IBS Dual Battery System from Slee (1 Viewer)

[Romer]

For me it was the massive display of the Nat. Luna... Couldn't see where I would put that. The controller of the ibs otoh fits great on top of AHC control I don't have..

That, and I am close to Slee's shop in case do future post-purchase support (hasn't happened)

same with me on both counts

 

[cruiseroutfit]

What about control logic? Do both charge the starting battery first before switching over?

The National Luna has a timer that activates as soon as the voltage in the primary battery hits 13.1V, ie it is charging. It charges for 5 minutes and then engages the solenoid to allow split charging. As soon as charging drops below 12.7 (engine not running or major load on battery) it will disconnect. The user has the option to over-ride for winching, self-jumping a dead start battery, accessories when engine off, etc.

The IBS simply connects both batteries as soon as the charge voltage hits 13.1V (charging) and disconnects when draining (not charging, engine off) It allows a manual over-ride to pair them up or to lock them from being paired as well for self jumping or high accessory loads when not running.

Both have over-charge and low voltage alarms that can be silenced. You can dim the display on the IBS which is cool but only turn if completely on and off on the NL. All in all they are very similar and price is pretty close, you need to buy the RBS module to be able to link the IBS when the main battery is really low (or missing). Again I think the fit kit is better with the Luna, cables are double insulated, better connectors, comes with Hella fuses assemblies and the battery terminals are nicer. Either kit is going to be a nice manually controlled option and some may find features and aesthetics better than others too

Thinking perhaps an option would be to go Nat'l Luna with just the controller and solenoid. Puts the price around $250. Then source my own wire, fuse, and connectors. I see they have a flush mount display, but it doesn't say "controller" even though it appears to have the same buttons. Anyone know if there is a difference to the electronics? I'd think the flush mount could go right in the overhead opener pocket.

Great way to go if you have good wiring supply sources, less expensive in the long run for many. The flush mounts are monitors only to my knowledge, best bet would be to contact Paul @ Equipt1.com on that question as he is the US distributor of the NL products. The flush mount could be a really neat option for dual controlling, if they don't make it now its possible they could put one together for you on a special order, a good chunk of their stuff is made in house and they have engineers on site in Africa. To be fair, I'm pretty sure you can buy IBS relays and battery monitors separate as well, I know the relay boost module is a separate component. Bet one could do the IBS parts and their own wiring for a similar cost?

 

[cruiseroutfit]

So about this massive talk I didn't have an IBS kit or an IBS equipped truck at the shop today but should later this week. I did find specs on the IBS manufacture site for the controller that seems about right: 100mm x 65mm x 24mm

So roughly 4" x 2.5" x 1"? Seems about right in my mind. Can one of you with the IBS kit measure your controller to confirm?

Manufacture specs for the NL are: 107mm (l) x 48mm (w) x 20mm (h)

So roughly 4.25" x 2" x .75"? That seems right too but I'll have to measure tomorrow.

Assuming those numbers are correct and the fact dept is really a non issue, the IBS still takes up more real estate on the dash

Massive schmassive

 

[RobRed]

Pretty small really

 

[cruiseroutfit]

Pretty small really

Have a tape measure handy?

 

[CappyKD]

What about control logic? Do both charge the starting battery first before switching over?

Thinking perhaps an option would be to go Nat'l Luna with just the controller and solenoid. Puts the price around $250. Then source my own wire, fuse, and connectors. I see they have a flush mount display, but it doesn't say "controller" even though it appears to have the same buttons. Anyone know if there is a difference to the electronics? I'd think the flush mount could go right in the overhead opener pocket.

Take a good look at the 275 amp Iron Man unit. I considered all three before going with the Iron Man. The Iron Man does check and charge the main batt before it will charge the Aux.

 

[OregonLC]

Take a good look at the 275 amp Iron Man unit. I considered all three before going with the Iron Man. The Iron Man does check and charge the main batt before it will charge the Aux.

Good idea. Somehow that kit didn't show up on google for 'dual battery kit'. I like the manual switch feature. Would be nice to go 'old school' and turn the knob when needed. Although, jumper cables could do the same.

How durable do you suppose the 'motor' is? Does the servo motor only control the override? Or is it the primary means of switching? That is, is there a conventional relay for daily use and the motor is only used to remote the switch when needed?


Purchase: http://trdparts4u.toyotaofdallas.com/scripts/prodView.asp?idproduct=-9168

Ironman site: http://www.ironman4x4.com/html/motorised275amp.html

 

[OregonLC]

Interesting post on the Ironman (and dual battery strategy in general) over at Portal.

http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/threads/42170-Ironman-4x4-Dual-Battery-Kit

They have some good points. Almost makes me think that a pure manual system coupled with a amp hour counter might be a better solution.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/eLITE-BATTERY-MONITOR-A-FUEL-GAUGE-for-your-BATTERY-ideal-for-DUAL-BATTERIES-/320824351273

 

[CappyKD]

Some of the statements on there are wrong. Others are spot on. As soon as I shut my truck off the system disconnects the aux from the main battery. If I start it the aux is disconnected until the main reaches the voltage specified and then the aux is engaged for charging. I run a matched set of Deep Cycle AGM DH Plat batteries so I have no voltage differences to worry about. As for the durability of the stepper motor, I can't say, It seems that the motor merely engages the solenoid as you can override via the yellow knob. The Iron Man setup is a re-badged Zep Marine system from AU. One other thing to consider is amperage capabilities. The IM is 275A Cont. and 1250A burst. Compare that to the NL and IBS.

HTH

 

[OregonLC]

I guess the question I need to understand is 'how valid is voltage as a control input'?

The Ironman is 13.7V, NL and IBS are 13.2V IIRC. If, as the Portal link says, a healthy alternator can quickly buoy the starting voltage above the 13.2 or 13.7 threshold AND the hotel battery is significantly discharged then the circuit could be prompted to open too soon before the starting batt is fully charged. In my case, the 31 as a hotel may take a good amount of suck and there could be scenarios where it leaves the starting battery incompletely charged.

There's also good discussion about the 12.2V Ironman cutoff as being too low, partially depleting the starting batt before clamping off. On the one hand, it could be a nice 'feature' to have both 31 and 34 powering hotel loads until the common voltage drops below 31. On the other, reliability trumps in my book and a depleted starting batt defeats the whole purpose of a dual system. Then again, both batts are marine deep cycle in my system so maybe this isn't that big of an issue.

Further, in typical deployments, it would be rare to have a short drive cycle unless it's just a re-charge idle-only cycle.

 

[RobRed]

Have a tape measure handy?

I'm in the BMW today. Happy to measure when I get home tonight.

 

[CappyKD]

I guess the question I need to understand is 'how valid is voltage as a control input'?

The Ironman is 13.7V, NL and IBS are 13.2V IIRC. If, as the Portal link says, a healthy alternator can quickly buoy the starting voltage above the 13.2 or 13.7 threshold AND the hotel battery is significantly discharged then the circuit could be prompted to open too soon before the starting batt is fully charged. In my case, the 31 as a hotel may take a good amount of suck and there could be scenarios where it leaves the starting battery incompletely charged.

There's also good discussion about the 12.2V Ironman cutoff as being too low, partially depleting the starting batt before clamping off. On the one hand, it could be a nice 'feature' to have both 31 and 34 powering hotel loads until the common voltage drops below 31. On the other, reliability trumps in my book and a depleted starting batt defeats the whole purpose of a dual system. Then again, both batts are marine deep cycle in my system so maybe this isn't that big of an issue.

Further, in typical deployments, it would be rare to have a short drive cycle unless it's just a re-charge idle-only cycle.

The Iron Man instructions are a misprint. I was also wrong in saying ZEP Marine. It is actually made by BEP Marine. the cutoff is actually 12.8 volts.

http://www.bepmarine.com/media/product/pro4cd73148082df.pdf

HTH

 

[OregonLC]

Great link. But I think it might be the 720-MDVS. So for an extra $155 in the Ironman kit you get a display, a switch, and some cable. Might be worth it.

There also is more detail on the BEP site about the voltage sensing/engine running. Two different set points, 12.2 and 13.0. Also, override is 10 minute momentary. Seems like a nice setup.

http://www.bepmarine.com/home-mainmenu-8/product-350/701-mdvs-high-current-remote-operated-vss-275-amps

http://www.boatersplus.com/bep-marine-275amp-battery-switch-control-en.html?utm_source=pricegrabber&utm_medium=cse&utm_content=EB-6033013&utm_campaign=pricegrabber


Then run a separate amp hour sensing gauge:

http://www.xantrex.com/power-products/power-accessories/linklite-battery-monitor.aspx