Brake Issue While Mountain Driving (1 Viewer)

[ramangain]

So I was driving the scenic byway from Santa Fe to Taos which has some decent elevation changes but nothing that seemed extreme. About halfway through a 1.5 hour drive I was on a downhill turn and pressed the breaks and when I let go the brakes grabbed about 4 more times; its hard to say but I think it was coming from the left rear since I did have some jerk in that direction. I'm pretty new to the vehicle and haven't tested driving in the mountains but after that experience I started to use engine braking a lot more often to slow me down thinking it may have been due to overheating.

Any thoughts on what might have caused this issue? Do I need to lean on downshifting a lot more while mountain driving? Is there anything I can do to improve brake performance to minimize this?

How many times does/did this actually happen? Once? 25% of the time? Always?

 

[Mike NXP]

Very true, but also don't have brakes (and therefore their mass) for 80K tractor trailers either. If we did then we probably could ride the brakes to the bottom. It's really just about heat dissipation, not braking system performance. The systems are designed for short duration usage with enough time to cool the brakes, and just as importantly, the brake fluid down. Because even if the pads don't lose their effectiveness from the heat you can still boil the brake fluid and make the system non-functional.

I'm not disagreeing and respect all opinions. I use OD and my gear selector very often and I agree this is a good skill to have, my brakes rarely get used. The point I was trying to make was it's not a necessity for a well maintained modern vehicle without a lot of weight in tow to have to use the engine to help slow you down and it doesn't seem to relate to the original post and diagnosing the issue at hand.

 

[2001LC]

Your right, the thread got away from issue somewhat, talking more about one of OP's comments & questions! "engine braking on the down hill"

OP has been absent for awhile. We need to know a little more, about what inspection of E-brake and ABS warning system revealed.

It's very possible his ABS kicked-in and either he did not notice dash lights and/or alarm (eyes on road and radio blasting), or ABS dash lights and or alarms aren't working!

Again very easy to test ABS Dash Lights and Alarm.

I've experienced ABS kicking on out of seeming nowhere. It's unsettling. But one is generlly not looking at dash as it happens, as eye are on the road. Some alarms aren't very loud, others are.

In no case have I heard "overheated brakes" the issue kicking on ABS. Which ABS grabs/activates faster moving rotors/wheels. So I'd not gone down this engine braking road, had OP not mentioned he'd not been engine braking on a downhill and asked about engine braking.

Is the possibility of heat played in this, I suppose. But typically it's a PM issue or component failing, in front end. i.e loose: wheel bearings, TRE, steering rack, ball joints.

It's also possible, OP did skid and system worked as it should. he just didn't realize it!

But until OP gets back to us on condition of e-brake shoes along it's retainer assembly and ABS warn lights & alarm, we're "pissing in the wind"! Which if those all working as they should and not in a skid, he needs a good front end inspection.

 

[TLCStonks]

Those flatlanders that ride my ass in the mountains, are usually sorry. As they have trouble maintaining control. I did have I a few weeks ago on a suspension completion test run. Guy stayed on my ass up Berthoud pass, not easy when I'm pushing it for the 500thr'd or so time over the divide. I final braked a slowed so he'd pass, in his sport cars. He was a local just bird dogging me for smokeys. I must admit, I sometimes do the same when I see a speeder.

Engine braking:
Just shift down transmission gears.

98-02 have overdrive button on shifter, press OD (OFF) and you see RPMs come up. That's where we first start slowing (engine braking). If you need to reduce speed more, drop transmission to "2". than "L" if needed. To really granny it down, stop and shift transfer case to "LOW".

In 03-07, OD off is when we move shift from "D" to the left, than "3", "2" or "1/L"

The owner's manual has each gears MPH range listed. If we shift lower than that gears range allows for. Transmission will not shift down, until MPH speed reduced. In those cases, often we must slow by braking until MPH mesh with transmission gear selected. At the point MPH slows enough for the transmission to engage the lower gear you've selected. You'll be lunged forward, like sudden braking. You'll see RPMs jump to near redline as this happens. This is from not planning ahead or emergency slowing. Which is find, as long as not in a high speed turn or on slippery/ice roads

Be warned, in turns, on ice or slippery condition. This sudden braking of transmission as speed drops and lower gear engages, can cause vehicle to skid in turn or on ice/slippery condition. It's all about proper planning ahead. In high speed turns/curves slow before turn. On icy condition, we do not want any moves, like sudden engine braking nore acceleration or heavy steering. So we must easy into gears at lower MPH, accelerate gently and turn easy (wide and slow)

I've a story posted somewhere in mud. How just back off accelerator pedal or touching it would put my 240Z into a slip. More than 30 to 40 vehicles in front of me, began spinning out of control on icy HWY I-70 eastbound out of Eisenhower tunnel. You could see vehicle after vehicle brake lights tap on, than they spun out of control. Not one vehicle in front of me made it through. Even just letting off gas pedal and they'd spin. Only about halve the vehicles following me, made it through the mass of spinning vehicles. IT WAS SO INTENSE!. Key was constant speed, and very light steering too lightly ver around on straightest line possible. No sudden moves!

Practice on dry condition first. Get the hang of it, before winter. Learn to plan ahead, so no need to touch brakes, or feel any forward lung as lower gear takes hold.

Me, I drive with right hand on the shifter most all the time. It's second nature to me, like driving a stick. I shift very often. Sometime in emergency braking, I'll shift down to slow faster.

Practice makes perfect.

+1 for the thank you. I did some more practicing yesterday and barely touched brakes once from South Fork CO to Pagosa Springs. It feels a little weird revving it up in second but I think with some practice it is overall much safer. I was following my friend from Texas in a 4runner and realized just how much I was relying on brakes.

 

[TLCStonks]

Your right, the thread got away from issue somewhat, talking more about one of OP's comments & questions! "engine braking on the down hill"

OP has been absent for awhile. We need to know a little more, about what inspection of E-brake and ABS warning system revealed.

It's very possible his ABS kicked-in and either he did not notice dash lights and/or alarm (eyes on road and radio blasting), or ABS dash lights and or alarms aren't working!

Again very easy to test ABS Dash Lights and Alarm.

I've experienced ABS kicking on out of seeming nowhere. It's unsettling. But one is generlly not looking at dash as it happens, as eye are on the road. Some alarms aren't very loud, others are.

In no case have I heard "overheated brakes" the issue kicking on ABS. Which ABS grabs/activates faster moving rotors/wheels. So I'd not gone down this engine braking road, had OP not mentioned he'd not been engine braking on a downhill and asked about engine braking.

Is the possibility of heat played in this, I suppose. But typically it's a PM issue or component failing, in front end. i.e loose: wheel bearings, TRE, steering rack, ball joints.

It's also possible, OP did skid and system worked as it should. he just didn't realize it!

But until OP gets back to us on condition of e-brake shoes along it's retainer assembly and ABS warn lights & alarm, we're "pissing in the wind"! Which if those all working as they should and not in a skid, he needs a good front end inspection.

I'm leaning towards ABS also. I've had it kick in once before and I might have just missed the beep. I think the combination of downhill and a turn might have caused some slippage that I didn't realize. The feedback has been great definitely learning a lot

 

[2001LC]

I'm leaning towards ABS also. I've had it kick in once before and I might have just missed the beep. I think the combination of downhill and a turn might have caused some slippage that I didn't realize. The feedback has been great definitely learning a lot

If it was ABS doing it's job, and on dry pavement when not in a skid. Than your front end is likely in need of service. Things like loose wheel bearings, ball joints, TRE, Steering rack mounting bushing even rack itself can be in need of servicing.

Jack up 1 lower control arm at a time. Check wheel bearings for looseness by grabbing tire at 12 & 6. Any moment whatsoever and they loose, and need servicing ASAP.

Lower ball joint test. Any movement even tiny, it's bad.

 

[2001LC]

Does steering wheel kind of lag before it comes straight, after turning a corner and vehicle traveling straight. Does it wonder on HWY. Rack mounting bushing shoot.