LX570 #4 Worst Car of Decade

[luke27617]

My buddy owns a deal

Wats your source? I asked a similar question to local Lexus dealer in Northern VA, they said 8 out of 10 LX are purchases because there is no value in leasing ($$$). However they lease a ton of IS, RX all day long. I asked the same question to Land Rover folks, they answer was opposite, 8 out of 10 Ranger Rover was leased. Just a data point.

My buddy owns a dealership and buys majority of his inventory from auctions and leasing companies so watches closely the market. Toyota brand has a smaller % of lease vs. other brands as those hold value better (often stay in dealership inventory after being traded in) but 6000lbs segment tax incentive is big and those folks change vehicles often as it allows them to keep writing it off. It is a great incentive as at the end you are driving a 100k car for way less. He made comment that normally doesn't buy cars like Honda and Toyota as profit on resale is too low as resale values are high and prices stay high on auctions.
I think lease % may vary from region to region and age demographics in the region (ex NY, PA, etc have high number of cars hitting auctions). Lexus is typical bought by older people. Baby boomers are retired, have cash and wants reliable car. Places like AZ may have lower lease %. Number would have to be looked at by region.

 

[coleAK]

Wheels? Personal taste. AHC and electronic shocks? When has anyone complained about LC ride? None. But there are threads here that complain about LX ride...just one this morning. AHC leaks...isn't that the first thing anyone says when someone complains about LX ride? Electronic shocks cost over $1k to replace.

Interior...oh yeah, LX is much better!! Fake wood in LC is an abomination!

As for JBL being "vastly" inferior...i agree that it is lesser unit...but vastly? That's stretching it. I wrote on the ML system pros recently...ML is better in clarity and tonality throughout due to same combo of speakers in all its surround.

But on modern LX, you have to deal with the mouse....so.....

Wealthy don't care about resale? Hmmm, why are there so many LX on sale on the USED market? Because MOST wealthy folks keep their cars for a few years (3-5 years) and move on when the new model comes out or when other brands offer something flashier...NO MATTER service life of a vehicle. MOST owners of LC/LX are NOT on this forum. Service life is irrelevant to 99% of LX owners.

Same off-road capability? True. But there are limitations that affect how much damage you're willing to incur off-road. How about angles? How about articulation when you're jacked up?

Much more value if you are looking to buy used? I agree 100%. But why is resale value significantly better on LC and bad on LX? There must be a reason for that, right? IF more people want the flashy look and luxury and more for your money, then wouldn't LX on used market fetch more because of more demand? IF LC has poor sales (it does), then why such high resale? Name me one other car that has piss poor sales yet has excellent (nearly iconic) resale value? I cannot.

While that video is cool...how much $$$$$ went into that truck to make it THAT capable? The same (and probably less $$$$) can be done on LC too. Take a stock LX and stock LC out off-roading. Which will come back with more battle scars and needing more bodywork done? Which will cost more down the road to maintain (fuel, maintenance, parts) if you take it off-road or make mods?

The AHC isn’t air like Jeep/rover/mb/VW/Porsche, so don’t have the same raised up pogo problems. So with the suspension on high and dampening on comfort my articulation is great, I actually think it’s better raised up. Stock vs stock the LX is more capable off road then the LC.

As for the whole blending in with an LC vs LX, I think that is a myth. I’ve had my ‘13 LX for 6 years and The only comments I’ve ever gotten we’re from other LC/LX drivers and a kid at the auto skills shop talking about my highlander on AT tires. As for the name plate” and heritage, Basically people who are into LCs know what they are everyone else doesn’t.

 

[bloc]

My fire station is in a neighborhood with lots of “old money”. Wealthy people living in remodeled older houses that are very high quality but not very flashy. The number of 2016+ of land cruisers in this area is staggering for such a rare vehicle. 16+ LX570s? Not so much. Even 08-15 cruisers are well represented... far more than similar vintage LX despite three times as many of those being sold.

Yes this is a small sample but it is definitely a thing around here.

 

[Madtiger]

The AHC isn’t air like Jeep/rover/mb/VW/Porsche, so don’t have the same raised up pogo problems. So with the suspension on high and dampening on comfort my articulation is great, I actually think it’s better raised up. Stock vs stock the LX is more capable off road then the LC.

And people think that I have misconceptions!

 

[18Cruiser]

My fire station is in a neighborhood with lots of “old money”. Wealthy people living in remodeled older houses that are very high quality but not very flashy. The number of 2016+ of land cruisers in this area is staggering for such a rare vehicle. 16+ LX570s? Not so much. Even 08-15 cruisers are well represented... far more than similar vintage LX despite three times as many of those being sold.

Yes this is a small sample but it is definitely a thing around here.

In an older established wealthy neighborhood in my town you would think, given the low sales numbers of the LC and the LX, that each and everyone of the LC/LX sold in America must have been sold to someone living there. Literally, can't drive though without see minimum of 5 - 10 of the 200 series.

There are similarly quite a few of other series as well, I just notice the 200's because that's what I have. I do notice several 60 series around that area as that is what my Dad had.

 

[coleAK]

And people think that I have misconceptions!

What misconception? AHC is springs and hydraulic, not air sprung like the others mentioned, and doesn't get firmer as the height increases like air does. They both come stock with crap tires for off road And with AHC a Stock LX is more off road capable then a stock LC, no misconceptions, just fact.

 

[Madtiger]

What misconception? AHC is springs and hydraulic, not air sprung like the others mentioned, and doesn't get firmer as the height increases like air does. They both come stock with crap tires for off road And with AHC a Stock LX is more off road capable then a stock LC, no misconceptions, just fact.

How does AHC make it more capable? And you have full compression and droop at highest point? What are the angles with AHC at HIGH?

From off-road pics, i don’t see much compression when in HIGH.

 

[coleAK]

How does AHC make it more capable? And you have full compression and droop at highest point? What are the angles with AHC at HIGH?

From off-road pics, i don’t see much compression when in HIGH.

AHC gives ~4” (40%) more ground clearance (with extra high). Have you ever off roaded one? Off roaded with one? I off road mine pretty hard and rarely get a wheel off the ground so in the real world where I drive mine articulation is great. As for the angles see attached

 

[grinchy]

This whole in my neighborhood thing suggested some quick research. While I couldn't find a publicly available data set of brand/state, I did find SUV/state. So, making all the obvious and likely inaccurate assumptions that all SUVs sell in the same percentages in all states, it is possible to calculate actual sales of 200s in your state.
In my state, about 200 total (TLC/LX) are sold each year.

 

[40Man]

age to an LX.

AHC gives ~4” (40%) more ground clearance (with extra high). Have you ever off roaded one? Off roaded with one? I off road mine pretty hard and rarely get a wheel off the ground so in the real world where I drive mine articulation is great. As for the angles see attached

View attachment 2172225

The problem with the 16+ Lexus is the approach angle (departure is similar in high). That long ass bumper is awful. Even with in High, with the higher clearance and breakover, the front end sucks. And aftermarket bumpers are hard to find, which of course would make it not "stock".

If you do mod, putting on a lift to make the LC sit like the stock Lexus in high gives even better approach and departure, and bumpers, which there are many options for the LC, make it even better.

I wouldn't go so far as to say one is better than the other in stock form, there are trade offs. I'd feel much more confident in a stock LC due to the approach and departure. I've already hit my LC bumper going up stuff. Probably would have ripped the LX bumper off.

 

[Madtiger]

AHC gives ~4” (40%) more ground clearance (with extra high). Have you ever off roaded one? Off roaded with one? I off road mine pretty hard and rarely get a wheel off the ground so in the real world where I drive mine articulation is great. As for the angles see attached

View attachment 2172225

Again, i don’t see where the LX is better than LC off-road due to AHC. (Ground clearance is limited by the rear pumpkin...which is not changed with AHC modes.)

 

[Canyonero]

I just read this whole thread, thanks for nothing internet.

Like @mcgaskins posted, the LC and LX are objectively bad vehicles by nearly every metric used to evaluate vehicles.

They are appealing to people who want the build quality the 200 is known for, and people who want to build their vehicles a bit further for Overlanding/off-road purposes. They are somewhat appealing to others for primarily nostalgic reasons or some perception of prestige (which is hilarious since people think a 200 is either a Highlander, 4Runner or Sequoia - mine was called all 3.)

They also don't sell many, and lest we forget, Toyota is in the widget-making business. Looks like the 200 is not long for this part of the world, and the LX will likely be axed too or dramatically different in its next iteration.

Personally, after owning and building and wheeling a 2015 200 very hard, I find myself "wanting to want" one again, but I can't quite get there. LX570s and 200s just have too many shortcomings for my taste, but admittedly they are still the most robust vehicle on the road. That's just not enough for me.

Meanwhile, Jeep sells $50k Wranglers all day every day, and Ford moves a lot of Raptors at $70k. Other OEMs have approached the offroad market in a far more lucrative manner than (lazy/conservative) Toyota/Lexus, IMO.

 

[bloc]

Meanwhile, Jeep sells $50k Wranglers all day every day, and Ford moves a lot of Raptors at $70k. Other OEMs have approached the offroad market in a far more lucrative manner than (lazy/conservative) Toyota/Lexus, IMO.

At the risk of driving this down the TRD Pro landcruiser debate path, Toyota is selling the crap out of TRD Pro 4Runner/Tacoma/Tundra and with the sticker price I’m betting they are making a fair bit of profit on top of the decent money they make off those models already. These modest off-road versions also fit Toyota’s lazy/conservative business style.

 

[Chrisleduc1]

Just buy an LX and put an ARB bumper on it. In 4L in Hi you’ll have better clearance than the LC and a premium interior.
Once you put the ARB on, you can de badge it and nobody knows it’s a Lexus. You’ll have better audio, real wood, automatic everything, the adaptive cruise, and the AHC system which is better for towing and regular driving, and the 360 camera etc.

 

[Madtiger]

Just buy an LX and put an ARB bumper on it. In 4L in Hi you’ll have better clearance than the LC and a premium interior.
Once you put the ARB on, you call de badge it nobody knows it’s a Lexus. You’ll have better audio, real wood, automatic everything, the adaptive cruise, and the AHC system which is better for towing and regular driving, and the 360 camera etc. View attachment 2172326

If you put that same bumper on LC, then wouldn’t it be better than your LX.......since in HIGH mode, your LX still has less approach angle based on the informative post above??

Automatic everything? My 2019 has automatic everything except for 3rd row. I have adaptive cruise, 360 camera, and a HIGHER tow rating.

 

[99toylc]

I think we are starting to loose the original point of this conversation and starting to slip into the p***** contest of whether the LC is Better than LX or the opposite...
The question we were trying to answer is this:
Is Lexus lx570 worthy being on the list of 10 worst vehicles of this decade at #4?
My answer to it is "NO", it is not perfect by any means, but I can think of at least 20 other cars / trucks that should take its place.
Cheers to all of you proud LC / LX owners !!

 

[Chrisleduc1]

I have adaptive cruise, 360 camera...

While your ‘19 may have those options, comparing 16s or 17s the LC doesn’t have that stuff.

And you don’t have “all speed adaptive cruise.”

The LC version cancels below 25MPH and cancels when driving more then 10 under the set speed, neither of which happens with the LX. It is an inferior system to the LX.

Whatever 360 camera you have, it’s not what the LX has shows a birds eye 360 view:

Approach angle is determined by the bumper, so no, the LC doesn’t have a better angle when they both have the same ARB. Actually the LX is then much better because of the several inches of lift from the AHC. So again, the LX has a premium interior in several respects and even better off-road angles when they both have aftermarket bumpers. A

 

[Madtiger]

While your ‘19 may have those options, comparing 16s or 17s the LC doesn’t have that stuff.

And you don’t have “all speed adaptive cruise.”

The LC version cancels below 25MPH and cancels when driving more then 10 under the set speed, neither of which happens with the LX. It is an inferior system to the LX.




Whatever 360 camera you have, it’s not what the LX has shows a birds eye 360 view:
View attachment 2172371



Approach angle is determined by the bumper, so no, the LC doesn’t have a better angle when they both have the same ARB. Actually the LX is then much better because of the several inches of lift from the AHC. So again, the LX has a premium interior in several respects and even better off-road angles when they both have aftermarket bumpers. A

i have the same camera dude. WOW you have adaptive cruise at 24 mph. LC owners are jealous. Lol.

and isn’t your HIGH mode limited to 18 mph and LO range? ThereIs no such limit to LC’s angles. Does that mean that you have an inferior feature? Lol

As for the angles, you don’t know how much better unless you have two vehicles with same mods.

but since you comparing mods, then let’s compare one with sliders. Oh wait, LX has no sliders mod at this time. And your AHC canister thingy is another thing that can get damage easily. Or how about LC able to fit proper off-road tires easier and cheaper. We can go on and on.

stock vs stock, LX is NOT better than LC in off-road.

but in the end, you have a capable SUV that is very luxurious. You do have misconceptions about it’s off road superiority over LC.

 

[Chrisleduc1]

Dude give it a rest already, you continue to spout nonsense...
The two vehicles with the ARB bumpers will have the same angle if at the same height, its the same frame and install etc. Once the LX is put in Hi mode, or 4L Hi, then the angle increases on the LX. It really is that simple. It requires a lift on the LC to improve/match the LX angle.
My sliders will be here next week. So yes, they exist, and more are coming on the market.
Tires? Its just as easy to get 305R20s as whatever you want on the LC.. Cheaper? Ok, so now that's our definition of superior? And unless you go down to a 17" the gain really isn't all that much when aired down, because with an 18" you cannot get 305s and a fat sidewall, its a trade off of one or the other. So while my widewall is skinnier on a 20, I start out wider with a 305, and so with a 275/285 it has to air down a good bit and its takes some sidewall going flat before it is even even with my 305 contact patch. Then we can both air down and further increase the footprint. For freeway driving and towing, I'll take my 305R20s over a 65 series 18 any day, especially when I have AHC to adjust and smooth out the ride.
And yes, the cruise working 5MPH is a big deal if you drive in bumper to bumper traffic, because you can just leave it set. I can set it all 65 on the local highway, go all the way into town at 20mph behind a car, and back up to 65 and never touch the brake or gas. And on the freeway in 5MPH stop and go, its huge! So while you can act like its not better, there is a reason Lexus uses it and not what the LC has...

 

[Madtiger]

High mode is speed limited?