Aux tank fuel pump saga continues

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^ that appears to be the conclusion. I am going to test it a little more but so far so good.

My mechanic is proposing leaving the pumped mounted level with the outlet (which is obviously at the lowest part of the tank) and then protecting it with angle iron - partially encasing it. However, I would prefer to have the pump back in it's original location, midway up on the back of the tank, as it is most protected there.

However the pumps I have been using appear not to have the necessary sucking power to drain the tank from half full to empty when mounted midway up on the tank. Anyone know of a pump that can handle this kind of workload?

The current pump I am using is like this...
41GpultmIIL._SL500_AA300_.webp
 
Last edited by a moderator:
pegasis0066 said:
^ that appears to be the conclusion. I am going to test it a little more but so far so good.

My mechanic is proposing leaving the pumped mounted level with the outlet (which is obviously at the lowest part of the tank) and then protecting it with angle iron - partially encasing it. However, I would prefer to have the pump back in it's original location, midway up on the back of the tank, as it is most protected there.

However the pumps I have been using appear not to have the necessary sucking power to drain the tank from half full to empty when mounted midway up on the tank. Anyone know of a pump that can handle this kind of workload?
The current pump I am using is like this...
Click to expand...

Yep post #4 from your previous pump problem thread. ;)
 
ok revisited that thread - a Holley, but can you point me to a specific Holley? I have been to their website, but still not sure what pump?

Thanks
 
pegasis0066 said:
ok revisited that thread - a Holley, but can you point me to a specific Holley? I have been to their website, but still not sure what pump?

Thanks
Click to expand...

We have sucked many of 55gal drum dry with this pump in the picture along with a lot of dirt/crap (see picture of filter) We also use the same pump to provide fuel to the Trophy Truck for several years without issue. They were replaced every season so we have a lot of experience with used pumps doing things they were not designed to do. They are also rebuildable.

HTH

Note: pumps were not fused on truck
Holley1.webp
Holley.webp
MVC-123F.webp
 
Very cool Phil!!!
 
Another idea came to me, are you using rubber hose between tank and pump? Is it suction rated fuel line? Most fuel hose is used on pressure side, only place I have seen hose on suction side is in boats and it marine fuel line with an extra thick wall. A very short run of weak hose might get by without collapsing.
 
Skidoo said:
Another idea came to me, are you using rubber hose between tank and pump? Is it suction rated fuel line? Most fuel hose is used on pressure side, only place I have seen hose on suction side is in boats and it marine fuel line with an extra thick wall. A very short run of weak hose might get by without collapsing.
Click to expand...

I am using the hose that came with the FR kit, however I will still double check this.

But, why would I only have a problem when the aux tank is half full and never a problem when it's completely full?
 
As fuel level goes below pump level, pump has to create lower and lower pressure in hose to pull fuel.
 
I thought the transfer pump on my 40 was a Holley but it appears to be a Carter vane pump It has been used to transfer fuel tank to tank since '91 and suck dry and remained running too long with no fuel. Anyway a rotary vane pump should do the trick.
carter.webp
 
pegasis0066, did you ever come to a solution on the pump issues? A year later, how do feel about the tank? Would you do it again?

I am stuck between the FR tank, a setup like spressomon's, or just carrying a bunch of Scepter's.
 
Yes, we lowered the pump on the tank. The original mounting location was slightly below mid-level on the tank (see photo). My mechanic and I fashion a lower mounting spot, so the pump didn't have to pull fuel out of the tank as the level dropped.

The theory was that when the fuel in the tank fell the fluid pressure and gravity feeding was reduced to a point where the pump had to work to hard, eventually burning out or blowing fuses. From my research on these types of fuel pumps,, they are gravity feed and need to be mounted below the fuel tank.

With that said, I seem to be the only FR aux tank customer that has had this problem.
10Pumpwithaddedfilterconnectedtoaux.webp
 
Cool, thanks for the reply. I am thinking of purchasing the FR tank and then marrying it up with the OEM dual filler neck that I am trying to source right now. The only thing I didn't care for on the FR setup was their version of the filler neck.
 
Well, I have been e-mailing back and forth with Dave Stedman at Japan4x4 in an effort to track down the dual filler neck and the OEM sub-tank switch. We were running through part numbers and unfortunately couldn't find one that differentiated between the Type A and Type B inlets. So it looks like that is just a chance thing. I know that spressomon ended up with the Type A and rusty_tlc ended up with the Type B. I wonder if when they received the parts if the invoice / packing slips contained the full part number...I prefer the Type A myself.

Anyway, I am going to try to get pictures of the parts from Dave. He did send pricing...it sucks right now that the yen is so strong against the dollar. These things turn out to be pretty spendy...anyway, the sub-tank switch is 5550 yen (about $72) and the dual filler neck is 23,460 yen (just a hair over $300). Of course, if you wanted to take it to true OEM, it would be a stupid amount of money. I have looked over both schematics and there are just a ton of parts to make it work as designed from the factory. The basic transfer system is much, much more economical.

I have to play with the numbers now and see what route to go. If I just get the FR tank from Fernando and just use those parts, I think that is $700 wisely spent. If I use just the tank with one of the dual filler necks from Dave, I am looking at a $1000+.

Let me know if you are interested in getting one of the dual filler necks at that price. Dave said that they are OEM parts and easy to come by, so it would be no problem shipping two or more. We could save on shipping by shipping two at one time.
 
I got an OEM sub-tank switch for around $50-60. I can't recall where but will research.

Also, if you do a search on the 100 forum, there was a guy (Mud named started with am "M"... something like MOBI, but that's not it), that did an install with an OEM filler neck. He told me of a potential source on the west coast (again called recall who), but I never followed up.

The only thing the OEM filler neck does (vs the FR filler neck) is eliminates the need to re-orient the fuel nozzle to fill each tank. Instead it has some kind of pull rod to open/close the main neck (I believe that is correct, but I could be off a bit).

However, with a FR tank and an OEM filler neck, due to how FR moves fuel between the aux and main tanks, you would need modify the OEM filler neck to accomodate this process. I would have to see an OEM filler neck to explain in more detail, but as is, it won't work.
 
Yeah, let me know on that sub-tank switch. That is a little bit better pricing.

The type A filler neck does eliminate the need to re-orient the fuel nozzle, but the type B is very similar to the FR inlet in that you have to re-orient the nozzle. Not a big detail at all. The biggest issue I saw with your install and FR inlet was the finished opening at the gas tank inlet door. I need it to look OEM as possible from the outside.

And as you mentioned, the OEM dual filler neck doesn't allow for transfer of fuel between the two tanks at that part of the fuel pathway...it takes place further down the chain with solenoids and electrical connections to the sub-tank switch in cab. Trying to source all those parts would be a nightmare and lots of money.

I was thinking of either welding a bung onto the main tank filler and running fuel line from the fuel pump from the FR setup. Or cutting out a section and putting in a tee with flexible hose.

Thanks for the heads up on the guy here who could source the dual filler necks on the West Coast. I will pore over the threads one more time and see if I can find his contact info.
 
VidereStudios said:
Well, I have been e-mailing back and forth with Dave Stedman at Japan4x4 in an effort to track down the dual filler neck and the OEM sub-tank switch. We were running through part numbers and unfortunately couldn't find one that differentiated between the Type A and Type B inlets. So it looks like that is just a chance thing. I know that spressomon ended up with the Type A and rusty_tlc ended up with the Type B. I wonder if when they received the parts if the invoice / packing slips contained the full part number...I prefer the Type A myself.

Anyway, I am going to try to get pictures of the parts from Dave. He did send pricing...it sucks right now that the yen is so strong against the dollar. These things turn out to be pretty spendy...anyway, the sub-tank switch is 5550 yen (about $72) and the dual filler neck is 23,460 yen (just a hair over $300). Of course, if you wanted to take it to true OEM, it would be a stupid amount of money. I have looked over both schematics and there are just a ton of parts to make it work as designed from the factory. The basic transfer system is much, much more economical.

I have to play with the numbers now and see what route to go. If I just get the FR tank from Fernando and just use those parts, I think that is $700 wisely spent. If I use just the tank with one of the dual filler necks from Dave, I am looking at a $1000+.

Let me know if you are interested in getting one of the dual filler necks at that price. Dave said that they are OEM parts and easy to come by, so it would be no problem shipping two or more. We could save on shipping by shipping two at one time.
Click to expand...


Just an FYI: The Type A, dual routes fuel to the tanks via one flapper door, is what I have. The only nit has to do with CA type fuel vapor collection hose accordions: They're stiff and you need to hold the filler in place while filling up at the gas station. I would presume Type B would be a bigger PITA with respect to filling with CA type vapor collectors.
100 sub and main tank-6.webp
 
spressomon, thanks for adding that valuable input. All the more reason to try to source the Type A inlet style dual filler neck.

When you got your part from Dave, did you happen to see a XXXXX-XXXXX part number on anything? It would be awesome to be able to target the exact part.
 
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