Inverter/power station combo for low energy needs (1 Viewer)

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate
links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

T

Therealtotodile

Joined
Jun 14, 2018
Threads
29
Messages
157
Location
San Diego
Hi mud,
I'm going to take the truck out to Idaho/Montana/Wyoming this august, and need to be able to charge things things when the truck is off.

I've doing some research, and wanted to ask if anybody understands the limitations of running an inverter from the main battery. There is no second/aux battery on the truck. My hope was that it could be used to charge a small power station as I drive. I was thinking something that is like 400ish watts, maybe less, not sure on that size of yet. I do not have any devices with very high power needs, just like normal camping gear like lights, phones, a small speaker, or other handheld devices.

I also wanted to ask if anyone could explain how to wire an inverter to some relay (or whatever switch) that would kick it on when the car is running, and off when you turn the engine off. I assume I wouldn't want to run the inverter very long (or at all?) if the truck is not running. And if anyone has some sort of similar setup where you have to manually control the inverter, I would love to hear how that works for you.

Cheers
 
Therealtotodile said:
Hi mud,
I'm going to take the truck out to Idaho/Montana/Wyoming this august, and need to be able to charge things things when the truck is off.

I've doing some research, and wanted to ask if anybody understands the limitations of running an inverter from the main battery. There is no second/aux battery on the truck. My hope was that it could be used to charge a small power station as I drive. I was thinking something that is like 400ish watts, maybe less, not sure on that size of yet. I do not have any devices with very high power needs, just like normal camping gear like lights, phones, a small speaker, or other handheld devices.

I also wanted to ask if anyone could explain how to wire an inverter to some relay (or whatever switch) that would kick it on when the car is running, and off when you turn the engine off. I assume I wouldn't want to run the inverter very long (or at all?) if the truck is not running. And if anyone has some sort of similar setup where you have to manually control the inverter, I would love to hear how that works for you.

Cheers
Click to expand...
I have a Group 27 deep cycle marine battery as my second battery. (I used to have a group 31 as the second battery) running all of my accessories, with a 1500 watt Xantrex inverter. If I had to do it all over again today, I would skip the second battery, and inverter, and use of the these power stations instead. EcoFlow RIVER 2 Pro Portable Power Station | EcoFlow - https://us.ecoflow.com/products/river-2-pro-portable-power-station?variant=40322674262089&g_campaign_id=14455190349&g_adgroup_id=140929141909&gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAjw7NmzBhBLEiwAxrHQ-c-Fkst8tVSfh8rGGaE3jJgCPdW1p6j9bO40OUvLXI6X8-yOF3NNpBoCzHEQAvD_BwE&fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTAAAR10AeZ1gChOd-d_Z_xgaU0-EYUG69J8bHQ9p0PwDmCIGRq2zsmEyEhS1jQ_aem_wzm7U8c63-ACB7D_yKtSxg You charge this power station via vehicle or solar. I've used both.

These power stations are so much more versatile than a second battery in a vehicle. I didn't have this options 7 years ago.
 
Dr Gil said:
I have a Group 27 deep cycle marine battery as my second battery. (I used to have a group 31 as the second battery) running all of my accessories, with a 1500 watt Xantrex inverter. If I had to do it all over again today, I would skip the second battery, and inverter, and use of the these power stations instead. EcoFlow RIVER 2 Pro Portable Power Station | EcoFlow - https://us.ecoflow.com/products/river-2-pro-portable-power-station?variant=40322674262089&g_campaign_id=14455190349&g_adgroup_id=140929141909&gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAjw7NmzBhBLEiwAxrHQ-c-Fkst8tVSfh8rGGaE3jJgCPdW1p6j9bO40OUvLXI6X8-yOF3NNpBoCzHEQAvD_BwE&fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTAAAR10AeZ1gChOd-d_Z_xgaU0-EYUG69J8bHQ9p0PwDmCIGRq2zsmEyEhS1jQ_aem_wzm7U8c63-ACB7D_yKtSxg You charge this power station via vehicle or solar. I've used both.

These power stations are so much more versatile than a second battery in a vehicle. I didn't have this options 7 years ago.
Click to expand...
Totally gonna use a power station and try to run it off the main as you said. Do you have any recommendations for power stations, goalzero, ecoflow, jackery etc? I would also like to use solar in tandem with the inverter while driving, especially while parked in camp just to top off the station.
 
Therealtotodile said:
Totally gonna use a power station and try to run it off the main as you said. Do you have any recommendations for power stations, goalzero, ecoflow, jackery etc? I would also like to use solar in tandem with the inverter while driving, especially while parked in camp just to top off the station.
Click to expand...
You don't actually run the power station off of the battery, other than charging it. The power station is a stand alone "second accessory battery" for you to run all the accessories. Many of the power stations are really good. Stick with a brand name, determine what your power need are and choose the power accordingly. My power needs are about a 1500 watt draw for a 110 volt coffee maker so I chose a power station that would handle that. I use the Ecoflow that I linked.

You can use the solar while driving but most power stations don't have dual charging. You will typically use the 12 volt cig lighter as your charging source, that will likely be a better source while driving.
 
Dr Gil said:
You don't actually run the power station off of the battery, other than charging it. The power station is a stand alone "second accessory battery" for you to run all the accessories. Many of the power stations are really good. Stick with a brand name, determine what your power need are and choose the power accordingly. My power needs are about a 1500 watt draw for a 110 volt coffee maker so I chose a power station that would handle that. I use the Ecoflow that I linked.

You can use the solar while driving but most power stations don't have dual charging. You will typically use the 12 volt cig lighter as your charging source, that will likely be a better source while driving.
Click to expand...
Ok thanks for your recommendations man! So instead of using the cigarette lighter I would like to run an inverter from the battery to something like your recommended ecoflow to charge, and I need to figure out how large of an inverter I can safely run from the main battery while driving, to do that.

In my 2012 4runner, there was an AC plug that I would connect to a goal zero. I'm trying to recreate that setup in the cruiser.

1719800033742.png
 
Therealtotodile said:
Ok thanks for your recommendations man! So instead of using the cigarette lighter I would like to run an inverter from the battery to something like your recommended ecoflow to charge, and I need to figure out how large of an inverter I can safely run from the main battery while driving, to do that.

In my 2012 4runner, there was an AC plug that I would connect to a goal zero. I'm trying to recreate that setup in the cruiser.

View attachment 3666963
Click to expand...
Yes, you can do your set up no problem. Decide on Sine wave or modified inverter. A 1500 watt inverter will need at least 2 gauge cables from the battery to your inverter. Use a cable size calculator like this to determine what cable size you need to run. Error on the side of larger than smaller.
Use a circuit breaker as close to your battery as possible.
1719801290713.png
 
Dr Gil said:
Yes, you can do your set up no problem. Decide on Sine wave or modified inverter. A 1500 watt inverter will need at least 2 gauge cables from the battery to your inverter. Use a cable size calculator like this to determine what cable size you need to run. Error on the side of larger than smaller.
Use a circuit breaker as close to your battery as possible.
View attachment 3666980
Click to expand...
Do you think that running a 1500w inverter off of the main battery would be a bad idea? I have read that a couple times, and in this forum. I can't remember the exact post, but the mudder mentioned he runs a 1800 watt for like his whole cabin. I think he also mentioned he thought the draw from larger inverters is larger than the amperage the alternator could supply, and also said it might shorten battery life. Not sure if i got that correct but I'm sure you get me.
 
Therealtotodile said:
Do you think that running a 1500w inverter off of the main battery would be a bad idea? I have read that a couple times, and in this forum. I can't remember the exact post, but the mudder mentioned he runs a 1800 watt for like his whole cabin. I think he also mentioned he thought the draw from larger inverters is larger than the amperage the alternator could supply, and also said it might shorten battery life. Not sure if i got that correct but I'm sure you get me.
Click to expand...
Everyone has their own opinion about what they think is best. For me, I never want my starting battery to be compromised for any of my accessories. Sure you can use those jump start battery packs, but personally, I don't ever want to compromise that starter battery, even for a winch. That is why I ran a group 31 deep cycle in the past. So I don't think running the inverter off of the main battery is a bad idea, it's just more of a risk than running it off of a second accessory only battery.
 
Therealtotodile said:
Do you think that running a 1500w inverter off of the main battery would be a bad idea? I have read that a couple times, and in this forum. I can't remember the exact post, but the mudder mentioned he runs a 1800 watt for like his whole cabin. I think he also mentioned he thought the draw from larger inverters is larger than the amperage the alternator could supply, and also said it might shorten battery life. Not sure if i got that correct but I'm sure you get me.
Click to expand...
It all depends on how much power you are drawing and for how long.

For example, at 12v a 1500w inverter at full load is going to draw over 120A of current. That's not an issue with the stock setup if you have large enough cables and the load only lasts a short time (like running a toaster for a few minutes). At some point the charging system won't be able to keep up and the inverter will drop below its voltage limit and turn off.

That same 1500w inverter at 400w will only draw 30-40A. If you don't have a bunch of other loads at the same time this wouldn't be an issue.

Long story short you need to do a power calculation to see what it will take to accomplish your end goal.

Personally I'd setup a secondary lithium battery with significantly more capacity than the starting battery and charge it with a DC to DC charger. In that situation there's a known maximum load on the alternator, say 30A. Attach the "house" loads like an inverter to the second battery, if the secondary battery is discharged you can still start the vehicle and charge it back up.
 
Therealtotodile said:
I do not have any devices with very high power needs, just like normal camping gear like lights, phones, a small speaker, or other handheld devices.
Click to expand...
Just my opinion, so take it FWIW. I'm not an "overlander". I don't buy stuff to buy stuff. I do a fair amount of camping out of the truck and I like to keep things as simple as possible. I run a single battery with a fairly new Interstate AGM, good connections, properly sized wires, etc.

All of those items that you listed when combined won't draw anywhere close to 400 watts and can likely be charged directly from the vehicle using standard USB A or USB C and will have virtually no draw on the battery. Modern devices can last for days on a single charge depending on use. Why complicate things?

I have a Xantrex Xpower 450 Inverter that I keep in the truck in the event I need AC power. It's a modified sine wave, but works fine for multiple strings of LED camping lights, power tool battery chargers, etc.
I have quick disconnect Anderson Powerpoles on the unit and the mating connector runs to my underhood accessory fuse box (constant hot). When I need, it I plug it in. When not in use, it gets stored in the right rear cubby. Takes up no room, is lightweight, and has little impact on the vehicle battery.
I keep a 20' 16ga extension cord in the rear storage compartment if I need it.
 
I see a lot more people using these standalone portable power stations like the Goal Zero, Jackery or Bluetti for this use case.

I have a complicated, expensive and frankly overkill dual battery, redarc bcdc, solar, etc. in my 200 (and nothing but a starting battery in the 80). If I were to do it over again, I'd just buy one of these portable power stations.

Also, I'm not an electrician or especially knowledgeable about auto electrics, but isn't going DC to AC then back to DC - from a DC starting battery to a DC to AC inverter, to a (AC to DC) charger/transformer, to a DC portable power station battery wasteful - lossy (energy converted to heat), unnecessarily complicated, add many points of failure, and cost? Why not just charge a portable power station directly from your 12v starting battery?

It is worth checking each one, but most of these units should have a low voltage cutoff so it doesn't kill your starting battery.

Also, for the stuff you're talking about charging, I'd just get a cigar plug USB bus with multiple USB plugs.

You have plenty of juice to charge those small items. It might be different if you were charging camera batteries for a film crew, using electric appliances (coffee maker, blender, induction stoves, crock pot), charging many power tool or drone batteries constantly, running CPAPs overnight, etc., but for your stated needs, the starting battery alone should be fine.

Buy a NOCO jump pack or similar to avoid getting stuck in a pinch.
 
Last edited:
BucketEighty said:
I think you’re better off charging a brand-name stand-alone power station from its built in DC/DC charger using your cigarette lighter. That’s the whole point of the stand-alone power station, you don’t need to engineer anything and you can move it from vehicle to vehicle.

-Bucket
Click to expand...
See what you mean here. The one thing I hate about this is the location of the plug and the fact I will lose that plug for other charging. I’m trying to increase plugs, not just use the only available one I have for another purpose. I also would like the unit to be in the back of the truck most of the time, charging while I’m driving. No room for it up front. And based on what I have read, the dc to dc charge will be much longer than any ac power I can provide a power station.
 
jonheld said:
Just my opinion, so take it FWIW. I'm not an "overlander". I don't buy stuff to buy stuff. I do a fair amount of camping out of the truck and I like to keep things as simple as possible. I run a single battery with a fairly new Interstate AGM, good connections, properly sized wires, etc.

All of those items that you listed when combined won't draw anywhere close to 400 watts and can likely be charged directly from the vehicle using standard USB A or USB C and will have virtually no draw on the battery. Modern devices can last for days on a single charge depending on use. Why complicate things?

I have a Xantrex Xpower 450 Inverter that I keep in the truck in the event I need AC power. It's a modified sine wave, but works fine for multiple strings of LED camping lights, power tool battery chargers, etc.
I have quick disconnect Anderson Powerpoles on the unit and the mating connector runs to my underhood accessory fuse box (constant hot). When I need, it I plug it in. When not in use, it gets stored in the right rear cubby. Takes up no room, is lightweight, and has little impact on the vehicle battery.
I keep a 20' 16ga extension cord in the rear storage compartment if I need it.
Click to expand...
This really sounds like the setup I should go with.
 
Therealtotodile said:
See what you mean here. The one thing I hate about this is the location of the plug and the fact I will lose that plug for other charging. I’m trying to increase plugs, not just use the only available one I have for another purpose. I also would like the unit to be in the back of the truck most of the time, charging while I’m driving. No room for it up front. And based on what I have read, the dc to dc charge will be much longer than any ac power I can provide a power station.
Click to expand...
So add plugs. A heavy gauge wire to an auxiliary fuse panel and then as many plugs as your panel rating will allow. I have a total of six different ones in the back of my 200. I use Bluesea marine products exclusively. You can mix and match cigar, powerlet, USB A, USB C, etc.
 
It can charge up to 800w while you drive, though I'm not sure if our alternators can produce enough to charge at the full 800w. Real simple installation too which is nice.
 
jonheld said:
All of those items that you listed when combined won't draw anywhere close to 400 watts and can likely be charged directly from the vehicle using standard USB A or USB C and will have virtually no draw on the battery. Modern devices can last for days on a single charge depending on use. Why complicate things?
Click to expand...
Was reading through this and Jon took the words right outta my mouth. Most of the devices you listed are typically USB rechargable. Powerwerx offers a variety of USB power outlets, including the new fast charge ones. These can be wired directly into your 12 volt system,

Another thing youy can do is to wire some USB ports to be on only when the truck is running, typically through the ciggie lighter circuit. The others will be wired through an always on circuit.

Inverters always take power to run, even when idling. I run two, but only for when they are needed.
 
Last edited:
CharlieS said:
So add plugs. A heavy gauge wire to an auxiliary fuse panel and then as many plugs as your panel rating will allow. I have a total of six different ones in the back of my 200. I use Bluesea marine products exclusively. You can mix and match cigar, powerlet, USB A, USB C, etc.
Click to expand...
I enlarged the 3rd row seat ashtray hole for a dual Blue Sea panel. Standard 12V for my fridge and dual USB A. Wired to my aux fuse panel (constant hot). Phone charges while i sleep and I run a USB powered clip on fan.
Speaking of fans, I was at my nephew's apartment meeting his new daughter. Took a look at their stroller and noticed a very cool stroller fan. USB C rechargeable, 3 speeds, LED lights, and 3 flexible legs that can wrap around anything. Ordered it on the spot from Amazon. Can hook to one of the grab handles in the back.

1719869587775.jpeg
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

J
3000w inverter wiring
2
Replies
26
Views
1K
Rwhat
Rwhat
WMan84
Low Beam Housing Part Needed
Replies
4
Views
483
WMan84
WMan84
claiborne86
Power steering ISSUES Need some HELP!!
Replies
13
Views
736
COS80
COS80
jakebarlow123
HELP 1hdt lacking power
Replies
11
Views
473
jakebarlow123
jakebarlow123

Users who are viewing this thread

Total: 2 (members: 0, guests: 2)

Share this page

Back
Top Bottom