LX470 Torsion Bar Adjustment (1 Viewer)

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Oct 14, 2016
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San Antonio, TX
Ok guys - been through all the threads on AHC adjustment and leveling of the vehicle so I tried to level it with the torsion bars on a compleltly flat surface and I have maxed out the drivers side to get it even with the passenger side. It’s now even but the adjustments are nowhere near the same. Ride seems fine but curious if this is OK or if should must dump AHC? Going to OME at some point just curious if this is sooner rather than later.
 
Define 'even' and 'adjustments are the same'? Is the height the same, and are the measurements from the hub center to the wheel arch lip the same? If they are the same measurements, but the torsion bar adjusters are not set the same, don't worry about it. Also, never adjust the tosion bars on a the ground, it has to be done with the front wheels off the ground, unloaded. If you try and crank it with load on the wheels, you can damage things.
 
It’s fine, and actually called for in the FSM, to adjust the TBs with the vehicle on flat level ground for AHC vehicles. I’ve never measured more than 60ftlbs on the tighter bolt (well maintained zero corrosion vehicle). OP if your front left to front right height difference was close to 1/2 inch or larger did you split the difference and loosen the higher side and tighten the lower side by equal turns? The active height control then resets to N and you adjust both torsion bars equally to reset your pressure. And having unequal thread counts on either side with the vehicle cross leveled and pressure set is normal.
 
... Also, never adjust the tosion bars on a the ground, it has to be done with the front wheels off the ground, unloaded. If you try and crank it with load on the wheels, you can damage things.

Did not know this. I adjusted mine with vehicle sitting on ground.
 
Ok guys - been through all the threads on AHC adjustment and leveling of the vehicle so I tried to level it with the torsion bars on a compleltly flat surface and I have maxed out the drivers side to get it even with the passenger side. It’s now even but the adjustments are nowhere near the same. Ride seems fine but curious if this is OK or if should must dump AHC? Going to OME at some point just curious if this is sooner rather than later.


Did you check the AHC pressures?
 
Ok guys. Sorry about the delay. Yes - I adjusted it on the ground per the FSM. I also measured from the center of the wheel to the fender. The passenger side was right at 19” and the drivers side was at 18.25” so I cranked up the drivers side until they were even. They are now even but I bottomed our the drivers side bar.

Yes - I also ran TechStream to check the pressures pre and post adjustment. Before the adjustment I was just over the max threshold so I turned the passenger side 3 full turns to relieve the pressure before I leveled it.
 
Ok guys. Sorry about the delay. Yes - I adjusted it on the ground per the FSM. I also measured from the center of the wheel to the fender. The passenger side was right at 19” and the drivers side was at 18.25” so I cranked up the drivers side until they were even. They are now even but I bottomed our the drivers side bar.

Yes - I also ran TechStream to check the pressures pre and post adjustment. Before the adjustment I was just over the max threshold so I turned the passenger side 3 full turns to relieve the pressure before I leveled it.

I have the very same issue. Did you find it out?
 

The lower control arm bushings work within a certain range when locked down. The torsion bar is connected to the lower control arm via two bolts and provides tension on the lower control arm. If the TB is adjusted without loosening the lca bushings at the time of adjustment, you are dealing with opposing forces. The TB is is pushing the arm downward and the bushing is counteracting it because it is not in a resting state. It is torquing the arm upward in order to achieve the resting state of the bushing. It will wear prematurely because it is binding, in addition to squirrely handling.

When I adjust my TB's, I loosen the lower control arm bolts while in the air, adjust the TB's, lower the vehicle (the lca bushings will move into proper position at this point), then lock down the control arm bushings on level ground once the height has been achieved. The bushings are now in a "zero" state with no pre-load. Then the alignment can be done.
 
The lower control arm bushings work within a certain range when locked down. The torsion bar is connected to the lower control arm via two bolts and provides tension on the lower control arm. If the TB is adjusted without loosening the lca bushings at the time of adjustment, you are dealing with opposing forces. The TB is is pushing the arm downward and the bushing is counteracting it because it is not in a resting state. It is torquing the arm upward in order to achieve the resting state of the bushing. It will wear prematurely because it is binding, in addition to squirrely handling.

When I adjust my TB's, I loosen the lower control arm bolts while in the air, adjust the TB's, lower the vehicle (the lca bushings will move into proper position at this point), then lock down the control arm bushings on level ground once the height has been achieved. The bushings are now in a "zero" state with no pre-load. Then the alignment can be done.
Please excuse my ignorance. But what two bolts are you loosing. The two that hold the TB brace to the control arm, or the two that are on the control arm bushing ?
Question, after this adjustment is done do I also have to mess with air height control sensor’s.
Thank You !!
 
I cranked torsion bars because it was lower on the driver side. Vehicle did level but a few days later it got lower than where it was before. Wheels were tilted inside too noticeably. Any suggestions? ( haven’t done wheel alignment yet, wanted to make sure torsion bars sit properly)
 
Turning TBs with AHC doesn't raise vehicle like with nonAHC vehicle.
 
I cranked torsion bars because it was lower on the driver side. Vehicle did level but a few days later it got lower than where it was before. Wheels were tilted inside too noticeably. Any suggestions? ( haven’t done wheel alignment yet, wanted to make sure torsion bars sit properly)

This reply covers more than is necessary to answer your question but maybe it will also help someone else passing this way ....

As @PADDO indicates earlier in this thread and elsewhere and as noted in the FSM, ‘cross-levelling’ of the vehicle is best done with wheels on the ground with engine/AHC “OFF”, front wheels straight ahead, on level ground, as a first step before making any other adjustments. The main purpose of so-called ‘cross-leveling’ is to make sure that both the Left and Right torsion bars are carrying equal loads. If this is not done, the vehicle response will be different in right and left turns and in some cases AHC performance may be affected as well.

'Cross-levelling' also overcomes visual lean of the vehicle -- provided it is done on level floor (not in the street), without even load distributions on or in the vehicle, and without mechanical defects on the suspension or chassis.the

Some find it a little easier to turn the torsion bar adjusters with the wheels off the ground, or with the suspension raised to “HI”. If this is done – OK – but the ONLY measurements that count are those measured with wheels on the ground at "N", looking to get the hub-to-fender measurements equal with wheels on the ground – just get them equal, the actual number is not important at this stage. Most find that torsion bar adjustments can be done on the ground but a good dose beforehand of PB Blaster or other penetrating oil on the adjuster threads does help.

The attached FSM extract mentions tightening and loosening opposite torsion bar adjusters by the same amount when ‘cross-levelling’. This helps to avoid running out of thread on one of the adjusters.

After making the torsion bar adjustments, it is worthwhile to take a short drive around the block to ensure that all suspension parts have settled into the new position. It is not unusual to find that it is necessary to fine-tune the new torsion bar adjustments.

It is worth repeating that in an AHC vehicle, the torsion bar adjusters are NOT used to set the ‘operating heights’ of vehicle, also called 'ride heights' (meaning the heights of the vehicle with engine and AHC “ON” and ‘operating’). These 'operating heights' are set at "N" height using the Height Control Sensor adjusters. IH8MUD Members recommend setting the front operating height hub-to-fender at 19.75 inches (500 millimetres) and the rear operating height hub-to-fender at 20.50 inches (520 millimetres)at "N" as a good approximation to the more fiddly measurements given in the FSM. (Naturally, the actual adjustments are made with the engine/AHC “OFF” for personal safety, then hub-to-fender ‘operating height’ measurements are made with the engine/AHC “ON” after a short drive to ensure that the system has settled).

Note that ‘cross-levelling’ cannot and should not be done with the Height Control Sensor adjusters – because AHC Left and Right sides are connected and at equal pressure with wheels straight ahead or when the vehicle is stationary. Attempts at 'cross-levelling' with Height Control Sensor adjusters is futile, likely to result in the ECU receiving conflicting signals from the sensors and putting the AHC system in 'fail safe' mode in which the AHC system will not operate fully, if at all.

If heights have changed significantly as a result of adjustments, then AHC neutral pressures also will have changed -- so it is worthwhile to check that the AHC pressures are within the specified ranges and then correct the situation if necessary.

Once the ‘operating heights’ are set, they should not change -- unless there is a problem somewhere in the AHC system, for example, faulty Height Control Sensors sending inconsistent signals to the Electronic Control Unit (ECU). Faults in these Sensors are common.

Alternatively, other parts such as the Control Valve Assembly or Return Valve are not operating properly and AHC fluid is returning to the tank – this is possible but not common.

Another alternative is a major external leak somewhere but that will obvious when inspecting under the vehicle.

It can happen that when the vehicle is stopped, that the engine is switched “OFF” before the AHC system has completed its self-levelling function. This can mean that the vehicle appears to be at different heights to those set previously. This is not unusual. In a healthy system, when the vehicle is re-started and moved slightly, the AHC system will respond to signals from the Height Control Sensors and automatically complete self-levelling and the vehicle heights will return to normal. The AHC Pump usually will be heard operating when this situation occurs.
 

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I should’ve mentioned AHC is disconnected.

I did not see your clarification until after I posted #16. The post at the link below and the attachment from long ago may be more helpful in a non-AHC situation ....

 

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I did not see your clarification until after I posted #16. The post at the link below and the attachment from long ago may be more helpful in a non-AHC situation ....

I read the article. Everything seemed fine until it sagged lower than the previous height which has me confused now. Thank you for referring. I’m going to crank them again let’s see how that goes.
Also will the alignment bring wheels at the right place as they were tilted inwards significantly during the process.
 
I read the article. Everything seemed fine until it sagged lower than the previous height which has me confused now. Thank you for referring. I’m going to crank them again let’s see how that goes.
Also will the alignment bring wheels at the right place as they were tilted inwards significantly during the process.

I should have asked which torsion bars have been installed when the AHC was removed or made non-operational? As you probably know, the OEM AHC torsion bars fitted to LX470 and LC100 with AHC are much lighter than the torsion bars fitted to non-AHC LC100's. The AHC torsion bars will struggle by themselves because they are intended to take only part of the vehicle load, with the rest carried by the AHC system.
 
@mk00

Dumb Q, but if you disconnected the AHC, did you replace the dampers with traditional dampers? Or are the AHC dampers still installed and just disconnected?
 

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