Intermittent Starting Issues - FJ60

[FJ60FINN]

I have a 1985 FJ60 that randomly does not start. It must be something electrical because it will start most of the time with no issues. The battery is new and charged, the post connections are tight. All the running lights, AC, radio, etc come on as normal but when I turn the key there is nothing. This happens sometimes on the first attempt and other times has happened after I drive it and then try to restart.

Thinking it could be the ignition coil or something related that sends the signal to the starter. Anyone have any ideas?

Thanks

 

[OSS]

If you turn the key and Mr. Starter ignores you, time for a new starter if you can't remember the last time it was replaced.
Or if you want to take it apart, it might be fixable if you're into tinkering.

 

[MTB Land Cruise]

I have a 1985 FJ60 that randomly does not start. It must be something electrical because it will start most of the time with no issues. The battery is new and charged, the post connections are tight. All the running lights, AC, radio, etc come on as normal but when I turn the key there is nothing. This happens sometimes on the first attempt and other times has happened after I drive it and then try to restart.

Thinking it could be the ignition coil or something related that sends the signal to the starter. Anyone have any ideas?

Thanks

Sounds like the starter. Next time you turn the key and no start... tap the starter a couple of times... then try to start. If it starts... replace the starter....

 

[FJ60FINN]

Sounds like the starter. Next time you turn the key and no start... tap the starter a couple of times... then try to start. If it starts... replace the starter....

Thanks for the feedback. All the best.

 

[Seth S]

Do you here the starter solenoid clicking when it doesn't start?

 

[FJ60FINN]

Do you here the starter solenoid clicking when it doesn't start?

No. I hear nothing. Its almost like its disconnected somewhere between the keyed ignition and the starter (unless it's the starter itself)

 

[Seth S]

No. I hear nothing. Its almost like its disconnected somewhere between the keyed ignition and the starter (unless it's the starter itself)

If you turn the key and just get silence I wouldn't assume the starter until I did my testing an verified it. If you turn the key to the crank position and nothing happens do all the lights dim? A better way to check this is to hook a meter to the battery to read the voltage and try cranking. If when you turn the key and nothing happens but the battery voltage drops then you know that your starter trigger circuit is working but the starter is not firing....and sounds like its a starter solenoid issue. If the starter itself were bad you should still hear the solenoid firing (clicking).


I know you said the battery connections are tight but I'd pull them off, make sure the posts and inside of the terminals are clean and then reinstall. Inspect the condition of your battery ground and power cables where they connect to the terminals and check any ground connections where they attach to the body or engine.
Also inspect your fusible link.

next time you turn the key and nothing happens try wacking the outside of the starter with a block of wood. give it a good womp and then see if it does anything when you try to start. If it turns after a hit or two then definitely a starter issue.

 

[FJ60FINN]

If you turn the key and just get silence I wouldn't assume the starter until I did my testing an verified it. If you turn the key to the crank position and nothing happens do all the lights dim? A better way to check this is to hook a meter to the battery to read the voltage and try cranking. If when you turn the key and nothing happens but the battery voltage drops then you know that your starter trigger circuit is working but the starter is not firing....and sounds like its a starter solenoid issue. If the starter itself were bad you should still hear the solenoid firing (clicking).


I know you said the battery connections are tight but I'd pull them off, make sure the posts and inside of the terminals are clean and then reinstall. Inspect the condition of your battery ground and power cables where they connect to the terminals and check any ground connections where they attach to the body or engine.
Also inspect your fusible link.

next time you turn the key and nothing happens try wacking the outside of the starter with a block of wood. give it a good womp and then see if it does anything when you try to start. If it turns after a hit or two then definitely a starter issue.

Wow thank you so much for the thorough run down of potential causes! Really appreciate it!

 

[Spike Strip]

This situation comes up a few times a year ---

Most likely is the starter, but if you rule that out, next suspect is the Ignition Switch - NOT the key tumbler, but the electrical switch behind it that directs current to the different circuits as you turn the key. There are contacts that wear and after some 20K cycles, can cause exactly this situation.

 

[FJ60FINN]

Thank you so much for your thoughts. This is all super helpful.

 

[Beehanger]

This situation comes up a few times a year ---

Most likely is the starter, but if you rule that out, next suspect is the Ignition Switch - NOT the key tumbler, but the electrical switch behind it that directs current to the different circuits as you turn the key. There are contacts that wear and after some 20K cycles, can cause exactly this situation.

Curious about this spike strip... I'm having issues starting my rig. I get a click the first crank, then nothing. Doing the exact same thing with the new starter. This is annoying!

Hoping this incomplete thread can continue on my new one:

Starter clicking noise but no startup... FJ60

Hi guys, I'm 26 and my 85 fj60 is my daily. (haven't been able to daily it in 2.5 years....lol) Coming off a huge rebuild process and now having starting issues with the starter/ignition. I get a click the first crank, then nothing. The starter gradually starter sounding weaker and weaker. I...

forum.ih8mud.com

TLDR Do some guys install after-market relays and bypass as the solution to this? (timestamp 730 of this video... )

Thanks, Dan

 

[Beehanger]

Thank you so much for your thoughts. This is all super helpful.

What ended up happening?

 

[Spike Strip]

The Electrical switch behind ignition key does go bad when the brass contacts wear out. The one for your year is discontinued, but you can use an earlier one, you'll just lose the buzzer function when key is left in the tumbler and door open. Available from Toyota. Also, Rock Auto has aftermarket, if you look at the 1983 LC. You'll need the one for the 4-door. The two-door is FJ40

 

[Beehanger]

The Electrical switch behind ignition key does go bad when the brass contacts wear out. The one for your year is discontinued, but you can use an earlier one, you'll just lose the buzzer function when key is left in the tumbler and door open. Available from Toyota. Also, Rock Auto has aftermarket, if you look at the 1983 LC. You'll need the one for the 4-door. The two-door is FJ40

AWESOME. I’ll look into this.

Cheers man!

 

[wunu]

This situation comes up a few times a year ---

Most likely is the starter, but if you rule that out, next suspect is the Ignition Switch - NOT the key tumbler, but the electrical switch behind it that directs current to the different circuits as you turn the key. There are contacts that wear and after some 20K cycles, can cause exactly this situation.

Hey Spike Strip, I replaced my starter and solenoid when I began needing to hit my starter with a hammer to start sometimes. Seemed okay but now (about a year later) I'm having an intermittent issue with starting, similar to that described in this thread. Dash lights on, no sound from starter, fan for the cabin air blows. It seems to maybe occur with a hot engine but not every time it's hot. A guy smacked my starter today at home depot when I was stuck and it started right up when I turned the key while he did. I have two questions if you're willing and have ideas I'd be grateful for them.
The first time this happened, i was in Baja on a week long (and hot) trip. Maybe the 3rd day in the evening after a long day of driving. It didnt happen again for 4 or 5 months; now frequently.
My key used to come out of the ignition when it wasn't all the way into the off position and I would get a buzz to remind me to put the key back in, push the button, and return it to the fully off position. Recently I have not been able to remove the key until I pushed the button and moved it to the fully off position which I believe is how it should work. This is a recent development.
Secondly, I struggle with leverage, upper body and grip strength at 5 feet tall and small. I used a cheater bar on a wrench hit with a hammer to tighten some of the bolts I simply couldn't reach. (From top or bottom) There wasn't a lot of room for the cheater bar and from underneath I had to put a block under my elbow to stop shaking under the weight of the starter after a few minutes. All this to say that although I inspected it at the time and again today, if I didn't tighten things up all the way is it possible that vibration could be a factor after all this time if things are a little looser than they should be? It's plausible that everything might not be tight enough.
Since reading different threads I'm guessing it's likely that switch at the ignition. My horn only sounds when it's not dead center and when I had a landcruiser guy do a stem to stern inspection a couple years ago, he pointed out the steering column was a little loose in a way he hadn't seen before. (I corrected almost all of his other recomendations)
I'd be glad to hear from you if you're inclined to offer me advice about fixes and/ or order of operations to rule things in or out.

Thanks!

 

[Mark W]

Hey Spike Strip, I replaced my starter and solenoid when I began needing to hit my starter with a hammer to start sometimes. Seemed okay but now (about a year later) I'm having an intermittent issue with starting, similar to that described in this thread. Dash lights on, no sound from starter, fan for the cabin air blows. It seems to maybe occur with a hot engine but not every time it's hot. A guy smacked my starter today at home depot when I was stuck and it started right up when I turned the key while he did.

From this, the problem is almost certainly the starter. The starter solenoid actually. It is not uncommon for realtively new replacement starters to exhibit this, just like an older starter will. The reason is burnt/pitted solenoid contacts. The cause in a newer starter is inaccurate assembly at the factory. The contacts were installed just a tiny bit canted due to lack of care (and understanding) of the guys on the assembly line and the quality control inspectors (if there even are any). If the contacts are not installed true, the slightly offset mating results in reduced surface area for the electricity to pass through. This increases arcing and burning of the surface and it soon degrades.

Replacement contacts for the solenoid can be purchased at any decent parts store. Installation of the new contacts is no more difficult (easier usually) that removal of the starter. New properly installed contacts should have your starter ready to go for years (like it should have been when you bought it).


Mark...

 

[Spike Strip]

What Mark said.

Reman parts are getting increasingly worse, particularly cheap auto parts store brands

 

[wunu]

From this, the problem is almost certainly the starter. The starter solenoid actually. It is not uncommon for realtively new replacement starters to exhibit this, just like an older starter will. The reason is burnt/pitted solenoid contacts. The cause in a newer starter is inaccurate assembly at the factory. The contacts were installed just a tiny bit canted due to lack of care (and understanding) of the guys on the assembly line and the quality control inspectors (if there even are any). If the contacts are not installed true, the slightly offset mating results in reduced surface area for the electricity to pass through. This increases arcing and burning of the surface and it soon degrades.

Replacement contacts for the solenoid can be purchased at any decent parts store. Installation of the new contacts is no more difficult (easier usually) that removal of the starter. New properly installed contacts should have your starter ready to go for years (like it should have been when you bought it).


Mark...

Mark & Spikestrip thank you for the quick response. Okay, I'll head over to O'Reilly and see if they have what I need in stock, or I'll order. I really appreciate you taking the time.

 

[Spike Strip]

There are also various aftermarket rebuild kits available for the Denso starter, but here are the part # you can use for cross reference. (Don't trust the counter-jockey to do it right).

Here are the Toyota part #s for a starter rebuild.

I just got done rebuilding the starter on my '87 and I thought I would share the part numbers for the contacts and the plunger. I got the parts from Cdan, and he had to cross reference the numbers for a 3FE starter in an early 80 series. The Toyota computer does not show the individual parts...

forum.ih8mud.com

 

[wunu]

There are also various aftermarket rebuild kits available for the Denso starter, but here are the part # you can use for cross reference. (Don't trust the counter-jockey to do it right).

Here are the Toyota part #s for a starter rebuild.

I just got done rebuilding the starter on my '87 and I thought I would share the part numbers for the contacts and the plunger. I got the parts from Cdan, and he had to cross reference the numbers for a 3FE starter in an early 80 series. The Toyota computer does not show the individual parts...

forum.ih8mud.com

I appreciate this so much. It's an OReilly purchased starter that's still under warranty but I'm sure it will bench test okay for them because this failure is in conjuction with heat. Also, I'll learn more attempting the rebuild. Thanks!