KISS Dual Battery Upgrade

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I have a optima yellow top (Agm). I have a diode to ‘raise’ the charge voltage. The alternator will still not fully charge the battery. I run it on an agm battery tender about 18 hours every month to top it up. The tender can also run a discharge charge cycle, it hasn't yet.
 
The RedArc DCDC is awesome and simply does its job. You can use it to charge an AGM, Lithium, and Lead Crystal using the AGM profile. IMO, there are still tradeoffs with any dual battery setup in the 200. Let's just look at a subset of options and the key tradeoffs.

Option 1: Dual-Matched FLA Batteries (a suggested in the first post)
Tradeoff: You're limited to dual Group 35 batteries which isn't a ton of usable power. It's a great, simple, solution if your power needs are low. (Edited to add that it sounds like one can also do dual group 27s with some effort).

Option 2: AGM Deep Cycle Main Battery + AGM Aux Battery + DCDC Charger (my current setup)
Tradeoff: The good news here is that your aux battery will be happy but your AGM main battery will never be fully charged without intervention for all the reasons @TeCKis300 pointed out. You'll want to hit your main battery with an external charger as often as you find it convenient. Why put up with the problem of having to charge the main? I do it because I've had FLAs die after extended periods of travel on washboard roads in the past (not in the 200, though). I've had good luck offroad with FLA Deka batteries in other vehicles and will likely try their Group 31 FLA tractor battery at some point when I'm tired of manually charging the deep cycle.

Option 3: FLA Main Battery + Deep Cycle (AGM, Lithium, whatever) Aux Battery + DCDC Charger
Tradeoff: This would be a bulletproof setup. Both batteries receive current how and when they prefer it. The only potential downside here is destroying the FLA battery in harsh conditions. While this has happened to me before, it's not catastrophic if you have a second battery and is still unlikely in general as long as the battery is secure.

Option 4: Any scenario using a diode to trick the voltage sensor (the ALT-S replacement fuse)
Tradeoff: This doesn't seem to work at all on MY16 and later but even if it did you're probably cooking the battery and its life will be reduced. On the flip side, it's likely that your AGM will probably receive more charge... though the battery may not be in the mood to receive the current based on the profile.

Option 5: Any scenario using a solenoid or the Blue Sea ACR (I used to use the Blue Sea ACR)
Tradeoff: The main battery (if FLA) is likely getting enough charge but your second battery will probably never be fully charged. This is very likely with an AGM second battery and still possible if the second battery is of the FLA varietal.

We carry a jump pack in each of our vehicles but I wouldn't put 100% faith in them. I have a recurring calendar appointment to make sure they're charged frequently enough and they're also on my "charge" list for a trip. I've never had one outright fail but I have needed one when it just didn't have enough juice.
 
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I dunno about winning...
Mostly just noting that there are many paths to success, and many sweeping declarations are not slways as absolute as sometimes put forth.
 
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Since some people here can only understand anecdotes, with all their BFG massiveness...

It would certainly be easier for me to pat everyone on the back and call it a day. Buy lots of big heavy products, slap it on, and declare success. Leave it to the next guy to follow in those massive footsteps and off-road happily ever after. Except many of us have noticed things are not always roses. Wouldn't it be better to get to the bottom of it all such that we can truly enjoy our upgrades?

I've already played the AGM game 3x over. Not with this vehicle, but on a previous car. With military spec Oddyssey metal jacket AGMs no less. No matter what I did, and try various things with tech support, getting this or that charger, doodad, things would never last much over a year or two. Not even close to the promises they made that it would outperform a flooded in longevity and performance. Luckily they had great warranties and kept replacing. So on their recommendation, I faithfully plugged in a tender. Didn't change a thing. It was on that, that I truly did my due dilegence to wonder what was wrong. Went back to a flooded battery and all worked so friggen well again. Never had to plug in a tender again (what a PITA that was). Pay more, get less, PITA of plugging in, that's not my idea of an upgrade.

So you keep on keeping on as you have more massiveness then everyone else here, and I'm just trying to be a thorn in your side. Perhaps you might understand one day that I share because I have walked that path in learning, experience, along with incredible things on the job where I've made my mistakes too. I'm offering a shortcut of knowledge to others such that they can move forward and skip the trials and tribulations others have already done.
 
While violating the KISS principal, there are alternator to battery chargers that will allow you to fully charge your AGM main/starter battery. I have zero experience, or clue how well they'd work on a 200 series land cruiser.

Some links for those who like to research:





Option 2: AGM Deep Cycle Main Battery + AGM Aux Battery + DCDC Charger (my current setup)
Tradeoff: The good news here is that your aux battery will be happy but your AGM main battery will never be fully charged without intervention for all the reasons @TeCKis300 pointed out. You'll want to hit your main battery with an external charger as often as you find it convenient. Why put up with the problem of having to charge the main? I do it because I've had FLAs die after extended periods of travel on washboard roads in the past (not in the 200, though). I've had good luck offroad with FLA Deka batteries in other vehicles and will likely try their Group 31 FLA tractor battery at some point when I'm tired of manually charging the deep cycle.
 
The RedArc DCDC is awesome and simply does its job. You can use it to charge an AGM, Lithium, and Lead Crystal using the AGM profile. IMO, there are still tradeoffs with any dual battery setup in the 200. Let's just look at a subset of options and the key tradeoffs.

Option 1: Dual-Matched FLA Batteries (a suggested in the first post)
Tradeoff: You're limited to dual Group 35 batteries which isn't a ton of usable power. It's a great, simple, solution if your power needs are low.

Option 2: AGM Deep Cycle Main Battery + AGM Aux Battery + DCDC Charger (my current setup)
Tradeoff: The good news here is that your aux battery will be happy but your AGM main battery will never be fully charged without intervention for all the reasons @TeCKis300 pointed out. You'll want to hit your main battery with an external charger as often as you find it convenient. Why put up with the problem of having to charge the main? I do it because I've had FLAs die after extended periods of travel on washboard roads in the past (not in the 200, though). I've had good luck offroad with FLA Deka batteries in other vehicles and will likely try their Group 31 FLA tractor battery at some point when I'm tired of manually charging the deep cycle.

Option 3: FLA Main Battery + Deep Cycle (AGM, Lithium, whatever) Aux Battery + DCDC Charger
Tradeoff: This would be a bulletproof setup. Both batteries receive current how and when they prefer it. The only potential downside here is destroying the FLA battery in harsh conditions. While this has happened to me before, it's not catastrophic if you have a second battery and is still unlikely in general as long as the battery is secure.

Option 4: Any scenario using a diode to trick the voltage sensor (the ALT-S replacement fuse)
Tradeoff: This doesn't seem to work at all on MY16 and later but even if it did you're probably cooking the battery and its life will be reduced. On the flip side, it's likely that your AGM will probably receive more charge... though the battery may not be in the mood to receive the current based on the profile.

Option 5: Any scenario using a solenoid or the Blue Sea ACR (I used to use the Blue Sea ACR)
Tradeoff: The main battery (if FLA) is likely getting enough charge but your second battery will probably never be fully charged. This is very likely with an AGM second battery and still possible if the second battery is of the FLA varietal.

We carry a jump pack in each of our vehicles but I wouldn't put 100% faith in them. I have a recurring calendar appointment to make sure they're charged frequently enough and they're also on my "charge" list for a trip. I've never had one outright fail but I have needed one when it just didn't have enough juice.

One thing I know about Cole is that he has tried a zillion different versions of things on his truck, especially when it comes to electronics...fridges...batteries...and on and on.
He is also unbelievably organized in his documentation of things.

He’s the one I queried the other day during my rear coil install...because I knew there was a good chance he’d have the exact torque values of several bracket bolts within reach...panhard...and more. Sure enough—within like 2 minutes he sent numbers. :)
 
i run a group27 main battery and a group 27 second battery on the passenger side, connected in parallel.

very simple setup. has saved my butt on more than one occasion.

last year in colorado, the main battery moved just enough in the mount to pop off one of the caps. battery acid spilled all over and with dry cells, the battery would not have had the power to run the compressor, fridge and truck. having the 2nd battery on tap, kept the trip rolling along.
 
“Since some people here can only understand anecdotes, with all their BFG massiveness...

...So you keep on keeping on as you have more massiveness then everyone else here,”

?

Insults noted & weird massiveness comments aside...

As Yoda said to Luke in 1980...
“Judge me by my size do you?
-And well you should not.”
;)

PS. If I’ve learned anything over the years, it’s that there are many paths to success and failure when it comes to wheeling...and that in matters of approach to goals—sweeping generalizations, declarations & blanket exclusions are rarely justified.
 
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Since some people here can only understand anecdotes, with all their BFG massiveness...

It would certainly be easier for me to pat everyone on the back and call it a day. Buy lots of big heavy products, slap it on, and declare success. Leave it to the next guy to follow in those massive footsteps and off-road happily ever after. Except many of us have noticed things are not always roses. Wouldn't it be better to get to the bottom of it all such that we can truly enjoy our upgrades?

I've already played the AGM game 3x over. Not with this vehicle, but on a previous car. With military spec Oddyssey metal jacket AGMs no less. No matter what I did, and try various things with tech support, getting this or that charger, doodad, things would never last much over a year or two. Not even close to the promises they made that it would outperform a flooded in longevity and performance. Luckily they had great warranties and kept replacing. So on their recommendation, I faithfully plugged in a tender. Didn't change a thing. It was on that, that I truly did my due dilegence to wonder what was wrong. Went back to a flooded battery and all worked so friggen well again. Never had to plug in a tender again (what a PITA that was). Pay more, get less, PITA of plugging in, that's not my idea of an upgrade.

So you keep on keeping on as you have more massiveness then everyone else here, and I'm just trying to be a thorn in your side. Perhaps you might understand one day that I share because I have walked that path in learning, experience, along with incredible things on the job where I've made my mistakes too. I'm offering a shortcut of knowledge to others such that they can move forward and skip the trials and tribulations others have already done.
You went through 3 AGMs? Was it in a dual battery setup?
 
If
i run a group27 main battery and a group 27 second battery on the passenger side, connected in parallel.

very simple setup. has saved my butt on more than one occasion.

last year in colorado, the main battery moved just enough in the mount to pop off one of the caps. battery acid spilled all over and with dry cells, the battery would not have had the power to run the compressor, fridge and truck. having the 2nd battery on tap, kept the trip rolling along.
You had run a simple parralel setup and one of the batteries did that, maybe you were lucky the post came completely off? If it simply shorted, or died, wouldn't it drain the other battery since it's full time connected in parallel? Just curious.

Have a f/u to my previous issues, the issue was the @sleeoffroad aluminum connectors to the terminal connector. Got the battery replaced under warranty and a week later the truck doesn't start. Doesn't make sense. Test the starter battery and it's sitting at 12.7 car off. What I didn't do last time was touch the Slee "aluminum" connectors an inch away from the terminals, also where the cable to the starter is attached. 5V. There's so much corrosion (not visible to the naked eye) between the two that the starter battery isn't doing anything. No wonder. Thank god for the secondary battery, and AGM Northstar none the less. Time to look for new terminals with auxiliary screws, not a new dual batt setup.
 
If

You had run a simple parralel setup and one of the batteries did that, maybe you were lucky the post came completely off? If it simply shorted, or died, wouldn't it drain the other battery since it's full time connected in parallel? Just curious.

Have a f/u to my previous issues, the issue was the @sleeoffroad aluminum connectors to the terminal connector. Got the battery replaced under warranty and a week later the truck doesn't start. Doesn't make sense. Test the starter battery and it's sitting at 12.7 car off. What I didn't do last time was touch the Slee "aluminum" connectors an inch away from the terminals, also where the cable to the starter is attached. 5V. There's so much corrosion (not visible to the naked eye) between the two that the starter battery isn't doing anything. No wonder. Thank god for the secondary battery, and AGM Northstar none the less. Time to look for new terminals with auxiliary screws, not a new dual batt setup.
Military style connectors (not some cheap azz Chinese either) lots of room for connections.
 
You went through 3 AGMs? Was it in a dual battery setup?

Single AGM battery used for the purpose of a lightweight battery on a daily driver. To offset the heavy twin-turbo 2JZ-GTE and Getrag 6-speed motor I swapped into my IS300. As simple as it gets, and should work right?

It was with this that it became obvious that AGMs were not compatible with the stock charging system. As smaller batteries have less reserve, the increased premature wear played out quicker, and was apparent by the # of days reserve that kept dwindling. Until it had none and had to be replaced in 1-2 yrs.

Replaced with a normal flooded small battery ultimately. That battery easily went 4yrs, and was still going when I sold it.

AGMs are great batteries, but it requires an AGM specific charger/tender, for which the stock electrical system is not.
 
Quick question, how did you get that swap past CARB and smog?

First 6 years, no smog necessary. After, no comment.
She did have a cat, no CELs, and all monitors ready. Fun fun ride. It was because of smog that I ultimately decided to sell her.
 
If

You had run a simple parralel setup and one of the batteries did that, maybe you were lucky the post came completely off? If it simply shorted, or died, wouldn't it drain the other battery since it's full time connected in parallel? Just curious.


it wasn't a post that came off, it was the plastic cap that keeps the water in the battery. i got a free interstate battery from my dad, it isn't flat on the top, the caps are raised. After a long day of washboard trails, the battery jiggled just enough to the side that the hold down bar hit one of the caps and popped it off. battery acid spilled all over the front corner of the truck.
no electrical short or grounding issues, just dry cells and a very weak battery.
 
Not KISS nor cheap but awesome, Redarc Manager 30: The Manager30
 
i run a group27 main battery and a group 27 second battery on the passenger side, connected in parallel.

very simple setup. has saved my butt on more than one occasion.

last year in colorado, the main battery moved just enough in the mount to pop off one of the caps. battery acid spilled all over and with dry cells, the battery would not have had the power to run the compressor, fridge and truck. having the 2nd battery on tap, kept the trip rolling along.

This or the single group 31 are the directions I'm considering @TexAZ, did you do a write up on your dual 27 setup? Thanks.
 

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