are 80 oem recovery points ok for strap recovery?

[WildYoats]

like this?

https://forum.ih8mud.com/showpost.php?p=868522&postcount=149

I was in Moab to observe the above incident regarding the OEM loops. With that said, I will no longer use them as recovery points. The incident was not anything out the ordinary that would have put a extreme load on it. It was somewhat alarming indeed.

 

[aim]

Having seen the state of the welded nut inside the frame rail on my '92 that spent most of its life in Maine, I too would be at least as concerned about the bolts than about the loop.

I've used the OEM with straps and winch fine to pull and be pulled. That said, my rear tow points are also welded to the frame too along with the grade 8 bolts.

I have, again, pulled and been pulled from the front ARB ones with no problems using both straps and winch.

-o-

 

[e9999]

these are all good points.
I'm reconsidering the possible use of my tow hitch for snatching pending something better... that thing is wide though, but I don't think it'd do much more than bend...

 

[OGBeno]

Having seen the state of the welded nut inside the frame rail on my '92 that spent most of its life in Maine, I too would be at least as concerned about the bolts than about the loop.

I agree. Toyota tack welds the captured nuts (IIRC) on the inside of the frame and some deteriorate pretty quickly due to environmental factors.

That's why a nice MIG weld all the way around keeps things at least more secure than just the captured nuts and the grade 8's.

Cheers.
-onur
Akron, OH

 

[PHAEDRUS]

The tack welds holding the nuts in place have nothing to do wit the failures in the two hooks themselves. The tacks simply hold the nut in place while you tighten. Once the bolts are in it is the pressure of the bolt through the frame rail that is carrying the stress. I personally have had to re tack a new nut on my rears and have pulled out a 8k tractor with my home made rear that utilizes these bolts and they hold up fine.
The issue on the oem hooks is that they appear to be a manual (not robotic) mig done in static transfer, So the penetration is only as good as the welder who welded them on. The other issue at play here in my opinion is that these hooks mounted on the base of the frame rails are the first thing that usually hits the ground on a break over situation. this abuse I think leads to their failure.
Dave

 

[OGBeno]

The tack welds holding the nuts in place have nothing to do wit the failures in the two hooks themselves. The tacks simply hold the nut in place while you tighten. Once the bolts are in it is the pressure of the bolt through the frame rail that is carrying the stress. I personally have had to re tack a new nut on my rears and have pulled out a 8k tractor with my home made rear that utilizes these bolts and they hold up fine.
The issue on the oem hooks is that they appear to be a manual (not robotic) mig done in static transfer, So the penetration is only as good as the welder who welded them on. The other issue at play here in my opinion is that these hooks mounted on the base of the frame rails are the first thing that usually hits the ground on a break over situation. this abuse I think leads to their failure.
Dave

Thanks for clearing it up for me Dave.
-o-

 

[concretejungle]

I can attest to the strength of the OEM tow loops. Just last weekend i was stuck bad, with one wheel buried deep in a thick ice hole. I was hooked up to a tacoma and he literally had a 5 foot start and yanked on the hook at approximatly a 60 degree angle at least 6 times before i got out. Tow hoop looked fine.

 

[aim]

Good to know about the problem. In my case, the captured nuts sat in a frame rail filled with salted sand. The rear of the two bolts was holding on by a couple of threads. May have had something to do with POs messing with a hitch.

The issue on the oem hooks is that they appear to be a manual (not robotic) mig done in static transfer, So the penetration is only as good as the welder who welded them on. The other issue at play here in my opinion is that these hooks mounted on the base of the frame rails are the first thing that usually hits the ground on a break over situation. this abuse I think leads to their failure.
Dave

 

[Dusty]

I have never seen a reciever hitch mounted D-ring break-i too have one that has seen many pulls from the back of my Heep Grand Cher. however this tow loci has never seemed a good one to me. Yea the massive piece of steel that bolts to the frame in many places is impressive. but think about that piece of 2x2 tubing welded to the D-ring that is loosely suspended within the reciever by a pin you may have got at walmart for $2-and when it clanks tight from a hard pull your teeth chatter. this basic hitch set up is used all the time to pull 10,000 lb trailers but I feel more comfortable jerking from a point bolted down tight to the frame with more than one bolt. Probably not an issue it just seems odd that all that hitch assembly resides on that pin. Perhaps it may be better to hve a grade 8 for such use-but even then the bolt isn't tight

 

[IdahoDoug]

Dusty,

On a rear hitch stinger recovery point, that pin holding the stinger in is what you're referring to? Same one that holds in a removable towing stinger? Don't worry about it. It's not stressed much at all since the forces on it basically try to slice it in two, so literally just compression from the sides. I have seen a trailer get caught on a tree and stop the moving tow vehicle dead with not even a cosmetic mar on that pin. About the only thing you can do wrong here is to put a strap in the hole and pass the pin through it, in which case you can bend them. I've done this myself a lot over the years before I bought the stinger shackle and I've never bent one, so just passing it along as I've heard anecdotally it's possible to bend those stout pins.

DougM

 

[Scott_sFZJ80]

I heard alot of stories about whether they were good enough or not so I made a couple of basic mods and put on proper recovery hooks.

If I was going to keep the original loops I was going to take them off and get a couple of extra welds on them for piece of mind.

johnmrson
What mods were necessary to make the hooks work?

 

[e9999]

if one is worried about the bolts and nuts on teh OEM hoops, couldn't one just put a long grade 8 all the way through the frame rail, with another nut on top?

 

[PHAEDRUS]

it would work ok but it seems like overkill. plus the only way to drill through would be to knock the captive nut loose (us an impact hammer with a long chisel) and then drill from teh bottom through. just do not overtighten or you will deflect the frame rail and put undue pressure on it.
Dave

 

[e9999]

IIRC there is already a hole somewhere on top that is aligned with the bottom nut isn't there?

 

[PHAEDRUS]

Not that I recall but I have been wrong before.
Dave

 

[DirtyHarry]

I always try to use a choker chain or short strap connected to BOTH front or rear recovery points when I need a yank. Obviously this isn't always possible depending on the angle but it does seem to spread out the load a little.

 

[Tools R Us]

if one is worried about the bolts and nuts on teh OEM hoops, couldn't one just put a long grade 8 all the way through the frame rail, with another nut on top?

If you did that when load is applied the frame rails would crush effectively loosening the nut. The way to do it properly is, drill a large hole and sleeve the frame with a piece of DOM. You would be better off just mounting proper recovery points to the bumper or frame.

 

[Tools R Us]

I always try to use a choker chain or short strap connected to BOTH front or rear recovery points when I need a yank. Obviously this isn't always possible depending on the angle but it does seem to spread out the load a little.

The tow hooks are designed for forward load, By using a short choker and pulling on the it, the load is trying to pull the hooks/frame rails together, putting a large side loading on them, not good. I have seen hooks and frame rails bent using this technique, if your going to use a choker, make it a long one so the pull angle is less severe.

 

[DirtyHarry]

The tow hooks are designed for forward load, By using a short choker and pulling on the it, the load is trying to pull the hooks/frame rails together, putting a large side loading on them, not good. I have seen hooks and frame rails bent using this technique, if your going to use a choker, make it a long one so the pull angle is less severe.

That is a good point Kevin. A lot of times in the tight canyon trails we have in Nevada a straight pull is not possible, but the longer choker is a good idea.

 

[semlin]

has anyone seen decent recovery points mounted on an ARB bullbar? I am assuming you would want to use a backing plate.