Knuckle Cut & Turn (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Krazytoy
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I am impressed that he just did it. I have those tools, yet I would be very serious (nervous) about making sure I get this right if I attempted it. Cool to keep the pinion angle correct. Nice.
- Thread starter
- #43
I was on drugs... Actually, depending on the taller the tire size I like to up the castor a little, maybe 5* was a little ambitious with 35's.
If I have time I will yank the tire and see if I can get a shot. The problem is leveling everything back up so the measurement is accurate, takes a little longer than you would think, but I'll see if I can get one.
Thank you, once you see it done the first time it is not really all that bad. You just have to measure, then re-measure, then check it again, then double check before you glue them on.
True, pinion angle wasn't corrected, but it wasn't made worse by rotating the pinion further in the wrong direction with caster plates or bushings.
Chris, its not a perfect pinion angle. The problem with pinion angles is when the caster is corrected by the means of bushes or plates. If you lifted your 80 without correcting caster it would be pretty close pointing at the transfer. And certainly "help" alot in reducing any vibrations from a stock set up. So I wouldn't be knocking the cut and turn at all.
Krazytoy, take a pic for the good people.
Krazytoy, take a pic for the good people.
That makes sense. The fact that the caster changes negatively as the axle droops means that the pinion angle is somewhat naturally corrected (though probably not all the way).
1 thing I never bothered doing. Was to measure at what lift (without caster correction) was the pinion pointing perfectly at the trans (if at all). But this mod is limited as illustrated by the photos. The problem of the rear track bar coming into contact with the control arms earlier than if plates where used. Meaning this can only be used on small lifts unless you ream a taper into the underside of the knuckle arms. Then run your track bar underneath.
Tapage
Club 4X4 Panamá
I believe it ended up only being 3/16" or 4.7625 mm for the rest of the world.
damn .. gotta check my glasses .. anyhow if you would have the chance to do it again, would you aim for more caster .. something like 1/4" ..?
you are very welcome .. just let me know when .. and BTW 30 hours .. damn, still very good .. ( no hero
)
He says at the beginning that he couldn't rotate any more because the steering hits the control arms.
Good point.
You do want to have a full penetration weld here and if it was quarter inch wall pipe, you would have a 60 degree bevel and something like an 1/8 inch land and root gap. On FJ40 axles, I have seen people grind out the cut to approximate these conditions before welding.
It would not be easy to get full penetration with a butt weld with a 1/16 gap, so if you just want to weld it up after cutting it with no further prep, then you would want to mock this up and weld a test piece first to see if you get full penetration. It is not something you would want to assume.
Good to point out, this is one of the things you dont want to have your weld break on, though it would mostly likely crack on the trail obviously there is some risk for the beginner welder in taking on a C&T.
The OP has done this the best way IMO, but I didn't know you could get enough turn with the steering linkage on the 80. I would rather do the C&T then the plates, not to knock them, but this tackles two birds. Actually I'd do a C&T and move the radius arms to the top of the axle, but thats another can of worms, and maybe next to impossible with clearances with my power plant in my 80.
Kudos to the OP!
sleeoffroad
Supporting Vendor
Not sure about that. I always understood cut and turn to be exactly this.
Then I'll consider it a lesson taken, but the results of the process do not achieve the same thing as any other "cut and turn" because it didn't address pinion angle, which is typically part of the process, goal, end result, whatever.
OP has no issue there, we can all agree.
For the rest that do, this doesn't solve but half the issue (assuming that the knuckles can rotate far enough on a greater than OPs lift height without contact) so a "cut and turn and cut all mounts and turn the axle housing" may be a more accurate nomenclature.
Touché.
I'm not sure why you would need to address the pinion angle? When you correct the caster by rotating the housing you change the angle, but the benefit of this approach is the ability to adjust the caster without changing the pinion angle.
- Thread starter
- #58
damn .. gotta check my glasses .. anyhow if you would have the chance to do it again, would you aim for more caster .. something like 1/4" ..?
you are very welcome .. just let me know when .. and BTW 30 hours .. damn, still very good .. ( no hero
I would go for as much as you can before the steering hits the arms, everyone's setup is going to be a little different so I would still aim for 4* to 4.5*. After driving mine much more in the last few days it drives and tracks much, much better then it did before. I think I was just use to it before and didn't realize how much it actually wandered.
The tie rod is as close to the control arm as I felt comfortable.
I don't know that I agree with you here, I understand your constructive thoughts and I do not take them in the least bit the wrong way.
I do not believe there is such a thing as a "perfect" pinion angle. I have fought many vehicles on what many experts consider a perfect pinion angle just to have them vibrate. Each vehicle is different and the Cruisers are very much in that category. I don't have any vibrations nor do I plan to lift mine any more, therefore I didn't feel the need to mess with it.
Why rotate the entire housing? just cut the face plate off and modify the face plate for the 3rd member, sometimes its easier than messing with all the bracketry and potential interferences you could create.
Again, I do not consider your comments negative in any way, everyone has there own opinion of how to correct the imperfections we create when we go messing with Mr. T's design.
I forgot to mention that I pre-heated the area with my torch before I welded it. I am very confident in my welding skills and I am not worried about my weld breaking. I have welded much more critical stuff then an thin wall knuckle, but you do bring up a good point that this is critical area and should be welded on only by qualified individuals.
That is not the way they teach you to make that type of weld in welding school. The weld is like an AWS 5G position pipe weld with a backing ring and for a MIG weld the proper joint design would be a 75 degree V with a knife edge land with at least an 1/8 inch root gap. When you have both the proper joint design and the properly executed weld, then you can be certifiably confident.
