Thanks for that epiphany Mace. I facepalmed when you commented on the hydro assist. If I rock crawled more than 4 times a year I'd go to hydro assist.
FJ60 steering box conversion to an FJ80 box AND gutting smog pump while your there. (1 Viewer)
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Interesting that the 80 guys have issues. I have taken off my pittman arm often enough and I haven't seen any damage or bending of the shaft/splines. I'll have to look carefully next time I'm in there.
Sounds like an 80 issue. I haven't seen any 60 / 62 failures that would make me think it's a common issue.
Sounds like an 80 issue. I haven't seen any 60 / 62 failures that would make me think it's a common issue.
If the 98-02 FZJ/HDJ 105 cross shaft is the correct part then the part number is 44111-60030 with a price of around ~$350.00 from Toyota and they are still available. Can someone confirm that my info is correct? Thanks.
the 80 box is probably not so much the issue, compared to the 60 box. I'd speculate the pitman arm design adds loading to the shaft. Drop pitman arms add more loads than a straight pitman. The 80 arm has more drop. Given the same internals the box with the flatter arm would see less stress.
The 80 pitman arm has less drop than the 60 arm. I've been running the 80 pitman arm on my 60 box for a few years now and can see no twisted splines above the pitman arm, but I do have a tighter clearance to the frame rail than with a 60 pitman arm.
that would make sense then. 99 % of the tucks we work on are 40's and 60's so I've never compared the two. With mainenance costs being what they are on an 80 I've never considered them to be a practical vehicle when compared to the 40 and 60 so I really
never considered owning one. I stick to accessories with them and steal their axles. I do like their rear floater with discs
never considered owning one. I stick to accessories with them and steal their axles. I do like their rear floater with discs
Don't get me wrong. The 80 has some incredible points and if they offered the 80 "basic" in the US , I may have considered it but the things
that made the 80 so nice for the first 200,00 miles , also make it impractical to maintain beyond that. Engine and transmission rebuild costs
exceed the value of the truck. Electrical issues like power windows, locks and sun roof are a nagging annoyance. They'll be a better option as they get older and are a better choice for economical powerplant swaps but their relative newness makes them targets for the emission
laws..at least in places like Phoenix
This was my approach to the mediocre Toyota steering. The large bore Saginaw..and a nearly flat pitman
that made the 80 so nice for the first 200,00 miles , also make it impractical to maintain beyond that. Engine and transmission rebuild costs
exceed the value of the truck. Electrical issues like power windows, locks and sun roof are a nagging annoyance. They'll be a better option as they get older and are a better choice for economical powerplant swaps but their relative newness makes them targets for the emission
laws..at least in places like Phoenix
This was my approach to the mediocre Toyota steering. The large bore Saginaw..and a nearly flat pitman
You do build some cool stuff. 
This was my approach to the mediocre Toyota steering. The large bore Saginaw..and a nearly flat pitman
Since we're talking about steering box specs, what makes this saginaw box so much better? What does "large bore" mean?
The large bore has a larger piston and is used in old "boats " like the '72 ish Coupe de ville. When we were running ARCA with a 40 that had 38" TSL's . We had issues with pushing the tires at 2PSI in the rocks. The large bore made it a one hand operation. On asphalt you could air down our 42" TSL's and turn the tires lock to lock standing still with a couple fingers. The first time i used one in a 60 about 18 years ago
it was almost scary. It had 35's and sitting in the driveway I gave the wheel a quick push at it turned another half turn after I let go.
It's probably a little too much for a 40.
The same bore is used on one ton 4x4 gm trucks but they use that smooth pitman with the pinch bolt like this
it was almost scary. It had 35's and sitting in the driveway I gave the wheel a quick push at it turned another half turn after I let go.
It's probably a little too much for a 40.
The same bore is used on one ton 4x4 gm trucks but they use that smooth pitman with the pinch bolt like this
The large bore has a larger piston and is used in old "boats " like the '72 ish Coupe de ville. When we were running ARCA with a 40 that had 38" TSL's . We had issues with pushing the tires at 2PSI in the rocks. The large bore made it a one hand operation. On asphalt you could air down our 42" TSL's and turn the tires lock to lock standing still with a couple fingers. The first time i used one in a 60 about 18 years ago
it was almost scary. It had 35's and sitting in the driveway I gave the wheel a quick push at it turned another half turn after I let go.
It's probably a little too much for a 40.
The same bore is used on one ton 4x4 gm trucks but they use that smooth pitman with the pinch bolt like this
Do we know what the diameter of the bore/piston for that box is?
standard saginaw is a 3" bore , the large bore is 3 1/2". It generally is a 31/2~ 4 turn box
Does anyone have a J8X steering box to take apart to measure the piston bore?
Hey all...
Thought you should hear about my process trying to pull this one off for my 85’.
if the steering intermediary shaft (p/n: 45260-60031) isn’t able to slide, or is rusted up, the longer bodied FZJ80 box won’t fit.
im considering buying a new intermediary shaft... since I have 0 play in mine... but; for all those considering this, don’t do it without inspecting the intermediary shaft slide at the grease zerk first!
Thought you should hear about my process trying to pull this one off for my 85’.
if the steering intermediary shaft (p/n: 45260-60031) isn’t able to slide, or is rusted up, the longer bodied FZJ80 box won’t fit.
im considering buying a new intermediary shaft... since I have 0 play in mine... but; for all those considering this, don’t do it without inspecting the intermediary shaft slide at the grease zerk first!
Here's the unsolicited account of my mini-saga I had replacing the box, so future internet people can learn:
My FJ62 box was original with 330k miles, and it had a lot of play. I tightened the top screw a little. But coincidence or not, my box started leaking a lot shortly after. I would say tightening the top screw is not really effective at taking the slop out of an old box anyway (the play you're removing with by tightening the screw is only part of the problem).
So I ordered a rebuilt 80 series box with the 105 sector shaft/pitman arm from Cruiser Yard. I don't wheel my 60, but why not have a beefy box that will last until the heat death of the universe?
Mounted the box, and immediately found the 105 pitman arm does not fit the FJ62 tie rod end, the hole on the pitman arm is too small. I didn't expect this and I posted a different thread here (turns out I had not researched enough).
You need to ream out the pitman arm for a 105 arm to fit on an FJ62 TRE. The taper is the same but the hole needs to be reamed about 1/16". I couldn't find a machine shop vaguely interested in this. So I bought the Toyota TRE reamer found online and then bought a drill press and did it in my driveway. I went slow and tested the fit until the pitman arm slipped right on to the right depth. PM me if you want to buy the reamer from me for cheap. If you need to remove the 105 pitman arm from the box (I did to ream it out), the standard pitman arm puller jaws don't fit. This super beefy one is great: https://www.autozone.com/loan-a-too...-duty-pitman-arm-puller/209523_0_0?spps.s=828
Notes about fitting the 80 series box:
The 105 pitman arm is a different profile, and left my steering wheel slightly off center. So I set about adjusting the drag link with a pipe wrench, should be easy... But then I proceeded to apply way too much force and rather than my drag link turning, my passenger ball joint popped in two! This left me with no steering. Big oof.
What I noticed on the steering box is the 80 series box can't be "back driven". On the 60 box, you can turn the pitman arm by hand and the input shaft will turn. But not so on the 80 box. Looking at the design of both, I (and my engineer friend) don't understand how either could possibly be back driven as it's just a worm gear. So how you could possibly adjust the drag link with the wheels on the ground? Both "ends" (the pitman arm and the wheels) are fixed in place. If you apply a boat load of torque to the drag link like I did, something's gotta break.
So I ordered all new steering linkage from Cruiser Outfitters.
A few days later, I had the new linkage installed, the toe alignment set, and the steering wheel centered, and I was finally done with this project. Who knew tightening the steering box screw would let me have such a fun project to keep throwing time and money at! But the steering is so much better!
My FJ62 box was original with 330k miles, and it had a lot of play. I tightened the top screw a little. But coincidence or not, my box started leaking a lot shortly after. I would say tightening the top screw is not really effective at taking the slop out of an old box anyway (the play you're removing with by tightening the screw is only part of the problem).
So I ordered a rebuilt 80 series box with the 105 sector shaft/pitman arm from Cruiser Yard. I don't wheel my 60, but why not have a beefy box that will last until the heat death of the universe?
Mounted the box, and immediately found the 105 pitman arm does not fit the FJ62 tie rod end, the hole on the pitman arm is too small. I didn't expect this and I posted a different thread here (turns out I had not researched enough).
You need to ream out the pitman arm for a 105 arm to fit on an FJ62 TRE. The taper is the same but the hole needs to be reamed about 1/16". I couldn't find a machine shop vaguely interested in this. So I bought the Toyota TRE reamer found online and then bought a drill press and did it in my driveway. I went slow and tested the fit until the pitman arm slipped right on to the right depth. PM me if you want to buy the reamer from me for cheap. If you need to remove the 105 pitman arm from the box (I did to ream it out), the standard pitman arm puller jaws don't fit. This super beefy one is great: https://www.autozone.com/loan-a-too...-duty-pitman-arm-puller/209523_0_0?spps.s=828
Notes about fitting the 80 series box:
- I didn't need to trim my wheel well.
- For the power steering lines, use a 17mm flare wrench/crows foot to avoid rounding them!
- You should mount the top left bolt first, but then clock it counterclockwise a bit to reattach the power steering lines. Very hard/impossible to get the hard lines to line up with the box if it's already bolted.
- You need to slip the steering wheel shaft onto the input shaft as you're mounting it. The slip joint on the steering wheel shaft doesn't compress far enough back for the larger steering box when the box is fixed in place.
- You need to trim the guard that goes over the steering wheel shaft. I used a Dremmel grinding wheel.
The 105 pitman arm is a different profile, and left my steering wheel slightly off center. So I set about adjusting the drag link with a pipe wrench, should be easy... But then I proceeded to apply way too much force and rather than my drag link turning, my passenger ball joint popped in two! This left me with no steering. Big oof.
What I noticed on the steering box is the 80 series box can't be "back driven". On the 60 box, you can turn the pitman arm by hand and the input shaft will turn. But not so on the 80 box. Looking at the design of both, I (and my engineer friend) don't understand how either could possibly be back driven as it's just a worm gear. So how you could possibly adjust the drag link with the wheels on the ground? Both "ends" (the pitman arm and the wheels) are fixed in place. If you apply a boat load of torque to the drag link like I did, something's gotta break.
So I ordered all new steering linkage from Cruiser Outfitters.
A few days later, I had the new linkage installed, the toe alignment set, and the steering wheel centered, and I was finally done with this project. Who knew tightening the steering box screw would let me have such a fun project to keep throwing time and money at! But the steering is so much better!
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Great to find this thread - thank you all for the input.
Is my takeaway accurate..........With 275k on my original steering box, I should install a new (not rebuilt) 80 series box since I'm running 35x12.5 tires and I do allot of parallel parking?? Since I don't do allot of demanding off-road, I should be fine with the standard Sector Shaft in the 80 box.
My Cruiser is a June 1985 so I think it has the correct bolt pattern.
Thanks!
Is my takeaway accurate..........With 275k on my original steering box, I should install a new (not rebuilt) 80 series box since I'm running 35x12.5 tires and I do allot of parallel parking?? Since I don't do allot of demanding off-road, I should be fine with the standard Sector Shaft in the 80 box.
My Cruiser is a June 1985 so I think it has the correct bolt pattern.
Thanks!
