Help needed; how to weld a cracked/separated engine mount bracket?

[Kernal]

Anyone here have experience on welding a cracked engine mount bracket? The crack (96-80 right side) almost looks like a separation between the original weld and the bracket at the top side of the frame, maybe even a bad weld from the factory?? I'm wondering if the entire old bead should be ground out, or just grind V between the bracket and the old bead, or weld a small plate to go over the cracked area, and type of welding is best for this repair? If MIG is best what settings should be used?? I have access to a MIG welder just no experience so may not do it myself, either way I'm trying to figure out what's the correct way to repair this. Doesn't show up in the photos but the engine and everything else is still in the engine bay. Thanks.

 

[Dieseler]

V it out so there is some gap clean and degrease and blast in a new weld at a high setting make sure you burning it in HOT so you get good penetration,you may want to test on some sc**p metal first so all your settings and speed are correct.

 

[Kernal]

Something I know nothing about is how to avoid affecting the tensile strength of frame, like if welded incorrectly?? I will have to practice if I do it myself.

 

[Chop Shop]

Just drive to your local muffler shop and give the guy $20 to put a weld on it.

 

[Kernal]

Thanks, but if I have someone else do it I would like to know how it should be done beforehand. So far it sounds like grinding a V at the crack and running a bead.

 

[Toyrolet]

So far it sounds like grinding a V at the crack and running a bead.

Yes, but unless you are a good welder, have someone else do it. If the MIG is a 110v unit you will pretty much have to use the highest heat setting to get good penetration. You want it HOT like Dieseler said. No worries about the tensile strength of the frame.

If your not a good welder,but want to do it yourself, spend a few days running beads on scrap of the same thickness until you are happy with your welds. It's harder than it looks at first. I would remove it as well unless an experienced welder is doing it in the rig.

 

[Kernal]

The bracket itself is not cracked, the crack is at the factory weld where the top edge of the bracket meets the frame rail; in the photos above the frame rail is to the left of the crack and the bracket is on the right. There are two wings of the bracket that are also welded to the vertical engine side of the frame; those appear to be good. This is the right/PS bracket so the air filter can/muffler and intake tube will have to be removed, there's also an AC line less than a foot away; it will have to be welded in the truck. When someone says get it hot, how do you gauge that? Is that a setting on the welding machine or just the way it looks when welding? If I can find an experienced welder I'll have him do it most likely, but I need to know something about welding in order to tell if he knows what he's doing.

 

[Toyrolet]

I didn't realize it was welded to the frame.

Any good welder will be able to tell you more than me, I'm a hack job welder, but getting better.

If you're not sure if they're any good ask to see some examples of their frame welds. I would think that any certified, professional welder, in a reputable shop would know what he's doing, but I've been wrong before.

 

[craptabulous]

if your not comfortable doing it go to a welder , they will charge you about 20-30$ . muffler shop welders aren't welders . in canada welders are ether a c,b or a . any are great a b and a level are pretty good welders .

i would skip the mig , not worry about any prep , run a 6010 root pass and a 7018 cap fairly hot . or just skip them both and run arctec 223 its around 80-90 thousands pounds tensile strength and burns through paint like butter . grinding a v notch is never a bad idea , its just the fact that its 1/8th of an inch thick . there will be so much penetration you won't have a problem .

a real welder will throw a fire blanket over anything he is concerned about weasel his way in there and one hand it . an actual welding shop is very approachable they will probably do it in the parking lot and ask for a 20$

 

[Kernal]

Toyolet: you can see in the middle photo how the top edge of the bracket comes over the top of the frame rail by an inch or so then is welded.

crraptabulous: Thanks for the suggestions and tech specs.

I called around and went to two places; a dealer and a custom body shop. The dealership welder said no problem, 4 hours labor, with tax $187. The body shop guy said he'd use a 220V MIG welder set in the middle of the power range. He said $100-150.

 

[Chop Shop]

Dude this is the hardcore section. You are way overthinking this.

We have welded tones of shiit like that on the trail in the woods with the wrong tools lots of times.

Its a weld that was made originally by a bad welding robot.

Any toothless fellar that over 35 years old at a muffler shop will weld that in about 20 minutes for 20-30 dollars. Less if you bring him beer.


Its one liddle widdle weld. On a motor mount. Your not driving the space shuttle.

 

[Chop Shop]

150 - 187 dollars to weld a 3 inch long crack?

That price is like a red hot poker in the crack.

Any honest and competent shop can repair that properly in way less than an hour.

 

[Kernal]

Chop Shop; I posted here figuring you guys would have some welding experience and I've gotten some very good info and suggestions which has helped me think it through. I'll check around some more before I have someone fix it. Thanks.

 

[Dieseler]

Word of advice don't let a mufflershop do it sure they can weld a muffler these guys are high school welders anyone with proper certification would not be working at a muffler shop.
If you were in my neck of the woods I would do it for 50 and I am certified.

 

[Kernal]

Dieseler: like you said, when I mentioned a muffler shop the welder at the dealership sorta grinned, said they might can weld muffler pipe but this is different. He was in the middle of replacing the front couple of feet of frame rail on a pick-up truck and showed me his welds; looked lumpy like maybe he was pushing back as he was pulling, like big waves. IDK. Watched a bunch of video clips on youtube, some pushing, some pulling, these beads look good, what do you think?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w4RrDeUKcH4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N7CJwS5isrQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bUVgNpGqd-Q

 

[Kernal]

Got the crack welded up, don't know if the welder did any grinding first or just ran a bead on top of everything. In the middle photo you can see some discoloration of the steel which from watching the youtube training video clips apparently means he got it hot enough to make a good weld.

 

[GLTHFJ60]

It looks like a weld.

I think you're being too particular about this, especially considering you weren't doing it yourself. Just out of curiosity, how much you pay to have it done?

 

[Kernal]

And I think you're over-thinking that I'm over-particular about this.

The total cost was $187.00 at a Toyota dealer done by their certified body shop welder. The cost was higher than I would have liked but he didn't burn through any hoses, the AC line, or any harnesses, and I know it's done right by a welder with lots of experience welding on frames, you gets what you pays for. I did get some valuable advice from the posters here and appreciate it greatly. Thanks.

 

[Chop Shop]

I would always trust a "how to video" from youtube to help you evaluate things.

The dealership thrives on decision makers like yourself that like to feel comfortable.

That is just an average ol looking weld. Not horrible by any means but I just thought ONE weld for 187 bucks would be gold or hand signed or TIGed or sumtin cool like dat.

Or at least look nice and smooth and uniform. It was probably the toyota spray paint that ran the bill up so high.

 

[lehiguy]

For the money paid, you would have been half-way to buying your own welder which I consider to be the best tool investment I ever made. I taught myself and nothing has ever failed that I put together.