FJ62 Transmision Oil Idiot Light questions and advice

[Mackeath]

Greetings,

Once again, I am seriously mechanically uncapable, so please be patient with me on my questions.

I have been all through the posts and have ended up a bit confused as to what might be causing this, a bad tranny, too fast driving, or a kink in the lines. Or, something else entirely.

I am working, occasionally, near Tucson Arizona. That is a 500 mile drive for me and while it isn't the middle summer still, it can get a little warm.

Highway speeds at 75 pretty much the whole way and I have a 1988 FJ62 with 184000 miles.

I took it on the most recent trip (and will have to again in October) and after 120 miles of driving around 65 to 70 miles an hour, the light came on. It is a crazy highway and I slowed down, drove carefully (no reving) for 3 miles or so when I got off the highway and put it in park until the light went off.

Another 120 miles or so down the road, the same thing happened. After this, I drove 60 to 65 and the light did not come on again for the rest of the trip until on the way back, at 3:00 in the morning so I was pushing it to get home, I started driving 65 to 70 again and the light came one.

So, is there anything actually wrong with it, or is this sort of normal? The manual indicates this can happen (thus the advice to put it in park and idle), but the last thing I need is a blown tranny on the way to a gig.

Should I install a transmision cooler? Even if this is relatively normal?

Thank you again for your great advice.

 

[RockDoc]

Not normal. Someone else may chime in with what leads to it (either low flow <say kink in lines, blocked pick-up screen> or something going that is causing a lot of friction and heat generation <clutches slipping? TQ lock-up getting weak?> within are my bets, but common specific causes ain't my forté).

The temp light comes on at a very high temp. If it has come on, in addition to determining the cause of the heat you really need to flush the fluid and clean the pick-up screen, as the fluid will have been compromised by the overheating. Do a search for the "Rodney Flush", and you'll see how you can change over all the fluid, and check your ATF flow rate at the same time.

If your transmission is still okay, an aux. cooler is a very good idea.

Any other symptoms from the transmission? Shuddering? Noises?

 

[Wile E Coyote]

Don't drive it more than to the corner store and back until you do/have done a full service on that bad boy. The fluid is now cooked, and continued driving as is will shorten whatever life is left in the ole gal. It could drastically shorten it. Like dead tranny on your next trip.

Just so you understand what you may be up against, you are well into the mileage that these trannies die. That's not meant to be a death sentence for your particular rig, but follow RD's advice above and do or get a competent health check up on the tranny. It's possible you could get a few more faithful miles outta it.

 

[Mackeath]

Damn. Now I feel really foolish driving it back before I had it checked. This happened to me once before, while driving through Needles coming in from New Mexico last year.

Ok, so basically I need to take it in and have it thoroughly checked for kinks, a bad pick up screen, and general flow problems. I don't have any problems with grinding or changing gears, at least not yet. Can that be checked other than by pulling the whole tranny?

The only noises seem to be from an occasional loose fan.

Crap.

I've got a local shop I do work for in trade for discounted work on my vehicles. They are not tran specialists, but seem to always know what they are doing. Think they will work or do I need a specialist shop?

And if it goes really badly there, is this something a rebuild kit from spector (like 400) will fix or will I need to buy a new one?

 

[RockDoc]

First thing we should mention, make sure the fluid level is correct (but at this stage do it after flushing), and check that you have proper tension on the kick-down cable.

If you are mechanically inclined at all (like somewhere between changing your own oil and adjusting your own valves) I would suggest you look into it yourself.

I'll try to find a good link, but basically you are going to want to start by dropping the transmission pan, draining what comes out of it, cleaning off the pick-up screen (I used brake cleaner on mine) then buttoning it up and doing a passive (Rodney) flush to change out the remainder of the fluid.

To do this flush, you will pull the return line from the ATF cooler in the rad (some pull the line at the transmission, I pulled mine at the rad), you then add ATF through the dipstick with the truck running, and catch what comes out from the cooler in a bucket, doing this till you have turned over the capacity of the tranny (~14 quarts IIRC). You can time how long it takes to get say 10 quarts out of the cooler, and compare this flow rate the what is given in the Factory Service Manual to see if the flow is up to snuff.

By doing all this you will:
1) Know that you have good fluid in the transmission (and see the condition of what comes out, does it smell burnt on the dipstick)
2) Know that the pick-up screen is clear and not impeding flow
3) See what, if anything, is caught in the screen or accumulated in the pan (this could help diagnose more serious problems)
4) Know whether or not you are getting sufficient flow of ATF within the transmission and through the cooler

Most of us here are leery about taking our odd-ball (at least in North America) A440F transmissions to a shop for service. You'll likely find more knowledge about them here on Mud than in the vast majority of shops. But if you aren't comfortable, this may be your best bet, just make sure they do a passive flush using the transmissions own pump, rather than a power flush, which may loosen debris that is otherwise staying put.

If your tranny is doomed (don't assume so yet) your options are:
1) Test your luck with a local rebuild
2) Source a used, known good A440F
3) Spend big bucks on a rebuilt unit from Wholesale Automatics in Australia
4) Swap in a manual transmission
5) Start looking for another vehicle

Hope this helps, I'll see what I can find for threads of use.

 

[RockDoc]

A bit of reading for you, also, use the advanced search and search for "A440F", that should bring up much more reading:

https://forum.ih8mud.com/60-series-wagons/214849-another-auto-trans-question.html
https://forum.ih8mud.com/60-series-wagons/217380-auto-trans-reluctant-upshift-into-4th.html
https://forum.ih8mud.com/60-series-wagons/210319-rodney-party-trick-auto-tranny.html
https://forum.ih8mud.com/60-series-wagons/176011-help-tranny-flush-please.html

 

[umpqua]

Could it be possible that the sensor is bad?

 

[RockDoc]

Could it be possible that the sensor is bad?

Shhh!!

















Possible. A sniff of the ATF in it should rule that out.

 

[Wile E Coyote]

Could it be possible that the sensor is bad?

Yes of course, but considering how repeatable or predictable it seems per what was posted, I feel it's a negligibly small chance. The light comes on at around 300 deg F, BTW.

 

[Mackeath]

Ok, thank you for your advice, suggestions, and input.

I printed out the instructions and suggestions and took that and the vehicle to the shop before I had to go to a gig this morning. They looked it over and understood what you meant and will be checking it out thoroughly today while I'm at work.

I'm not particularly mechanically inclined (huge understatement) plus I crushed my hands some time back and holding tools is a real bitch, so I'm just going to hope for the best with this. They have been good to me for years (even did the steering knuckle job for 300 dollar plus some work from me) so hopefully this isn't going to be to bad.

Thank you all for your advice and I'll let you know how it goes.

 

[Randy88FJ62]

After you solve the temperature problem i would advise a trany cooler. A $50 cooler is a cheap insurance policy for our expensive transmissions. They are easy to install and it would be real easy for your mechanic to do.

 

[Mackeath]

I just talked to him about it and he said he will install it for me if I pay for the part. I'm just hoping that it is nothing terminal with the tranny and that this can be taken care of and the cooler installed.

I love the vehicle, and do not want another.

 

[Mackeath]

After thoroughly testing it, it looks like the transmission is OK. The fluid was dark, but the big problem was the screen (looks original) was really blocked and thus impeding the flow of fluid. A new screen has been ordered.

Is there anything else I should look for? Should I go ahead with the cooler?

Thank you guys for your help.

 

[Wile E Coyote]

After thoroughly testing it, it looks like the transmission is OK. The fluid was dark, but the big problem was the screen (looks original) was really blocked and thus impeding the flow of fluid. A new screen has been ordered.

Is there anything else I should look for? Should I go ahead with the cooler?

Thank you guys for your help.

If the shop is right, that's awesome news!
Remember that a portion of what was blocking the screen was old clutch material. There is a normal amt of buildup to be expected: it's the frequency of service exacerbated with periods of abuse that can drastically increase the normal wear of a tranny.
I say without a doubt get a cooler installed, and show them the info on the Rodney flush, (passive) vs a typical power flush.

 

[Wile E Coyote]

As an FYI, I'll add a generic observation regarding most if not all auto trannies.
When looking at the sediments in the pan and on the screen or cotton filter, dark color (graphite or darker)= clutch or band material. That's the only 'normal' sediment that should be noted. Any brass-colored, light metallic/aluminum-colored crud or outright shavings should be cause for immediate concern, and requires a detailed diagnosis.

 

[Mackeath]

Thank you for the information again. The clutch material is normal to have come off? It isn't anything to be concerned about? Or just over time?

In addition to the cooler is their anything else I should ad into this mix?

 

[Spook50]

In addition to all the advice posted, I'd also recommend using synthetic ATF when you change the fluid. I've used it for several years now, changing it every year just for good preventative maintenance. It's expensive, but one of the benefits is that it supposedly helps the tranny run slightly cooler. Not a miracle fix by any means, but good as an extra step to extend the life of the tranny.

 

[Wile E Coyote]

Thank you for the information again. The clutch material is normal to have come off? It isn't anything to be concerned about? Or just over time?

Think of the frictions (clutch material) as you would brake shoes. If you went out to the rig and saw typical brake dust on your wheels, would you worry? Not much, as that's a part of normal brake wear, right? Much of the crud in the screen or pan is just that; the products of normal clutch wear. Over time, the brake shoes do reach a point where they need replacing, as do the clutches in your tranny (part of a trans rebuild)
If you noted a huge amt of brake dust, then you might take note, and you guessed it, react similarly if you noted a huge amt of sediment in a tranny pan.

 

[dwillmo]

One thing you should try to determine is whether you get "lock-up" at 50 something mph. You should feel it and notice the tach drop back to 2000 rpm. If you aren't getting lock-up then the tranny is building more heat than it would will in lock-up. If you pull long grades for miles and miles, and you can't maintain 55 and lock-up, then the tranny is going to get hot eventually Doing the "Rodney Flush" is most important, and the aux cooler a must, especially if you are towing or pulling long grades.

 

[Cruisified]

Sorry to hijack but any advice if my tranny light comes on when I start my rig and never goes off? the same with my e-brake light.