Building a toybox(no reponse from marlin) (1 Viewer)

[fj-rankenstein]

hey guys... I am trying to get info aboot building a toybox from marlin..(I am too cheap to have them make the complete unit...) and save a few buck but am having problems getting any kind of solid answer from them... i understand that they are busy but I too have a tight schedule and need to get starting on my mock up if I am going to make Black Hills Cruiser Classic. Sob stories aside:

I want to buy a MC-22 adapter(sm465 to toybox) and a MC-23 adapter(toybox to l.c. split transfercase) for my cruiser but have a few questions...

1. does the MC22 adapter come with an output shaft for the sm465??what is exactly included with this adapter??

2. if it does would that mean that you could pick any year sm465 because they are all more or less the same gear wise?? (I am aware that there are 3 different outputs depending on if it was 79 and back or 80 and up but if marlin supplies an output shaft than it wouldnt matter what year tranny you get??? correct me if I am wrong....

3.I know that the 79 and back trannys have a short 10 spline output with a coupler that connected the transmission and tranfercase that always stripped out over time??? I am assuming that if marlin doesnt supply any kind of output shaft with the Mc22 adapter than logically you would have to use this tranny...


I did a search and found out that a new output shaft is included with the Mc20(sm420 to toybox) adapter but could not find anything regarding the Mc22 adapter plate.....

I have the oportunity to grab 5 sm465's from early 80s trucks all for super cheap and need to know if I am wasting my time with these and need to find the 79 and back tranny....


thanks guys.......

 

[cruzer]

call marlin, don't bother with email.

1) SM465 needs 10spline output....

2) have no idea.

3) have no idea.

figure out answers to 2 and 3 to answer sm465 questiong.

I think if you look in the tech section you may find your answer as to which tranny you need for the short 10spline output....

Stew

 

[Cruiser_Nerd]

Stew is right, just pick up the phone and call.

Don't know if the 420 (MC20) is is the same as the 465, but it did not replace the output shaft of the SM420 tranny. What was supplied was a clamp on output shaft retainer ring and a new input gear for the reduction box which slid on to the 10 spline output. The gear is retained by the reduction box (that's why the retainer for the output shaft).

 

[tornadoalleycruiser]

420 and 465 adapters into the toybox need a 10 spline output shaft on the tranny. The only adapter plate that goes into the toybox is for the h41/42 which used a 16spline shaft. That is converted to a 10spline which looks like the 420 or 465. THe input on the toybox is held in place by the input bearing and snapring.
Why is there a need to have the output on the 465 drilled and tapped for the toybox? There's no way to bolt anything on the end of it when it's in teh female input gear on the toybox. There is a clamp collar on the tailshaft of the tranny to keep it from walking back into the gear cluster tho. No way to put a bolt in the tailshaft of the tranny itself prior to putting it on the toybox.. That's used when bolting to a normal Tcase without a doubler.

The new output your refering to on the 420 stuff is for the output of hte toybox. You can go 10, or 19 output on the tcase side of the toybox. Make sure you get the (I believe 32mm wide spacer) between the toybox and splitcase THat will keep your input gear on the tcase from eating the gear cluster.
Better get hoppin now cause it'll take a bit to get it together if you've never built one before.

I'd recommend getting the heavy duty detent spring from Marlin at the same time. I had one of my doublers pop out and it scared the crud outta me going downhill.

 

[cruzila]

Some basic Toybox info:

The MC20 does not come with a shaft, but does come with a lock collar or you can remove the mainshaft and have a groove cut into it by a machine shop.

The MC22 does not come with a shaft, but you do need a 4wheel drive version of the SM465. No need for any other Mods.

The MC24 can come with a shaft if the trans is 16 spline FJ40 or the later model 84 and up FJ60 trans.

The earlier 81-84 FJ60 trans can accept the 19spline input gear option for the crawlbox after it is cut to the length of the SM420 10 spline.

confusing huh? It makes sense once you firgure it out.

The rear:

The MC21 is for the older style t-case it uses a 15mm spacer. It has a 10 spline output.

The MC23 is a little trickier. It has a 19 spline output. The 81-84 transmission uses the 15mm spacer. The later model 4 speed and the H55f uses a longer spacer. These equate to the 4 speed and 5 speed gear references if you are familiar with that.

I would gladly field any q's on install problems. Although I do not frequent here that much.

Scott

 

[fj-rankenstein]

actually that is perfect!!! I have been doing more digging around in the last few weeks here and have all the answers to my questions.. thanks for the info.. I dont have time during the week to call to marlin, being that I am a road mechanic full time.....I am going to order my toybox stuff though next week.... how exciting!!!!


thanks again!!

 

[tornadoalleycruiser]

Also one tip on the splitcase back half of the toybox.. Make sure you put the dowels in. And get em! There are 2 dowel holes that Cruizila machined into the back of the adapter plate that mimic the back of the tranny. They take the torque of the toybox and will help keep it all together.
And it might be necessary to just clean up a touch the output of a 19spline H42 if you are going that route. I found that the part of the h42 19spline (FJ60 short H42 transmission) was a touch thicker near the actual transmission where there had never been a gear. THis would not allow it to go into the female input (19 spline) toybox input gear. A quick minute with a belt sander in a vice was all that was necessary. (I actually used an h41 but same difference)
Another thing, you need to source your crawl box housing from Marlin or send him your core. The input bearing used in a toybox is slightly bigger than the input bearing used in a stock Minitruck reduction box. The toybox uses a stock minitruck reduction box but marlin machines the input bearing hole enough to clear the new input bearing which is used on the female input gear. Wouldn't want you to just think you can grab an input gear from Marlin and just slap it in there. Isn't gonna fit at that point.. Then you'd be kinda upset..
Holler if you need help

 

[fj-rankenstein]

it took a while to find this old post!!! I finally bellied up and bought the pieces from marlin to build a sm465/4.7 toybox/toyota spitcase but am having a few issues....(both with getting all the right pieces from marlin and just building the darn thing....)


I have got the sm465 to toybox adapter figured out i think but I am not too sure aboot the toybox to splitcase part of it.....I got 4 bags of parts ( 4 identicle spacers with ballbearing reliefs cut out of them, a big spacer, a bag full of 2 dowels and allen head bolts (which I figure are for bolting the toybox adapter to the tranny,,) and then a bag of long bolts (which I believe bolt the toybox to the splitcase.....) and the output shaft...

I think I have it figured out but I would love to see some pics of a sm465/toybox/splitcase combo being built if possible....more so just the toybox to splitcase part of it.... or any pics regarding this particular combo.....

there doesnt seem to be any pics regarding this toybox stuff much anywhere...

thanks!!

 

[Poser]

You have PM.

 

[rsc71]

try the marlin web page there are a cpl of links on bottom of the toy box page showing installs

 

[fj-rankenstein]

try the marlin web page there are a cpl of links on bottom of the toy box page showing installs

ummm yeah..... that was the first thing I did and most of the info there is crap or doesnt apply to what i am trying to build.
there are absolutely no links or pages that I have found anywhere regarding building a sm465/toybox/splitcase combo...

Marlin for some reason doesnt include any kind of build instructions with anything that they send out anymore and rely on the customer to try to dig up info on how to build this damn thing....

and try to get through on any given day to get help and thats almost a joke in itself...

I dont understand why a company who sells individual parts to build these things dont include a simple install book on how to assemble this stuff... its been asked many a time on the forum...granted there are terrific online instructions if you are building a duel ultimate or any minitruck case but the toybox stuff has zero support....

I just spent over 3500 usd with them and would love some sort of build instructions or pictures or just something rather than just getting a pile of parts and trying to figure it out through scattered pics and webpages off the internet..



on the flip side to all of this, I love what they are doing for toyota 4wheeling and the quality of the product that I have recieved is above excellent.
As well, when you can get through, they are more than willing and super helpful to get you back on track again but I feel if simple things were included like build instructions, tips or better online support for toybox stuff the phone traffic wouldnt be half as busy....

so once again I am asking if there are any links that perhaps I have missed or good pics of this combo that I am trying to build online??

and yes "poser" I will still give you a call.... thanks.

 

[John Smith]

I too was not real happy when I received my Toybox with zero instructions. Why Marlin does not include them is anyone's guess. What I did do is take the time to write it all up so that others would not have to go through the same ordeal. My writeup is my Webpage in my signature.

Do us all a favor and do an indepth writeup with plenty of pictures so that those who are building your particular combo after you won't go through the hell you are now.

Dave at Marlin's shop is who builds most Toyboxes and he is the one who can answer your questions about where the parts in the mystery bags go. Mine had cryptic magic marker numbers on them that made sense once I spoke with Dave.

 

[fj-rankenstein]

ahh yes... I love your buildup pics and website..... your page was one of the first I found as far as toybox stuff goes..... I wish there were more like yours out there...

I figure someone has had to have built this combo and has taken pics...


I appreciate the help!!!

hopefully more will chime in!!


I have already started a complete buildup page regarding my combo and I love taking and posting pics so I hope it helps shorten build time for the next person...

 

[cruzila]

FJ, what year is the split case? Did it have the extention housing between the trans? i know Marlin at least has a parts list that should have gone out with the parts. I know because I wrote it. I guess I should have done directions but I thought it was being worked out at Marlins shop. I will be checking into that for sure. It NEEDS to be done.

Anyway email me and I'll be glad to get things straight. I can give you a phone number. It really is pretty straight forward once we figure out what you have. 4 or 5 speed gears?

Scott

 

[lowenbrau]

I did a group buy of 5 H55f toyboxes recently and added another a few weeks ago. I had to practically beg them to return my calls and take my Visa number. Other than that, nada. No communication at all. These guys have had a helluva year and are crazy busy. Way too busy. Rank, you are doing the right thing by asking the questions here. Figure out exactly what you need and order it. When it comes, if it need some adjustments ( the five speed boxes have some machining mistakes) just do it yourself. If the hardware is missing, just go pick some up. I'm not ragging on Marlin. He's doing the cool stuff that I can't do but he's not doing it right and he's not doing it all. I figure if we as the Toyota community help out each other with the details, Marlin's team can stick to completing/perfecting the products. I, for one, am sorry I pressured them to come up with a new product as such a tumultuous time.

 

[cruzila]

Another thing is with the shop so small, they are not doing the install work right now. So, with this splitcase adapter there is no "expert" there. Mudrack has done some and may have more info. I will working on Marlin to get an install manual out. This thing is confusing no doubt. I did most of the design work and it still gets me. I am not an expert on this one either. 3 and 4 speed stuff I am all over it.

Scott

 

[cruzila]

FJ see me on Marlins board I got info there...

 

[tornadoalleycruiser]

Details on what parts your using. I've built both FJ60 and FJ62 split case toyboxes for my trucks. Used various input gears etc.. Swapped gears around between toyboxes etc. Best advice I can give you is to use the spacers to line up your input gear to the tcase by only assembling half of the case on the back of the toybox first. I have some pics somewhere. Shoot specifics and we can help you out. There is a few mm difference in the spline engagement contact area of the different splitcases, that is your main difference. Other than that most splitcases go together the same.

 

[Ullr]

bump

My Toy Box just arrived without instructions. Is anyone aware of a write up on the H42-Toy Box-Split Case set up? Later split case too, with the honkin big spacer between it and the H42.