Discuss batteries and cold cranking amps

[Funner]

Also, check the date sticker on the side of the battery, just like milk, the older stuff is at the front of the shelf. Newer is better, even a month sitting on a shelf will cause some level of discharge and sulfatation of the lead plates. Take your volt meter too, a fully charged battery should be 12.7+v.

 

[concretejungle]

Good call! I put my volt meter on my new one and it was 12.6V. The first one i got, the marine one, had been on the shelf for about 3 months and it was at 12.5V.

 

[Cruiserdrew]

Good call! I put my volt meter on my new one and it was 12.6V. The first one i got, the marine one, had been on the shelf for about 3 months and it was at 12.5V.

Careful here Alex. The chemistry of batteries differs a bit and affects voltage a bit. Sometimes the lead plates are alloyed with antimony, sometimes with calcium and sometimes with nothing. Concentrations of sulfuric acid can differ too. Temperature also plays a role. THe only way to tell the normal "resting" voltage of a battery is to fully charge it, then leave it 24 hours with no load-ie nothing at all hooked up to it. That will give a more accurate measure.

For instance, the 12.5 of your Marine battery may be normal and the 12.6 in you new one may be low. You don't really know unless you measure after a full charge + 24 hours. Your solar would be ideal to give it an initial fully absorbed charge. THen leave it sit inside for 24 hours and check the normal resting voltage.

 

[cruiserdan]

Datum point. The factory spec is 710 CCA.

 

[george_tlc]

Nice thing about old school wet cells with a cap on each cell is you can measure the specific gravity of each cell. That's a very good way to accurately measure state of charge...

Oh, maybe that's why I have old school wet cells in my 4wd's

cheers,
george.

 

[Cruiserdrew]

Oh, maybe that's why I have old school wet cells in my 4wd's

george.

5 cars, 8 wet cells.

 

[mct75]

I also like wet cells. To me a "maintenance free" battery is more of an "impossible to maintain" battery as when the electrolyte boils out you lose capacity and lifespan. With a flooded battery you can always add more water.

 

[mehbohdi]

AGM put it in and forget it, providing one doesn't do stupid things like welding....

 

[Funner]

AGM put it in and forget it, providing one doesn't do stupid things like welding....

I think this has become a questionable practice due to charging requirements, if you don't buy a good AGM battery charger and use it correctly, you will not get the life cycle from them that justifies their cost.

 

[Funner]

Careful here Alex. The chemistry of batteries differs a bit and affects voltage a bit. Sometimes the lead plates are alloyed with antimony, sometimes with calcium and sometimes with nothing. Concentrations of sulfuric acid can differ too. Temperature also plays a role. THe only way to tell the normal "resting" voltage of a battery is to fully charge it, then leave it 24 hours with no load-ie nothing at all hooked up to it. That will give a more accurate measure.

For instance, the 12.5 of your Marine battery may be normal and the 12.6 in you new one may be low. You don't really know unless you measure after a full charge + 24 hours. Your solar would be ideal to give it an initial fully absorbed charge. THen leave it sit inside for 24 hours and check the normal resting voltage.

I think antimony was phased out by about 1980 or so, I think we are safe from that possibility. If we are talking flooded cell batteries, they're pretty much all calcium these days. AGM's can be pure lead, or calcium lead and there are the gel cell batteries. I also think all flooded cell acid batteries are running 28% sulfuric acid too. I sell rail cars of sulfuric acid to Johnson Controls.
I agree with you that comparing different types of batteries with the same metrics would probably be a mistake.

 

[bajaphile]

I ended up going back to Interstate and got a Megatron Plus 27F. They have a 6 year warranty and are ~$150 with 710 CCA. 30 month free replacement. I understand that the Costco brand might be a re-labeled Interstate, but I don't really understand how they could be 1/2 the price without some impact to quality?? Or do they just not have the warranty?

Either way, I don't plan on spending money again on an AGM.

 

[Cruiserdrew]

I think antimony was phased out by about 1980 or so, I think we are safe from that possibility. If we are talking flooded cell batteries, they're pretty much all calcium these days. AGM's can be pure lead, or calcium lead and there are the gel cell batteries. I also think all flooded cell acid batteries are running 28% sulfuric acid too. I sell rail cars of sulfuric acid to Johnson Controls.
I agree with you that comparing different types of batteries with the same metrics would probably be a mistake.

The Wiki article suggests that Antimony is still used but in lower amounts than previously. It adds strength apparently. Also the article suggests that selenium is alloyed with the lead as well.

"Both lead-calcium and lead-selenium grid alloys still add antimony, albeit in much smaller quantities than the older high-antimony grids: lead-calcium grids have 4–6% antimony while lead-selenium grids have 1–2%"

Interesting reading and more than you want to know!:
Lead–acid battery - Wikipedia

 

[MODist]

I ended up going back to Interstate and got a Megatron Plus 27F. They have a 6 year warranty and are ~$150 with 710 CCA. 30 month free replacement. I understand that the Costco brand might be a re-labeled Interstate, but I don't really understand how they could be 1/2 the price without some impact to quality?? Or do they just not have the warranty?

Either way, I don't plan on spending money again on an AGM.

I recently put two of the Costco group 27 interstate marine/rv batteries in my 96lc. So far they are doing great.

 

[Funner]

The Wiki article suggests that Antimony is still used but in lower amounts than previously. It adds strength apparently. Also the article suggests that selenium is alloyed with the lead as well.

"Both lead-calcium and lead-selenium grid alloys still add antimony, albeit in much smaller quantities than the older high-antimony grids: lead-calcium grids have 4–6% antimony while lead-selenium grids have 1–2%"

Interesting reading and more than you want to know!:
Lead–acid battery - Wikipedia

Too much information is what makes this place so great/confusing/pointless/frustrating/addicting.

 

[concretejungle]

Regarding the AGM batteries... is it possible to put a charge controller between our alternators and the battery to ensure it's charged properly?

 

[MODist]

Regarding the AGM batteries... is it possible to put a charge controller between our alternators and the battery to ensure it's charged properly?

It is possible but the cost would way negate the return. Plain an simple AGM batteries are not good for use in a vehicle. Manufactures like pushing them and talking up the benefits of the battery while knowing it will only last a few years in a vehicle(average). They charge more for AGM and people get less usage out of them. So many people are afraid of battery maintenance. It is as easy as having it checked when you take your vehicle in for an oil change. Some vehicles do need AGM batteries because they are located in the trunk and must be sealed.

 

[mct75]

For the fun of it, I put a 150 CCA Odyssey battery in mine and was able to start it just fine at 40 degrees, albeit slower than normal. It's an older battery that has been abused and vented a few times so I was impressed.

 

[mookamatook]

Now i'm heading to the beach over the weekend to camp so i hope there is plenty of sun for the panels to keep this one topped off.

You should bring a lithium ion starter just in case... No fun getting stuck in a overland rig just because your battery/starter is not working.

 

[Proven]

You should bring a lithium ion starter just in case... No fun getting stuck in a overland rig just because your battery/starter is not working.

Welcome to Mud! Take a peak at the post dates when you reply. This chain is from 2016! haha

 

[mookamatook]

Welcome to Mud! Take a peak at the post dates when you reply. This chain is from 2016! haha

Never a bad idea to comment on an old thread! Thanks for the welcome