H55 to an early 80s B3?

[ylexot]

Does anyone know anything about input shaft issues for an H55 and an 81 B3? I haven't bought the tranny yet, is there a particular year(s) of H55s that will be an easy fit?

What can I do ahead of time to minimize the amount of downtime once I disassemble my drive trains, etc.?

Thanks.

 

[cruiser_guy]

ANY H55 that was made for the 3B will fit!! Get one from a rusted out Canadian BJ60.

 

[Spore]

I am rebuilding an old h55f right now and converting my '81 bj42 from 4 to 5sp. You will have to relocate the shifter holes in the floor and adjust the lengths of your driveshafts (h55f is about 3.5" longer than the 4sp). Make sure you get the transfercase with the new (used) 5sp and make sure it came from a bj series with a 3b engine.

 

[cruiser_guy]

You will have to relocate the shifter holes in the floor and adjust the lengths of your driveshafts (h55f is about 3.5" longer than the 4sp). Make sure you get the transfercase with the new (used) 5sp and make sure it came from a bj series with a 3b engine.

On the BJ60 you do NOT need to adjust the holes in the floor other than a slight amount for the transfer I think (if you have the tranny cover for the 5 speed use that and you'll be fine). I did this with my '82 BJ60.

On a BJ42 IF you can find the tranny top cover from a later model that came with the 5 speed you'll likely be fine as well.

The BJ42 and BJ60 used a different tranny top cover that positioned the shifter either towards the rear like a BJ60 or towards the front like a BJ42.

 

[rick_d]

H55 skinny:

There are two versions of the H55, an early 1983-1986 and a later 1987-1999.

Input shaft compatability does not crossover from early to late.

If you want to rebuild the transmission, you must make sure you get the right kit for the year.

..that said, all 3B north american highway vehicles which got a H55 are only the early style. The H55 we can buy new at dealers are late versions, and have a 10 spline input which fits H and F engines (note: NOT HZ engine types). Most late 3B H55's are JDM donors.

The early H55 can have either a 3B 21 spline input or a 10 spline H/F input.

The late H55's can have 3B, HZ, or H/F inputs (the three are different).

A 3B transmission from either vintage will fit the the cast iron or aluminum bellhousings for the 3B.

 

[ylexot]

Thanks guys, this is very helpful.

So if H55s can come in two basic configurations, 10 spline vs 22 spline, how easy is it to convert from one to the other?

Does anyone know a good source for a NA B3 donor tranny?

If I find the trany without the trasfer case, will my current transfer case bolt onto the H55?

Thanks again.

 

[ylexot]

I spoke to a guy at Man-A-Fre about the input shaft. According to him, all I need is to get a new clutch. The implication was that the new clutch would serve as an adapter between my 81 B3 and the the H55 set up for a 6 cylinder engine.

This is the clutch kit he recommended:
http://www.man-a-fre.com/parts_accessories/clutchkitdiaphragmstyle.htm

Can anyone confirm this?

Also, do I need a crossmember support for the H55?

 

[ylexot]

Just in case another rookie was waiting for an answer to whether a clutch can serve as a spline adapter.... The answer is yes.

The LC clutch kits available from MAF will bolt onto a B3 and have a friction plate with the correct spline count (10) for an H55 originally built for a 6 cylinder, 2F or 2H.

So it sounds like the options are wide open for me as I was going to get a new clutch anyway.

Thanks for the help.

 

[rick_d]

since the genius at MAF told you so, it must be right.

....well, a 3B 21 spline input is longer than a HZ 21 spline input which is longer than a 2H 10 spline input.

so you install the 2H w/ 10 spline clutch disk in a 3B bellhousing.

only minor problems like the input shaft does not enter the pilot bearing and the clutch only uses 50% (I'm guessing) of the spline....no worries.

and the HZ is no better.

You could build bellhousing shims the other way, but why?

 

[ylexot]

Thanks rick_d!

I thought I had read somewhere that the input shaft was longer on the 3B, but couldn't find it again to confirm. How much longer are we talking about here? 1, 2, 3, 8cm?

Do the bell housings from a 2H/2F bolt onto the 3B? That begs the question whether 2H and 2F transmissions are plug and play. Is this true?

Thanks again.

 

[UpsideDown]

I thought I had read somewhere that the input shaft was longer on the 3B, but couldn't find it again to confirm. How much longer are we talking about here? 1, 2, 3, 8cm?

Do the bell housings from a 2H/2F bolt onto the 3B? That begs the question whether 2H and 2F transmissions are plug and play. Is this true?

Thanks again.

The bellhousings are not compatible. You need a 3B bellhousing; the one from your 4 speed will be fine.

The length for the input shaft is in the range of 5 cms when comparing an H/F version to a B version. They are not compatible. The H/F versions are somewhat more rare than the B versions in Canada (fewer sold). The H/F versions would be pretty much plug-n-play in an H/F equipped vehicle (though some crossmember relocation may be needed etc...).

 

[Tapage]

There is a thread here of someone ( I thought Australia ) that make an oinput swap with no issues and other that do the same and have a sooner problems with the input shaft ..

 

[rick_d]

the problem here is not if input shaft will swap between transmissions, it is that some dildo at MAF said that a F/2H or "6 cylinder" transmission will fit w/ clutch disk in a 3B bellhousing, pressure plate etc. You can't bolt a 2F pp to a 3B flywheel....

input shaft from face of transmission iron to tip of input

2F/2H = 180 mm
----.590" diameter of pilot bearing part of input shaft

3B = 210mm
----.470" diameter of pilot bearing part of input shaft

...and for giggles:

HZ = 190mm
----.590" diameter of pilot bearing part of input shaft

 

[Icky]

The other problem you're going to have, other than the ones rick_d has pointed out, is the pilot bearing. Not certain of the OD dimensions of the pilot bearings, but my experience is that if the ID is different the OD and possibly the thickness is going to be different.
With luck, you might be able to find a custom bearing for it as they make bearings in a gajillion sizes.

The 3B pilot bearing is miniscule compared to the 6-cylinder pilot bearings. The best solution for this whole problem is the proper transmission OR an input shaft swap. (Get a brand new transmission (33030-60450) from a north American Toyota dealer. They come configured for 2F. Then swap the input shaft to 3B.) Put a 3B input shaft into the 6-cylinder transmission.

 

[bull]

Here is a visual to Rick's post

2H VS 1HZ

from here

https://forum.ih8mud.com/showthread.php?t=138646

 

[rick_d]

21 spline inputs

...and the fact that HZ transmissions are rare in the US. My guess is about 24 exist in some form, mostly tied behind transplant engines.

so you might get one to fit with a funky pilot bearing, but throw out etc would have to be tested.


3B's H55's are vastly more common, but most will be the early vintage.

30mm overall length and the spline and machining characteristics I believe prove my MAF was incorrect when he suggested a 2F transplant.

 

[ylexot]

This is great stuff!

Fortunately I haven't bought anything yet. I did get a hold of someone at SOR that mentioned SOME of the items above. The good news he had was he thought there must be 50 5-speeds in the back lot that would fit my rig and the correct clutch kit to boot. (I knew the MAF solution sounded too easy.)

How bullet proof are the H55s? How likely is it I can get one that hasn't been rebuilt, install it, and NOT wish I had bought one already rebuilt?

I think a transmission rebuild is beyond my ability right now. I don't want to get it into my rig just to take it to a tranny shop and shell out 1-2k for a rebuild 2mo later.

 

[Tapage]

How bullet proof are the H55s?

Bullet . ? naaaaaa bomb proof !

Mine have more than half million km on it ..

 

[kim]

Bullet . ? naaaaaa bomb proof !

Mine have more than half million km on it ..

Same here!

 

[ylexot]

that's good to hear... so it sounds like your experience is that an H55 is likely to be good to go without a rebuild?

I've found one in a junk yard... I have no idea about it's condition yet. What are the tell tale signs, upon visual inspection, if any that the unit needs to be rebuilt? Or do I just have to install it and see how it goes?