Fan clutch solves overheating

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Bigbrowndog,

Ya, I gave the local's that part # and they 'didn't' deal with it. Said that they couldn't (could it be an OZ #?).

Anyway, is seems as though with the numerous other possible issues with a defective fan clutch (ie, leaking, amount of silicone oil required, and the Bi-metal Spring), that it might be... easier/better/?... to just get the Hayden, or even an OEM.

Am I chickening out here, or what? :frown: I'd rather not, but for instance, how do I determine if the Spring is shot?, or the amount of Oil required?, or even if the thing is leaking? (I cleaned it recently when I had the radiator out). :crybaby:

Robert
 
The part number was an OZ Toyota part number but this oil is used in plenty of gasser cars with fans in the USA surely. Most of our cars have gone electric thermo now also. I am sure if it was leaking you would have noticed the black goo, the oil is thick and very sticky it stains the hub black. You can visually inspect the bimetal spring for cracks and if its broken through or has disconnected. Put a heat gun or hair dryer near it , not on it and you will see the spring move. If you guys can't get the oil I can send some if you pay actual cost and shipping thats all.cheers
 
Sorry BigBrownDog, the pic problem was with my hotel server.

I'm anxious to get home and tear into my factory clutch. I just don't quite understand how you are determining when it needs oil.

I'd love to be able to get the factory clutch working to my needs. It would be nice to see that it was just a short fill at the factory and nothing more. I'll also try the heat gun test on the spring to see if it moves.
 
bigbrowndog,

Thanks (do you guys say 'ta' like the limey's do?), for the info And the offer for sending us the 'juice'!

Surely we can find it here; I'm wondering if it is REALLY specific Silicone Oil, or if something else might do the trick. I know NAPA (a US aftermarket auto parts store) sells some Silicone Oil that they call Silube or some such name. I called them about this thread we've got going on here, and they'd never heard of anyone rebuilding these clutches.

(See, a throw-away world. Or as 'they' have coined it, "Planned Obsolescence")...

Robert (longing for the good 'ol days)
 
landtank said:
When I talked with Napa they didn't know the manufacturer and it was going to be 7 days for delivery. Since this was for trouble swapping I elected to go with what I could get the earliest.
Click to expand...

I checked with my NAPA and the number cross references to a Hayden number, so I ordered it. It will be here Wednesday morning and cost $73.00 out the door. I will see if there are any markings on it when it gets here. Also they were the fastest and cheapest on getting it here.

Jack
 
locrwln1 said:
I checked with my NAPA and the number cross references to a Hayden number, so I ordered it. It will be here Wednesday morning and cost $73.00 out the door. I will see if there are any markings on it when it gets here. Also they were the fastest and cheapest on getting it here.

Jack
Click to expand...


sounds like you may have gotten the suspected better clutch. Post a pic of it if you can when you get it.
 
RCFloyd said:
bigbrowndog,

Thanks (do you guys say 'ta' like the limey's do?), for the info And the offer for sending us the 'juice'!

Surely we can find it here; I'm wondering if it is REALLY specific Silicone Oil, or if something else might do the trick. I know NAPA (a US aftermarket auto parts store) sells some Silicone Oil that they call Silube or some such name. I called them about this thread we've got going on here, and they'd never heard of anyone rebuilding these clutches.

(See, a throw-away world. Or as 'they' have coined it, "Planned Obsolescence")...

Robert (longing for the good 'ol days)
Click to expand...
My 5 liter 304 V8 holden engine runs one of these fans pics ,its based on a chev small block. What are the pre 93/94 chevs etc running there?When I pulled the fan apart it was easy to see the fluid level was down some.
rainforrest835.jpg

rainforrest834.jpg

rainforrest833.jpg
 
From my feeble research this is how a fan clutch works;

clutch_w1.jpg

The part that the red arrow is pointing to is the hub, bolted to and driven by the water pump pulley. The ribbed area is where the silicone oil shears, transferring drive torque to the housing that the fan is bolted to.

The blue arrow points to teeth that work as an oil pump.

clutch_w2.jpg

This picture is of the front housing. The blue arrow is where the "oil pump" pushes the oil into the reservoir. On some clutch designs the oil leaks into the active part of the clutch when it's stopped and has to be pumped back into the reservoir when the motor is started, causing the noise on startup.

When the motor is running most or all of the oil is in the reservoir until the thermostat opens the valve (red arrow) allowing the oil to circulate and shear transferring torque to the fan. When the thermostat closes the valve the oil is pumped back into the reservoir allowing the clutch to freewheel.

clutch_w3.jpg

The blue arrow points to the area where the oil enters the reservoir. The reservoir capacity is the open area in this picture minus the red area. So if one was cleaned out and the reservoir filled with water, the water measured, subtract the volume of the red area (what 1.5" x .25"?) we would know the correct fill? I'm betting ~3-4 tubes? The new clutches I have had apart had about this much fluid in them, nowhere near full. If the whole clutch is filled, the oil would always stay in the clutch area and not freewheel?

They are not a hydraulic coupling, their silicone couplings, no other type of oil that I have tried works, at all, not even a little bit! They work because of the unique properties of the silicone oil. A bunch that I have taken apart have appeared to have the proper fill amount and didn't work well. When cleaned and refilled they worked as well or if thicker oil was used better than new. Leading me to believe that the unique (magic) properties of the silicone goes away, maybe ruined by heat, age, who knows?

Like I typed this is what I have been able to find in my feeble research and experience from refilling a bunch of them. So if anyone has better info please add.
 
landtank said:
... I'll also try the heat gun test on the spring to see if it moves.
Click to expand...

The easiest way I have found to test the spring is; take the clutch apart, put the front part in a shallow pan (small fry pan works well) with the spring down and the valve and reservoir up, fill the pan enough to cover the spring and heat. The valve should open in the ~150-160F range. Don't overheat it, the seal goes away about 240F!:eek: :eek: :D
 
RCFloyd said:
bigbrowndog,

Thanks (do you guys say 'ta' like the limey's do?), for the info And the offer for sending us the 'juice'!

Surely we can find it here; I'm wondering if it is REALLY specific Silicone Oil, or if something else might do the trick. I know NAPA (a US aftermarket auto parts store) sells some Silicone Oil that they call Silube or some such name. I called them about this thread we've got going on here, and they'd never heard of anyone rebuilding these clutches.

(See, a throw-away world. Or as 'they' have coined it, "Planned Obsolescence")...

Robert (longing for the good 'ol days)
Click to expand...

Yes it's a special magic oil, Toyota is the only dealer that I know of that sells it, the rest just sell a new clutch. I recently bought the 3,000cts from C-Dan, he couldn't find the part number for the thicker stuff, with the part number he maybe able to get it? Will have to ask when he returns.

The "silicone" lubricating oil I have tried didn't work, even a little bit. They reacted with the left over oil and made a gelled mess. The real stuff is messy, nasty, waterproof, solvent proof stuff, the only ways I have found to remove it is to wipe it or wear it off!:eek: :D
 
Tools R Us said:
clutch_w3.jpg

The reservoir capacity is the open area in this picture minus the red area.
Click to expand...

I don't quite understand why you are subtracting the red area from the fill. My first impression would be to fill that entire area level. To me it would seem to be the way to do it. Just intuition on my part, not based on any tangable knowledge. I'm thinking once you bolt the two halves together haven't you basically enlarged the cavity so there would still be some area for movement.

It might be clearer to me once I see it in person.
 
landtank said:
I don't quite understand why you are subtracting the red area from the fill. My first impression would be to fill that entire area level. To me it would seem to be the way to do it. Just intuition on my part, not based on any tangable knowledge. I'm thinking once you bolt the two halves together haven't you basically enlarged the cavity so there would still be some area for movement.

It might be clearer to me once I see it in person.
Click to expand...

The valve plate has a hole in the center, when running the fluid is held in a ring to the outside by centrifugal force, if overfilled it will spill out the center hole, bypassing the valve.

clutch2.jpg
 
3,000 Cst. = 08816-03001
6,000 Cst. = 08816-06001
10,000 Cst. = 08816-10001

ToyotaSiliconeFliu.jpg


-B-
 
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Presuming the manufacturer is capable of doing it right the first time, accurately weigh a new, unused clutch before installation. Anytime after use, a reweigh would indicate how much, if any, fluid has been lost.
 
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RCFloyd said:
Ya, I gave the local's that part # and they 'didn't' deal with it. Said that they couldn't (could it be an OZ #?).
Click to expand...

Robert,
You're new here. :D

Call CruiserDan when you need something with the name Toyota on it. Your stress levels will go down quicker than your bank account.

-B-
 
Tools R Us said:
The valve plate has a hole in the center, when running the fluid is held in a ring to the outside by centrifugal force, if overfilled it will spill out the center hole, bypassing the valve.

clutch2.jpg
Click to expand...
Not sure about your fan clutch but with the one in the link the hj75. I was told to fill it fully and to rotate the mechanism inside to make sure there were no air bubbles in the oil. Actually to leave it sit in the sun for 20 minutes to make sure it was all out.Before placing it together again.Think I put all this in the link.[ not trying to sound like an expert or knowall.] cheers PS also beware of the sharp razor like edges on the fan body :doh: and the oil stings like s***.:crybaby: LOL and does need to wear off.:D
 
bigbrowndog said:
10,000Cst= 08816-10001 same part number for silicone oil in northern Oz.:beer: :beer:
Click to expand...

Once again you guys get the good stuff and we are stuck with the wimpy stuff!:flipoff2: The 3,000cts is not hard to get, the 10,000cts is much harder to get here. They probably made ours as wimpy as they could get away with to cut down on the, "my motor is too noisy" and "my truck needs to get better mileage" complaints from :princess: Americans. That and most of them only get used to cart the rug rats to the game.:o
 
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