Rivman1243
SILVER Star
All the Cummins I've worked on are set-up for twin scroll. And you're right, twin scrolls make a lot of power as all the semi's I work on are twin scroll
Bolt on turbo kit (3 Viewers)
- Thread starter scottryana
- Start date
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True, but the challenge with all things turbo 1fz is getting the turbo to spool up around the same time the computer goes closed loop. Inefficiency isn't really the enemy with the stock computer. If it spools too quickly or is too responsive, it will create a dangerous lean condition, so you almost have to intentionally make it a little bit of a dog to accommodate the computer.
Kind of like looking for a bit of turbo lag then? With a supercharger being somewhat instant boost, I'm surprised it works like it does. Maybe because the boost is so low?
- Thread starter
- #244
Again you can't change the fact the computer is going to work the way it does no matter what FI system you have. The turbo can have the exact same boost curve down low as the SC and more up top, because it is not a fixed displacement related to RPM it is wastegate controlled.
Properly setup if you put them side by side, they will boost the same time, but the turbo will be more adjustable up top to take full advantage of the 10:1 rich condition. If that means going to 6psi, or 7 or 8, etc that is all doable by adjusting the wastegate.
Properly setup if you put them side by side, they will boost the same time, but the turbo will be more adjustable up top to take full advantage of the 10:1 rich condition. If that means going to 6psi, or 7 or 8, etc that is all doable by adjusting the wastegate.
Is the ECU so hard to crack?
What are we missing? An interface to work with the ECU?
What are we missing? An interface to work with the ECU?
- Thread starter
- #246
It may or may not be that hard, but no one has spent anytime trying to crack it since the market is so small. I really doubt it is any harder than a 2016 Nissan GTR, but since the tuning market is so big for them they were cracked in months.
I do know that Toyota does have a pretty good reputation with regard to the robustness of their ECU's though. I mean just look at the Supra, it has been around 20-25 years it was a huge tuner platform and no one cracked that ECU. It has almost always been piggyback or standalone on that platform as well.
I do know that Toyota does have a pretty good reputation with regard to the robustness of their ECU's though. I mean just look at the Supra, it has been around 20-25 years it was a huge tuner platform and no one cracked that ECU. It has almost always been piggyback or standalone on that platform as well.
As a matter of fact, I was thinking about a guy who does tune Supras with a great deal of success and even repairs tunes which have been fxxxed up by other people.
I'll drop hi a line to see if he would be interested in tackling this issue.
I guess I might need to send him an ECU, but don't know what else. He is overseas though, so it will be a slow process if he agrees. I do trust him with any turbo setup.
I'll drop hi a line to see if he would be interested in tackling this issue.
I guess I might need to send him an ECU, but don't know what else. He is overseas though, so it will be a slow process if he agrees. I do trust him with any turbo setup.
Just so you don't think I will charge anything, I can put you in touch with him and deal with him directly. He might need to be incentivized somehow, R&D wise.
I know his initial reaction would be a strong no and go fxxx your self. I just know it.
But, if we hopefully persuade him there is somewhat of a market out there and a potential 10 - 20 - 30 clients down the road he will bite.
He would not do it for me even if I pay him $1000 for it, and we are friends.
For a few deals I am sure he will do it for less based on a certain volume of sales.
I know his initial reaction would be a strong no and go fxxx your self. I just know it.
But, if we hopefully persuade him there is somewhat of a market out there and a potential 10 - 20 - 30 clients down the road he will bite.
He would not do it for me even if I pay him $1000 for it, and we are friends.
For a few deals I am sure he will do it for less based on a certain volume of sales.
Spoke with him already.
Essentially he told me to go fxxx myself and then, but only then to go get a stand alone computer.
Essentially he told me to go fxxx myself and then, but only then to go get a stand alone computer.
NLXTACY
Wits' End
Here's the thing.
He calmed down a bit and explained what the problem is with the OEM ECU.
The ECU lacks many functions to control a turbo setup. You cannot control the boost and other functions (including timing, depending on the boost generated by the turbo) simply because the ECU does not have or "know" what those functions are.
It's as if someone would have to re-write the entire software for the ECU, so the ECU would understand, respond and adjust to the conditions brought up by the turbo.
He calmed down a bit and explained what the problem is with the OEM ECU.
The ECU lacks many functions to control a turbo setup. You cannot control the boost and other functions (including timing, depending on the boost generated by the turbo) simply because the ECU does not have or "know" what those functions are.
It's as if someone would have to re-write the entire software for the ECU, so the ECU would understand, respond and adjust to the conditions brought up by the turbo.
I think it's a trend for most people that know you
I do have a very intimate relationship with everybody.
Much like my supercharged 98 Integra GSR. The factory computer does not know what positive pressure is so the stock SC kit used a combination of increased fuel pressure, retarded timing, and a resistor trick on the intake air temp sensor to deliver as much fuel as possible while retarding the timing enough to not deronate. You may ne able to get by with this on a boosted 80. While this works, it's really a hack just to get by and you have to run 99% of the boosted rpm rich just to keep the leanest spot from getting dangerous. On the dyno this setup at 8psI with a roots blower would bring the stock hp to wheels from 150 to somewhere in the 175 - 185 range for most people who dynod with this setup. I used a cheap piggyback controller for a while and was able to get 217 on a dyno after only an hour or two but still had some of the band aids incorporated.
I then installed a "Hondata" ecu that got rid of all the band aids and increased injectors from 240 to 440 cc to be able to run stock fuel pressure. This system actually senses boost and activates the VTEC cam anywhere over 2k rpm along with proper fuel and timing for all loads and boost at all rpm. Basically it allows the ecu to process boost like a factory turbo car's ecu does. The manufacturer of the SC (Jackson Racing) and Hondata got together due to the popularity of the setup at the time and put together the best tune they could after countless hours on the dyno and the result of proper ecu tuning is zero detonation at stock timing making it much more responsive, and an increase of power up to 256 at the wheels (over 150 stock on 8 psi). I was never into tuning Toyota's so not familiar. Weren't there any stand alone ecus for supra that could be re harnessed and reprogrammed to work in the Fjz80?
I then installed a "Hondata" ecu that got rid of all the band aids and increased injectors from 240 to 440 cc to be able to run stock fuel pressure. This system actually senses boost and activates the VTEC cam anywhere over 2k rpm along with proper fuel and timing for all loads and boost at all rpm. Basically it allows the ecu to process boost like a factory turbo car's ecu does. The manufacturer of the SC (Jackson Racing) and Hondata got together due to the popularity of the setup at the time and put together the best tune they could after countless hours on the dyno and the result of proper ecu tuning is zero detonation at stock timing making it much more responsive, and an increase of power up to 256 at the wheels (over 150 stock on 8 psi). I was never into tuning Toyota's so not familiar. Weren't there any stand alone ecus for supra that could be re harnessed and reprogrammed to work in the Fjz80?
- Thread starter
- #255
Any stand alone could be harnessed and repurposed for the 80, but it is simply a cost issue. Again base kit could be around $3-4k, but if you start adding injectors, harness, stand alone, etc, you start getting into $8-10k. This was offered when EMS was around they had a full kit advertised not a single person even asked about it. lol.
Back when EMS did Jamisobe's build I don't thing we saw any dyno data and the thread seemed to die off.
I think people didn't completely trust what EMS was doing. He seemed to have a lot of problems with other stuff he was building for other cars. Plus the issues with his exhaust systems. I personally liked his kit, but didn't want to drop the coin and have issues with parts and service or worst case engine failure.
I think people didn't completely trust what EMS was doing. He seemed to have a lot of problems with other stuff he was building for other cars. Plus the issues with his exhaust systems. I personally liked his kit, but didn't want to drop the coin and have issues with parts and service or worst case engine failure.
- Thread starter
- #258
- Thread starter
- #260
Why is that the question?? For $2k it is a piece of s*** ECU. You could go Haltech or Motec for that price.
