94 Cruiser - alternator or starter (1 Viewer)

[gspremington]

Hi all. New to the forum. Aspiring but novice mechanic. Just acquired a 1994 land cruiser that was rarely used last 10 years and not started since 2021. 234k miles. Lots of issues I will need to work through to revive it to its former glory.

I was able to start (after replacing battery) and drive it ~50 miles to relocate it. Wheel bearings sound bad. It started a couple times thereafter, but 10 days later is now dead again and wont start. I suspect alternator, but not sure how to confirm that over starter issue. Can i jump it again to examine or are there alternator tests?

On the list once I get it started: Radiator flush, oil change, wheel bearings treatment, sunroof leak repair, mirror wobble fix. General cleanup of engine area.
Is there any other major services I need to look into given the length of time it sat unused? Will not be doing any major off road (yet). Just around town for now.

Thanks in advance for any insights.

 

[bhsdriller]

Jump it to start then read the voltage at the terminals with it running.
Or same thing but charge battery completely than do the same test

 

[gspremington]

Jump it to start then read the voltage at the terminals with it running.
Or same thing but charge battery completely than do the same test

After jump starting, turn on the radio, lights, hvac and measure that voltage remains above 14 to confirm the alternator is doing its job?

And if it falls below a certain level or the car dies, then that suggests alternator or belt replacement?

 

[bhsdriller]

idk if you need to turn everything on
Easier if battery is charged first but you could take a battery reading off (~12 something volts) then running (~13.5+) and then you know it's charging or not

belt wouldn't have anything to do with it unless it's missing lol

 

[Rusty Marlin]

belt wouldn't have anything to do with it unless it's missing lol

Or squeeling real bad.

hasn't started since '21 and was basically neglected before that.
So the battery is a min of 3 years old, and left to go dead and uncharged.
If i was a betting man, I'd say you need a new battery.

 

[DIRTBIKEUSA]

Clean all batt connections. Check grey connector with white wire behind the battery for corrosion and damage.

Check large battery cables for corrosion between alt and battery. Check for volt drop between alt STUD and battery STUD while running. Should drop no more than .2v

 

[gspremington]

Battery was just newly replaced ~3 weeks ago and corrosion protector added to terminals at that time. started right up. Will re-check for loose connection.

Or squeeling real bad.

hasn't started since '21 and was basically neglected before that.
So the battery is a min of 3 years old, and left to go dead and uncharged.
If i was a betting man, I'd say you need a new battery.

Will take a look at these below for issues.

Clean all batt connections. Check grey connector with white wire behind the battery for corrosion and damage.

Check large battery cables for corrosion between alt and battery. Check for volt drop between alt STUD and battery STUD while running. Should drop no more than .2v

Plan is to investigate the above, measure battery voltage off, jump start and then if it starts leave running and measure for voltage loss while running and between batt and alternator. Will report back findings. Many thanks.

 

[jonheld]

Typically when alternators fail, you get the Christmas tree lights on the dash.
After the truck has sat overnight, not running, battery voltage should be around 12.5 to 12.6 depending on the type of battery.
Voltage at the battery terminals after startup should be 14.4 VDC if the alternator is functional.
In any case, the fusible links off the positive battery terminal should be replaced. Part# 90982-08264. About $17 from any Toyota dealer.

 

[gspremington]

Typically when alternators fail, you get the Christmas tree lights on the dash.
After the truck has sat overnight, not running, battery voltage should be around 12.5 to 12.6 depending on the type of battery.
Voltage at the battery terminals after startup should be 14.4 VDC if the alternator is functional.
In any case, the fusible links off the positive battery terminal should be replaced. Part# 90982-08264. About $17 from any Toyota dealer.

OK. I was finally able to test. Yes, Christmas tree Lights present when tethered. It started but died 30 - 60 seconds after removing jumper cables. After a longer tether charge, I measured the battery with my multimeter and it was 14.1 but began dropping down to single digits. Same from alternator to negative on the battery.

Fairly sure i need to replace the alternator I know there are lots of posts already outlining how so will study up and purchase supplies.
Question: Any other adjacent or convenient things I should fix while doing this? Starter too? I will look into @jonheld's fusible links suggestions.

 

[DIRTBIKEUSA]

Upgrade your alt now! There are several places to get this done. I used Quality power and I’m satisfied with the work they did.

 

[gspremington]

Upgrade your alt now! There are several places to get this done. I used Quality power and I’m satisfied with the work they did.

Is there any real benefit or need to upgrade from the stock 80A unit? I might trailer a boat at some point or small camper but unsure why more is needed that justifies the additional costs and upgrade parts?

 

[DIRTBIKEUSA]

Is there any real benefit or need to upgrade from the stock 80A unit? I might trailer a boat at some point or small camper but unsure why more is needed that justifies the additional costs and upgrade parts?

Maybe you want a winch with duel batts in the future. Maybe AUX lighting, maybe some other electrical accessory for the trail or cab like inverter for camping..

If you upgrade now you have room to grow..

 

[jonheld]

OK. I was finally able to test. Yes, Christmas tree Lights present when tethered. It started but died 30 - 60 seconds after removing jumper cables. After a longer tether charge, I measured the battery with my multimeter and it was 14.1 but began dropping down to single digits. Same from alternator to negative on the battery.

Fairly sure i need to replace the alternator I know there are lots of posts already outlining how so will study up and purchase supplies.
Question: Any other adjacent or convenient things I should fix while doing this? Starter too? I will look into @jonheld's fusible links suggestions.

If the alternator has not been charging the battery and the battery is discharged, it would be wise to replace the battery as well. Flooded cell batteries usually will not come back to 100% after being severely discharged.

 

[jonheld]

Is there any real benefit or need to upgrade from the stock 80A unit? I might trailer a boat at some point or small camper but unsure why more is needed that justifies the additional costs and upgrade parts?

Personally I've never seen the need. IMO a good battery with good reserve capacity, properly rated cables, and proper connections are more useful.
I like to keep things simple and as OEM as practical.
It is the battery that supplies power for the larger loads. The alternator tries to keep the battery charged and will vary its output based on the state of charge of the battery.
There are hundreds of FJ40s, 45s, and 60s out there still running around with the OEM 60 amp alternator.

 

[BTLSHP]

I will say that at 234k the brushes in my original alternator were worn - black all over the copper bands. Bearings seemed just fine, cheap $20 fix while doing the harmonic balancer which was not so cheap.

 

[gspremington]

I will say that at 234k the brushes in my original alternator were worn - black all over the copper bands. Bearings seemed just fine, cheap $20 fix while doing the harmonic balancer which was not so cheap.

Is the suggestion here to first try replacing the brushes instead of the whole alternator (along with the fusible link) to see if its a $20 fix vs $260?

 

[BTLSHP]

Is the suggestion here to first try replacing the brushes instead of the whole alternator (along with the fusible link) to see if its a $20 fix vs $260?

Unless you have electrical loads that draw more than the 80/90 amps the standard alternator can provide -or- feel the bearings are going once you can spin it without the belts on. Somewhere else on this forum I have heard that running every load puts you just under 60 amps (IDK).

This can be done with the alternator on the car, I took mine off just to get a better feel for bearing condition.

Once you get in there you will be able to see the copper surfaces the brushes run against. Brushes at the end of life arc and leave the copper black. That is your real hint the brushes were the issue.

I am cleaning up a '94 to hand off to my daughter, I checked the brushes after seeing flaky voltage issues on a little tire pressure gizmo in the cigarette lighter. Also, 240k is when the brushes in my Lexus gave out stranding my wife.

 

[gspremington]

If the alternator has not been charging the battery and the battery is discharged, it would be wise to replace the battery as well. Flooded cell batteries usually will not come back to 100% after being severely discharged.

Sad update. The alternator was replaced last fall and it operated briefly. It ran and restarted a few times post replacement (It's very sparingly used as it still needs other work to be reliable) but eventually would not restart. Edit: It's possible the battery was depleted/damaged pre-alternator replacement.

I recently tried to start and battery was totally dead. Autozone tested and confirmed dead, bad cells. It was maybe 6 months old at the time. AZ replaced with a new one .... but now the Cruiser still won't start.

When I hook in the new battery, I get a series of clicking noises, but the starter or engine wont turn over and catch. I think Christmas tree lights are present as well.

Any ideas on what is the issue now after new battery and alternator? It's a brand new battery. I can try and jump start it to get it going, but that seems like it would not be necessary.

 

[BTLSHP]

Charge the battery, have someone try and start the car while you are lightly tapping the starter motor with something like a long socket extension. If it starts, then you know it is either time to re-build the starter motor plunger assembly or replacement the starter.

Otherwise, somewhere on this site there is an excellent step-by-step for ignoring an fixing no start conditions. I can't fin it now. One thing to pay attention to is the status of the fusible link off the positive battery terminal. It is literally a matter of turning the ignition on an confirming the correct lights come on in the Spedo housing.


Found the link:

Emergency Troubleshooting Procedures - FAQ Item (Recommend Keeping Copy in Truck)

For updates or revisions, please PM me, nuclerlemon or semlin The below is a troubleshooting guide if your in the boonies to help isolate a non starting vehicle problem. This is a compilation from forum members, specifically RavenTai, KliersLC, Landtank and Beaowulf. This will not catch each...

forum.ih8mud.com

 

[jonheld]

When I hook in the new battery, I get a series of clicking noises, but the starter or engine wont turn over and catch. I think Christmas tree lights are present as well.

Sounds like a dead battery to me. Dash lights should be illuminated with the key in the ON position without the engine running.