TTV6 making 550whp and built turbo 4 cylinder making 400whp). I k ow how much tires can affect handling in that scenario. Just wasnt expecting the LX to be as sensitive as it is to tire/wheels combo vs the 470.and 460 which didnt seem to care on the aftermarket suspension I had on those.

Ill back up and say, I dont consider the vibrations I feel to be invasive. Id classify it as "probably expected due to the sensor lift and tire/wheels combo changes". No one else in the car feels them except for me, and it annoys me lol
Another thing is, I do drive more on the aggressive side (cant fully delete those go-fast instincts, even in this heavy pig lol). Its why I supercharged it and regarded to 4.30s. Going to a shorter tire is two fold for me: trying to reduce rotational mass and higher forces of that mass on the suspension, as well as maybe hopefully gain a tiny bit of better handling and less unsprung weight.

 

[Heckraiser]

Just curious - at what tire height did you think it was worth it to do a re-gear? I'm currently debating between a 33.4" (275/70-18) and a 34.3" (295/70-18) tire.

I know that question was addressed to @TeCKis300 , but my two cents, either of those sizes would be OK with stock gears, especially being at sea level and not in the mountains. In general, my recommendation is to get the tire you like and drive around for a while and decide for yourself whether the re-gear is worth it. Tires are a reversable choice, gears less so. For me, I actually liked stock gears and 35's for street/highway driving better than 4.88's, but the 4.88's definitely helped off road.

 

[TeCKis300]

I think the narrower tires are making the suspension work harder/differently, coupled with the max sensor lift. Air pressures are around 38 psi which for the current state of my rig, shows a nice flat line on a chalk test. I will run 42 psi in the rear when towing my boat/trailer. The issues im experiencing, the most evident one is the vibration over 65-70 mph. Its not violent, but its there. Its not driveline as ive checked everything, greased everything, and even mounted a gopro on different occasions at differ3nt angles to see if I could catch something bouncing, out of round, etc. Didn't see anything alarming. So that leaves the tires and maybe how the suspension is reacting to them.

Tha ks foenthe feedback. Like I said, these tires saved me well, were not uncomfortable at all, on the two previous rigs. They felt totally fine. No vibrations etc. I did have one replaced under warranty that would not balance out, on the LX two years ago when I got them installed (just after purchasing the LX). The only conclusion I can come to is that these skinnies on this rig just dont mesh like they did on the previous two. Withbthat said, you also have to consider that we each have different definitions on whats acceptable, whats "plush" etc. Having experienced the tires on two other rigs, I know what I was expecting vs what I'm actually experiencing, and it doesnt match. Again, only conclusion I can come to is the difference in size of the vehicles and weight plus different suspension characteristics. Oh, globes are all new as well as fresh fluid as of a year and half ago.

Thanks for the info! I used to track cars as well. Don't get to much anymore though I still have fun cars to play with in the streets (TTV6 making 550whp and built turbo 4 cylinder making 400whp). I k ow how much tires can affect handling in that scenario. Just wasnt expecting the LX to be as sensitive as it is to tire/wheels combo vs the 470.and 460 which didnt seem to care on the aftermarket suspension I had on those.

Ill back up and say, I dont consider the vibrations I feel to be invasive. Id classify it as "probably expected due to the sensor lift and tire/wheels combo changes". No one else in the car feels them except for me, and it annoys me lol
Another thing is, I do drive more on the aggressive side (cant fully delete those go-fast instincts, even in this heavy pig lol). Its why I supercharged it and regarded to 4.30s. Going to a shorter tire is two fold for me: trying to reduce rotational mass and higher forces of that mass on the suspension, as well as maybe hopefully gain a tiny bit of better handling and less unsprung weight.

To be clear, I don't think the vibration is from any geometry, tire size, or suspension. I was addressing of the other dynamics.

I assume you rotated the tires. Does the nature of the vibration change with that?

What year is your LX? There was TSB for vibration in some of the earlier model years

F

Thread 'TSB for steering wheel vibration - LC & LX differences'

May 22, 2014

Hello everyone,
I recently purchased a used 2008 LC (US) and am very happy with this vehicle. During my research, I pulled all the Technical Service Bulletins (TSBs) to make sure I had any issues covered/understood. So here's my situation: I have a minor steering wheel vibration between 1700-2100 RPM, exactly as described in TSB 0071-09. My LC has 49,000 miles and is over 5 years old, so I'm out of warranty and would have to purchase the repair parts out of pocket. The repair consists of replacing the transfer case (around $2500 USD) and some other more minor parts, such as adding...

• Fisher112
• Replies: 14
• Forum: 200-Series Cruisers

 

[cubaniche]

To be clear, I don't think the vibration is from any geometry, tire size, or suspension. I was addressing of the other dynamics.

I assume you rotated the tires. Does the nature of the vibration change with that?

What year is your LX? There was TSB for vibration in some of the earlier model years

F

Thread 'TSB for steering wheel vibration - LC & LX differences'

May 22, 2014

Hello everyone,
I recently purchased a used 2008 LC (US) and am very happy with this vehicle. During my research, I pulled all the Technical Service Bulletins (TSBs) to make sure I had any issues covered/understood. So here's my situation: I have a minor steering wheel vibration between 1700-2100 RPM, exactly as described in TSB 0071-09. My LC has 49,000 miles and is over 5 years old, so I'm out of warranty and would have to purchase the repair parts out of pocket. The repair consists of replacing the transfer case (around $2500 USD) and some other more minor parts, such as adding...

• Fisher112
• Replies: 14
• Forum: 200-Series Cruisers

It's a 2014MY and currently has 130k on the odo. It does have the teaser dynamic damper installed. I dont k ow if VGRS could have anything to do with the vibration. Maybe steering tick, although the bushings looked totally fine. Yes I've had them rotated 4 times now in the two years they've been installed (its not a daily so it sees little mileage). This is why I mentioned in my original post that I've had them roadforced 3 times. Twice by discount where I had them installed and once at a trusted and well regarded local off road shop that specializes on Toyotas/Lexus, and is also where I get my alignments done. The off road shop didnt find anything wrong. They balanced out well according to them and one of the kendas didn't even need any balancing as it balanced out completely fine as-is. Discount also told me the same thing for that one tire.

I did see a slight change in the vibration lessening on the second balancing at discount. It wasn't as bad for sure. I still feel it both in the cab (slight vibration feel in the seat) as well as in the steering wheel at those speeds. It didn't seem to change much after each rotation. I was hoping to feel the vibration maybe move around, by getting worse or better, and that I could pinpoint one of the tires as being the culprit. Though that didnt happen. The fact that it happens above a certain speed and doesnt change under acceleration or when coasting, usually means its tire or even suspension related. I cant pinpoint any driveline issues (with all the new parts, and proper alignment) I'm left with the tires somehow being at fault. The LCAs really needed to be replaced, the bushings were almost completely separated and had a ton of slop. The uppers seemed fine but I said to hell with it and replaced those too just to try and eliminate variables. Maybe Im complaining about something thats ao small no one else would bother to bring it up lol

I was looking at the newr Wildpeak AT4Ws as lots of reviews talk about how their tread width actually matches their section width amd are a bit taller than the same size in another brand due to them also having more tread depth from new. However, there seems to be a lot of complaints on the larger sizes about balancing issues. The open country's don't seem to have many reports of that.

 

[riffman12]

The goal in my builds is for all around performance. Gaining off-road performance while maintaining as much on-road goodness as possible. 275s is going down from stock width, and giving up on-road cornering and braking traction. So are A/T tires relative to stock highway tires. YMMV but for those that drive aggressively, wider tires will help compensate for losses elsewhere.

No knock on those that like 275s for their use case, but it shouldn't be a surprise that narrows give up handling performance (all else being equal like tire type and compound). My other hobby is sports cars and track days where I've been through tons of cars and wheel/tire setups. Yes, I have run narrower track tires but in race compounds which can work great. These topics are fundamental to any vehicle. Off-road, these things may not matter much driving slow over some rocks or fire roads, but in aggressive driving off-road Baja style, good fundamentals will also show through.

yeah but have you actually run narrower tires on the LX and noticed a loss in performance? Or if you're just assuming that given your experience from road / track tires?

I'm not trying to take a jab at you. I just only have those two data points so I'm curious. Everything out there is anecdotal and everyone's own setup is always going to feel "the best" because it's familiar.

I've done quite a bit of track driving as well, and tire compound, contact patch, and weight were always the big factors. Meaty tires are great until the unsprung weight kind of negates any gains from a bigger contact patch. There's certainly a goldilocks zone. With my current LX build I really wanted to prioritize reducing weight so the skinnier tire saved me a few lbs.

 

[TeCKis300]

yeah I was just wondering if you have actually run narrower tires on the LX and noticed a loss in performance. Or if you're just assuming that given your experience from road / track tires.

Assumption okay, but I prefer it as an educated guess.

 

[cubaniche]

yeah but have you actually run narrower tires on the LX and noticed a loss in performance? Or if you're just assuming that given your experience from road / track tires?

I'm not trying to take a jab at you. I just only have those two data points so I'm curious. Everything out there is anecdotal and everyone's own setup is always going to feel "the best" because it's familiar.

I've done quite a bit of track driving as well, and tire compound, contact patch, and weight were always the big factors. Meaty tires are great until the unsprung weight kind of negates any gains from a bigger contact patch. There's certainly a goldilocks zone. With my current LX build I really wanted to prioritize reducing weight so the skinnier tire saved me a few lbs.

Im right there with ya. Thats one of the reasons I want to step down to a 285/75r17. These kendas RTs are 69 lbs all on their own. With the wheels Im at about 98 lbs at each corner. Id be shedding 38lbs give or take, of unsprung weight by making that move to the Toyos in that size. I also dont have bumpers, full armor etc. Its got a rack and sliders. No real need for D load rated tires. An AT in C load rating with a slightly wider footprint should be perfectly fine and I think ride and handle nicer.

 

[grinchy]

Nothing wrong with trying to reduce rotational weight.

 

[TeCKis300]

yeah but have you actually run narrower tires on the LX and noticed a loss in performance? Or if you're just assuming that given your experience from road / track tires?

I'm not trying to take a jab at you. I just only have those two data points so I'm curious. Everything out there is anecdotal and everyone's own setup is always going to feel "the best" because it's familiar.

I've done quite a bit of track driving as well, and tire compound, contact patch, and weight were always the big factors. Meaty tires are great until the unsprung weight kind of negates any gains from a bigger contact patch. There's certainly a goldilocks zone. With my current LX build I really wanted to prioritize reducing weight so the skinnier tire saved me a few lbs.

Not taken that way so speak freely. I'm all for saving weight and have run sub 18lb Superleggeras on my track car with sticky compound narrows. That was the ticket for a fast agile sportscar.

Back to this thread which is talking overall recommendations.

275s to your point may be completely adequate. This thread is about getting into the nitty gritty to understand trades.

In broad generalization, 275 will ride firmer, give up some handling, both important factors arguably worse than the OEM size. For a bit more clearance and probably MPG efficiency (though any A/T tire will have worse rolling resistance than the stock H/T tire)

We may have different priorities and use cases and that's fine.

Where I'm coming from as enthusiasts generally run A/T and R/T tires where compound and tread pattern are not helping for on tarmac traction. With a heavy vehicle and heavy overlanding weights, there are more limited dials to turn and biasing towards narrows isn't generally turning the knob in a compensating manner. More relevant for off-roaders, floatation can be a very significant factor and again where narrows give up some performance.

If someone is not actually using their vehicle in off-road use cases, all this is giving up a lot. Running heavy 3-ply R/Ts on a rig that is not seeing rocks doesn't make much sense. What most are describing as "feeling" of a heavy tire is honestly lost gearing rather than rotational mass.

That's not to say weight doesn't matter. From another perspective, I'm running 37x12.5R18 3-ply E-rated R/Ts. Wheel and tire set weighs in at 104 lbs.

Not far from the 98lbs for 35" narrows on 17s.

+6 lbs for a considerably larger tire that performs on-road, off-road, strong flotation, traction, and ride comfort. There is more tradespace out there.

 

[grinchy]

Most folks are not going to run a 37” tire. The list of modifications to get to a 37 is long. It is not a near stock fitment. We’re talking like 5-10 total lx570s in the world run this size.

I contend that a 265 wide tire is not a narrow. It is only narrow in the context of a 315. A 2009 911 Carrera Coupe had 265 rear tires. Other more aggressive 911s in that year came with 305s. A Nissan GTR comes with 285s. My Lx stock had 285s.

People should absolutely run what they want. I will remain skeptical that there are significant on road handling or traction benefits for a wide tire with the very high profile tires we’re using and the available braking and power/weight constraints of a 6000+ lb SUV with a high COG. Further, and I think several nearly scientific recent youtube reviews confirm, there isn’t much in it off-road either. Horses for courses kind of thing.

My purely anecdotal report from 265s, 275s, and 285s is they all handle just great. And the same. I’m just as fast and agile as any other freeway and most speedy mountain road traffic.

The main reason I run a ‘narrow’ size is they are dead easy to fit.

 

[TeCKis300]

Just curious - at what tire height did you think it was worth it to do a re-gear? I'm currently debating between a 33.4" (275/70-18) and a 34.3" (295/70-18) tire.

Missed this. I'd say this largely depends on how heavy your rig is and how much performance you expect when laden. I ran a 33.2" overall diameter tire (305/55R20) for a while towing an 8k trailer. It did well enough but shift points aren't as refined and sometimes short, but I'd say a 33.4" tire is generally okay without re-gear.

A 34.3" tire will be outside of the transmissions tuning and you'll find it in the wrong gear, bad shift points, especially on grade, elevation, and with loads. Sure it can work, but we're often drawn to the 200-series because its so well dialed in from the factory, and once you know what good is, it's hard to be compromised.

Most folks are not going to run a 37” tire. The list of modifications to get to a 37 is long. It is not a near stock fitment. We’re talking like 5-10 total lx570s in the world run this size.

I contend that a 265 wide tire is not a narrow. It is only narrow in the context of a 315. A 2009 911 Carrera Coupe had 265 rear tires. Other more aggressive 911s in that year came with 305s. A Nissan GTR comes with 285s. My Lx stock had 285s.

People should absolutely run what they want. I will remain skeptical that there are significant on road handling or traction benefits for a wide tire with the very high profile tires we’re using and the available braking and power/weight constraints of a 6000+ lb SUV with a high COG. Further, and I think several nearly scientific recent youtube reviews confirm, there isn’t much in it off-road either. Horses for courses kind of thing.

My purely anecdotal report from 265s, 275s, and 285s is they all handle just great. And the same. I’m just as fast and agile as any other freeway and most speedy mountain road traffic.

The main reason I run a ‘narrow’ size is they are dead easy to fit.

Sorry, I was not implying that people should run 37s. Just pointing out how close weights can be even if trying for lighter combo in a narrow fitment.

Absolutely, run what you want. This thread is to dig deeper and tease out the trades. I'm not looking to be right but to unpack the trades. Just because they all handle great, or adequate for someone's use, doesn't mean there aren't differences - there surely are.

I'll be the first to admit I'm a sucker for performance and the differences stand out to me. Big performance is what excites me and big tires are what deliver on that.

315s on both 4WDs here.

 

[PhilipJPhry]

Missed this. I'd say this largely depends on how heavy your rig is and how much performance you expect when laden. I ran a 33.2" overall diameter tire (305/55R20) for a while towing an 8k trailer. It did well enough but shift points aren't as refined and sometimes short, but I'd say a 33.4" tire is generally okay without re-gear.

A 34.3" tire will be outside of the transmissions tuning and you'll find it in the wrong gear, bad shift points, especially on grade, elevation, and with loads. Sure it can work, but we're often drawn to the 200-series because its so well dialed in from the factory, and once you know what good is, it's hard to be compromised.

Thanks for the insight! After reading through your 4.30 regear thread, I am leaning towards getting the 295/70 now (cause I really need new tires) and collecting the 4.30 regear parts. That will probably give me what I'm looking for in the end. I do want to keep the ability to tow a car trailer and a ~4400 lb car, but as it's something I rarely do I hope I'll be ok until I'm ready for the regear.