Appreciate it. This is exactly what I was looking for. I'll have to study it and see how difficult 16+ would be.Found it for you:
Anyone change to manual AC controls on a 16+?
- Thread starter dnh1
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Seems to me you are overthinking this and may end up with a cheap look alike Chinese part with less reliability.
Or on a lucky day creating an issue changing out the control panel while not reconfiguring things in techstream.
No, the wiper defroster is only accessible by touchscreen on the U.S. models. HVAC defrost and the physical windshield wiper defrosting heat cable built into the windshield are different functions.
Like I said, auto works well for most things, but sometimes I want more air on the windshield on defrost but perhaps at a lower temp than what auto or just hitting the defrost will do, especially after a workout. Or perhaps I want air only on my feet, or I want it only on my feet and my wife only wants the main louvers blowing. On the U.S. version, you have to use the touchscreen for these functions.
I can live with the system as is, just restating again that I would have preferred a hard button system where less could go wrong, and less to navigate through. You would think an engineer would logically agree with that. The hard button system still has the auto feature, but keeps controls limited to that unit and no tie in to touch screen. I assume if the overseas units have the wiper defroster, it is a physical button similar to what my wife's 4runner has.
If my touchscreen died, I'd be open to put in the physical button setup if it was plug and play, but I don't have the time to jerry rig it to work in our 200s. I'd probably just source an overpriced replacement unfortunately.
I am most definitely overthinking it. This is mud after all hahah. I'm currently on day 37 of my "quick intercooler install" on my 81 and my interior has been completely removed because I overthink everything
But to your point, no it's the opposite. I'm not sure what you mean by cheap Chinese parts, I never mentioned that. I want an OEM solution. Which will only be available for so long. 80s for example are starting to have more and more parts become NLA. Toyota does have a Heritage parts program which is great, but they will only be focusing on parts that "make the vehicle run, start, or stop." AKA nothing comfort or cosmetic.
100s still have a lot of parts in production but those are starting to dry up too. If you spend any time on Amyama or Megazip or Partsouq you know how it is. I'm not a parts guru like some, but I would guess that 200 parts will stay in production for a while more. The stuff that Toyota makes for a long time is essential parts like engine and drivetrain parts, rubber, seals, etc. On the 80 for example, if you want HVAC parts you probably need to find a supplier like Jumeirah that stockpiles NOS or good condition used parts.
All that to say - now is the time to do a conversion like this, when you can still acquire legit OEM parts from overseas.
Yeah, just skimming through that link you provided is promising but it is a LOT of work and opportunity for error. I too don't mind the system but in my mind its two biggest failings are 1. outdated/no carplay and 2. integrated and critical to HVAC, cameras, settings, etc.
Ideal setup would be standalone HVAC system with buttons, and a standalone deck that you can easily update.
I'll have to sit down and go through the menu system, to be honest I don't use the screen for much more than music. Maybe there are too many features that would be lost if the screen was deleted?
greynolds
SILVER Star
It would really be awesome if the button control panels (I'm going to avoid the use of manual to avoid the wrath of the engineer) from the Middle East (and other markets that may use them) were a plug and play replacement for the touchscreen based controls that have been forced on us here in the US. For those of us who live in climates where we get 4 real seasons, there are features, such as the wiper defrost, that are really a PITA to get to with the touchscreen, but would be really easy to use with old-school push button controls that still maintain the very useful auto features. Having to use the touchscreen for some functions wouldn't be as frustrating if it were laid out more logically and more responsive. When you need to turn on some of the features, like the wiper defrost in the middle of a snow storm, the last thing you want is to be distracted by a kludgy touchscreen interface. This was one of the negatives I immediately noticed when I switched from my 2017 G-Wagon to my 2020 LC - the G-Wagon had lots of buttons and didn't rely on the screen for HVAC functions, but once you were familiar with the layout, everything was very easy to use without looking.
If swapping to the button control panels requires cutting up the wiring harness to make it work, then questions about reliability start to come into play, even when genuine Toyota parts are being used. There's also the obvious question about giving up features - do those button control panels have buttons for everything that's on the touchscreen?
Regarding the Tesla style replacement units, I share some of the same concerns over long term reliability, but I went for it anyway just over a year ago and am happy I did. Getting the replacement unit up and running well took some effort and I definitely wouldn't recommend someone who isn't somewhat computer / tech savvy to tackle it (I'm a software developer and have also done a decent number of stereo swaps in cars over the years). The physical install isn't too bad at all (no soldering / splicing / crimping required - it's all plug and play so I can swap the factory unit back in, if needed), it's the configuration and getting past the initial buggy firmware (thanks for the custom firmware, Sergey...) these things tend to ship with that took the real effort. These units do have limited physical buttons BUT come with a feature that allows you to remap the buttons to do pretty much whatever you want them to do, so you can assign your most frequently used features to physical buttons and use the touchscreen for everything else. These Tesla style things are frustratingly close to perfect once you get them up and running, but do NOT go into it expecting perfection or you will be disappointed.
If swapping to the button control panels requires cutting up the wiring harness to make it work, then questions about reliability start to come into play, even when genuine Toyota parts are being used. There's also the obvious question about giving up features - do those button control panels have buttons for everything that's on the touchscreen?
Regarding the Tesla style replacement units, I share some of the same concerns over long term reliability, but I went for it anyway just over a year ago and am happy I did. Getting the replacement unit up and running well took some effort and I definitely wouldn't recommend someone who isn't somewhat computer / tech savvy to tackle it (I'm a software developer and have also done a decent number of stereo swaps in cars over the years). The physical install isn't too bad at all (no soldering / splicing / crimping required - it's all plug and play so I can swap the factory unit back in, if needed), it's the configuration and getting past the initial buggy firmware (thanks for the custom firmware, Sergey...) these things tend to ship with that took the real effort. These units do have limited physical buttons BUT come with a feature that allows you to remap the buttons to do pretty much whatever you want them to do, so you can assign your most frequently used features to physical buttons and use the touchscreen for everything else. These Tesla style things are frustratingly close to perfect once you get them up and running, but do NOT go into it expecting perfection or you will be disappointed.
bloc
SILVER Star
Has anyone seen a wiper heater button on one of these units? Or any way to control them outside of the nav unit?
The wiper heaters are most likely controlled by the BCM and if there are any markets with manual control there’s a good chance they can be triggered manually with an accessory switch.
The wiper heaters are most likely controlled by the BCM and if there are any markets with manual control there’s a good chance they can be triggered manually with an accessory switch.
The HVAC and entertainment systems are still modular. There is no shortage of non-oem screens that can control the HVAC. I can't imagine spending thousands of dollars while you have a working system to fix something that may never be a problem and certainly most likely won't be for some time. If the time comes and the screen breaks and finding an OEM replacement isn't feasible, there's always the aftermarket screens to turn to. Plus "Auto" mode does account for a good portion of necessary controls. Spending thousands of dollars just to have quicker access to windshield wiper heaters seems funny as well. But hey, I'm in Arkansas, so that's not a feature I need very often. If you really want to play it safe, buy a new OEM screen and put it on the shelf.
True. And that's why I asked here originally if anyone had done it. If it's $1K or so in parts, some DIY labor, and add a $400 carplay head unit, I'd be all for it. If it takes significantly more money and time and it's not simple, I'll probably just continue to use it as is. Based on how many 100s have problems as noted above, I have a feeling 200s will not be immune but yeah that's years down the road.
Interesting. Good perspective. I'm definitely a button and physical control enthusiast when it comes down to it. I would imagine 200 owners are split into two camps, those who would trade their 200 for a manual VDJ79 in a hearbeat, and those who absolutely would not, if you know what I mean
greynolds
SILVER Star
If I had the choice with plug and play options, I would go with genuine Toyota physical buttons for ALL of the HVAC stuff and replace the factory head unit with an aftermarket Android/CarPlay unit. Since that doesn't seem to be feasible, the Tesla style unit was the best alternative for me. I tried one of the modules that adds CarPlay to the factory screen before going with the Tesla style option and found that it just came with too many compromises.
That's partially what got me thinking on this topic. I was looking at EC Offroad for their 200 series Carplay unit. Figured if it costs $1K just to add carplay, I could use that money to instead switch HVAC to physical buttons and then only have to spend $400 or so on a Pioneer or Sony head unit.
Did you try EC or NaviPlus or...?
greynolds
SILVER Star
The one I tried was the EC Offroad module. I ended up purchasing the Tesla style unit direct from the manufacturer for less than the cost of that EC Offroad module and a LOT less than EC Offroad's Tesla style unit. The cost for the Tesla style unit was around $850 with shipping and then another $100 for Sergey's custom firmware that odds a ton of features and fixes a bunch of issues with the factory firmware in those units. Keep in mind that the current Tesla style units use a newer version of Android and Sergey doesn't have firmware for those newer units yet (or at least didn't as of a month or 2 ago), but he's working on it.
I share your disdain for so much being in the screen. That said, when my 2008 had head audio issues, the functionality of the screen and the HVAC controls was unaffected if that makes you feel any better. And that was fixed by a fuse replacement, even on a 15 year old 200 with 270k miles.
As screens and software are much cheaper than buttons and knobs these days (and arguably more reliable), and most consumers see screens as an "upgrade", we're unlikely to see this trend reversing anytime soon.
As screens and software are much cheaper than buttons and knobs these days (and arguably more reliable), and most consumers see screens as an "upgrade", we're unlikely to see this trend reversing anytime soon.
greynolds
SILVER Star
While I suppose a screen might be more reliable than a switch (I haven't seen or looked for stats, though a quality switch can be rated for 10's of millions of actuations), all it takes is the failure of 1 component (the screen) to wipe out numerous controls. A single button failing disables only that 1 control.
One big advantage to using the screen is that features can be added/removed/changed with a software or firmware update.
Either way, there's no doubt that the use of screens is the future that we're going to be living with. More responsive hardware and more thoughtful UX design should, over time, resolve many of the complaints us diehard button fans have, but we definitely aren't there yet, especially with the 200 series.
I wish someone tried this, lol.
Non-US version with manual A/C controls exist, including 4-zone AC. No defrost button, but frankly I'd give defrost for full manual HVAC control and not being beholden to crappy NAV screen. I believe I used defrost once in 7 years. It is so buried I tend to forget it exists. What a retarded design.
Another challenge would be the the passenger seat occupancy system. It is integrated into the unit. Another insane regulation foisted by insurance companies on us. Have you checked the cost of the passenger seat cushion with this crap?! It is insane. I'd rather have extra airbags deploy.
And the commies in the previous administration wanted to add it to rear seats in new cars.
Non-US version with manual A/C controls exist, including 4-zone AC. No defrost button, but frankly I'd give defrost for full manual HVAC control and not being beholden to crappy NAV screen. I believe I used defrost once in 7 years. It is so buried I tend to forget it exists. What a retarded design.
Another challenge would be the the passenger seat occupancy system. It is integrated into the unit. Another insane regulation foisted by insurance companies on us. Have you checked the cost of the passenger seat cushion with this crap?! It is insane. I'd rather have extra airbags deploy.
And the commies in the previous administration wanted to add it to rear seats in new cars.
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That looks really nice and would be Toyota OEM parts at accompanying costs.
While this may not be your thing, i have considered this, which seems to have a lot of HVAC manual buttons and a nice wide screen LC300 style. I kind of warmed up to it when I saw the Singapore dude on YT with his travels from London to Singapore by LC200. Still it is a risk adding failure points and it also requires you to cut some plastic parts of the OEM dash making it nonreversible. So really not good and not cheap either (around $1200 to $1500).
While this may not be your thing, i have considered this, which seems to have a lot of HVAC manual buttons and a nice wide screen LC300 style. I kind of warmed up to it when I saw the Singapore dude on YT with his travels from London to Singapore by LC200. Still it is a risk adding failure points and it also requires you to cut some plastic parts of the OEM dash making it nonreversible. So really not good and not cheap either (around $1200 to $1500).
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Does not look too bad indeed, but I hate cutting OEM dash, and also not crazy about lack of a rotary knob/dial for volume.
I like the black wood on the steering wheel and glove box trim. Obviously would have to change the doors as well. Unfortunately have not found any easy aftermarket pieces for that other than what seems stickers over the existing trim, which is no thank you, with a big NO.
