I'm still kicking myself for driving right by the Land Cruiser Heritage Museum in SLC in the summer of '16 on I-80 and not even knowing it was there. If I go out west this summer for any reason, including LCDC, I'll sure try to get there. I would not be averse to SLC as the base city, meeting at the museum, buying a bunch of cool stuff at Cruiser Outfitters, and checking out local trails with those having local knowledge. On my own, I would also shoot down to southern Utah pre or post meet up to get back to the Cedar Breaks/Bryce/Zion/E-GS area as well as Moab. So much to see/do in that part of the world and some fav areas I've not been back to for many years.
Events/Trails 4th Annual 200LCDC Event
- Thread starter codyaustin5
- Start date
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The Swell is a pretty big area with a ton of cool trails. But I agree, finding a central base-camp type of area is pretty tough for Southern Utah without a roaming group. Decent hotels/Motels are few and far between. Even if it was Moab, the Swell is about 1.5hrs away. Same with Monument Valley (pretty much the picture perfect version of "The Southwest") is about 2.5hrs from Moab.
RET2
SILVER Star
I'm in wherever we go? Missed '17, not going to miss '18
Markuson
SILVER Star
I would definitely be up for a Overland-Keep-Moving trip...even if not THE event for LCDC. Let's do it! Kokopelli (spelling?) Trail out of Moab would be one option that's come up before.
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I know I don’t have a new Cruiser yet but Alaska has been on my bucket list. Another bucket list is Trans-America highway and of course the ultimate journey “Continental divide trail” 2500mi
Taco2Cruiser
Crazy American Off Road
I like your comment on not losing the drivers that for whatever reason could not do a tougher self sufficient trip. If everything worked out though, I think it would be best to always had the Overland trip always finish at the always in the same spot meet up.
It gives the pre run guys a chance to slow down, and it gives the ones that couldn’t join hear a trail report right when it is done.
To go another direction about your comment on a spring run, that might be something to look into also. Because unless I leave the military, the time frame LCDC is will almost never work for me. I’m sure there are other people the boat with me also. July is really a better month to travel. School is out for one thing.
Canyonero
Beating up Land Cruisers since 2015
Maybe this is an important concept to flush out for planning purposes.
- Do people prefer the LCDC to be a big event, with sponsors, vendors, etc., or do people prefer it to be a smaller more informal group?
I think it's worth pointing out that as soon as we designate someone the leader of an event, there is immediately a lot of pressure on that person (or persons) to make sure the event goes well. This past 3rd Annual LCDC really cemented that concept. I'm not saying that's a bad thing, necessarily, but I will point out that this was never the original intent.
When you go big on events like this, here's some of what inevitably ensues:
- Sign ups for trails in advance. Certain trails get "full" based on a quota system.
- Trail leaders. The criteria for this position gets more strict, invariably, due to liability. Trail leaders will need to show competence with various tasks, familiarity with trails, carry the right communication equipment, etc.
- People butt heads about the direction the "event" should go.
- Structured events. Raffles. Vendor presentations.
So I think we are at a turning point for what happens next.
I would personally not be opposed to adding "minimum build requirements" to attendees, to ensure that people who are truly enthusiastic about the 200 are the ones who go. Nothing crazy, but making a somewhat built 200 the cost of admission makes sense to me. I'm guessing that's not a popular opinion, but it makes sense I think.
Perhaps one big group gathering first, then the "teams" break off and do their own routes (whatever state/country that may be) for a few/several days, then everyone meets back up again for one more group gathering. It would be a lot of driving but that's what it's all about, driving.
Worst thing is to have one of the LCDC team burnout from dealing with something that may be evolving beyond expectations. Doubt the magnitude of what is was ever expected.
Its about having a low stress break from everyday reality. Thats what this years moab pre-funk will be again.
Its about having a low stress break from everyday reality. Thats what this years moab pre-funk will be again.
I am sort of interested in this, but I would need a scenario where I could park my travel trailer in a central location and do day trips from there. Next Summer my ‘13 will have 33 inch tires and hopefully sliders. I will probably add skid plates later, just to decrease the worry factor. I am COMPLETELY uninterested in banging up the truck but would love to explore the easy to moderate unpaved high passes or the Escalante back country. I have no issues with shelf roads but I really do not want to scar up the truck needlessly.
John Davies
Spokane WA
John Davies
Spokane WA
I really like how the LCDC was done this year. I don't necessarily feel it needs vendors, sponsors, etc. But there were multiple suggested trail routes over multiple days, so even if a trail group filled up one day you could likely run it another day. I know setting up an event like this is a challenge, and I hope if it's too much for the guys doing it that they'll look for volunteers in the forum to help. Being in Chicago I can't pre-run trails out west but I'd be happy to lend a hand in some other way remotely.
Also from what I saw (and admittedly I didn't get to CO until Friday afternoon) the groups on each trail changed regularly so lots of people got a chance to wheel with different people. There didn't appear to be any clique who moved from trail to trail together and didn't want to meet others. This was my first LCDC and the most challenging trails I've had the opportunity to run, but everyone was great and nobody made me feel like I should stick with a newbie group instead.
As far as timing goes, 3-4 days seems optimal, and I have kids so personally doing the event in the summer works best for me. That's not to say I couldn't make a trip if it was moved to May or October, maybe without the family, but it would be a lot harder for me to go since just the round trip drive adds several days to my trip, which means more time off. I'm lucky enough to be able to get 2 weeks off in the summer at least, and last year it worked out well that we could do the LCDC and then take some family time to do UT and the Grand Canyon.
FWIW I appreciate that having your LC built wasn't a requirement to meet up for the LCDC. To a large extent your build dictates the kinds of trails you can do anyway.
Also from what I saw (and admittedly I didn't get to CO until Friday afternoon) the groups on each trail changed regularly so lots of people got a chance to wheel with different people. There didn't appear to be any clique who moved from trail to trail together and didn't want to meet others. This was my first LCDC and the most challenging trails I've had the opportunity to run, but everyone was great and nobody made me feel like I should stick with a newbie group instead.
As far as timing goes, 3-4 days seems optimal, and I have kids so personally doing the event in the summer works best for me. That's not to say I couldn't make a trip if it was moved to May or October, maybe without the family, but it would be a lot harder for me to go since just the round trip drive adds several days to my trip, which means more time off. I'm lucky enough to be able to get 2 weeks off in the summer at least, and last year it worked out well that we could do the LCDC and then take some family time to do UT and the Grand Canyon.
FWIW I appreciate that having your LC built wasn't a requirement to meet up for the LCDC. To a large extent your build dictates the kinds of trails you can do anyway.
With my current level of vehicle distraction (think @mcgaskins but on an infinitely smaller budget), I doubt I'll have a LC before 2020, so my opinion is worth a grain of salt. However, reading this thread and the potential interest in "moving" or trip style event I just saw a photo trip report of the North Rim of the Grand Canyon: The Grand Adventure: The North Rim of the Grand Canyon
Just as a drizzle in the brainstorm, something like that would easily lend itself to being accessible to vehicles of all levels of modification and would likely quench most desires for exploration. Just wanted to throw it out there as a "what's possible" option for all of you. See you in 2020, haha.
Just as a drizzle in the brainstorm, something like that would easily lend itself to being accessible to vehicles of all levels of modification and would likely quench most desires for exploration. Just wanted to throw it out there as a "what's possible" option for all of you. See you in 2020, haha.
We did the same thing last year, which is how we normally road trip in the summer anyway. We park our trailer for a few days at a campground (or when lucky a spot in the national forest) and then use that as our base camp to explore the surrounding area for a few days. In 2016 we did the Badlands, Black Hills, Devil's Tower, Yellowstone, and Grand Teton like that over 12 days. This year we did Breckenridge, Grand Mesa, Moab, the Grand Canyon, and Zion/Bryce.
It's preferable for me to be able to drop the trailer and explore for a few days as well, though if the group did a really cool 2 or 3 day excursion we might park the trailer at a campground so we could do it and then tent camp for the couple nights.
BTW I think the majority of the guys on this forum aren't interested in banging up their trucks either. There's a certain acceptance that you might scrape a bumper or get a little pinstriping of the clearcoat on any trail, but I don't think most want to deal with expensive body repairs. The good thing is that the LCDC had enough trail selection that you could decide on your trail based on your damage risk tolerance. My wife was nervous when we first decided on Red Cone, though once we did it she was great about the (relatively small) rear bumper dent, but if I'd come back with smashed up quarter panels I doubt I'd be coming back the following year without a divorce.
One aspect of Cruise Moab I appreciate that LCDC could add is a “tech inspection” at check in / beginning of the event. Granted the vast majority of 200s are well maintained and ready to go, but it’s nice to know that every truck on the trail has working brakes, emergency brakes, good tread on the tires, working communications devices, spare tire, a first aid kit, etc. That’s also a good time to gauge equipment and driver experience for recommend trails - someone from south Florida who’s never been off pavement and is 100% stock might be ready for Spring Creek or Red Cone, but someone on 35s double locked and 40 years of experience might want to skip Boreas Pass for example. Drivers could also be “certified” as trail leaders or gunners and be required to have a little extra knowledge, tools, navigation equipment, and so on. It would require knowledgeable volunteers to assist, but I think it’s worth it to ensure a safe and fun event.
We did the north rim last summer. We camped in the Kaibab National Forest for free. It's beautiful, but there are very limited trails and none of them were very difficult. The "moderate" Point Sublime trail is probably the most difficult, and it could have easily be done by a stock LC with stock tires.
I wanted to do Toroweep Overlook but it was 2 hours just to get to the start of the trail. I think the north rim is awesome and everyone should try to go at some point, but it would be tough to do this with 30-40 people.
indycole
GOLD Star
This brings up one of the fundamental questions we'll all need to think through regarding the evolution of the event. I believe the intention has been to keep the event inclusive, flexible, welcoming, etc. such that someone could easily join up until just shortly before the event starts. One challenge there is that it makes it tough to plan because the numbers are always changing (and growing, which is definitely cool).
With a growing event you eventually end up with some interesting liability questions. They do the rig inspection at Cruise Moab because it's mandated by TLCA-sanctioned events because the TLCA provides liability insurance for the event via the clubs who sponsor and the individuals who attend the event (who also have to be part of TLCA). No one wants to be running trails thinking about the liability ramifications of some unforeseen event, so planning for such things to give folks -- especially trail leaders -- peace of mind on the trail is important. Once an event is formalized and gets large enough the liability question definitely must be addressed and it's something we're looking at. There are a few ways to approach it 1.) do nothing and cross your fingers, 2.) keep the event exclusive, small, and informal, 3.) charge participants a fee to cover liability insurance, 4.) grow the event to enough people that vendors/sponsors/etc. can chip in or cover the event with their own policy, or 5.) formalize this group as a TLCA-sponsored club and use their coverage for the event. It's worth noting that asking folks to sign waiver / release of liability isn't really enough protection.
Enough fine print... on another topic I like how the locations have been true "destinations" in the sense that there's enough to do in the surrounding area for families and non-trail activities. Most places that have been seriously considered have a compelling home base.
The roaming trips are definitely attractive for a subset of us (myself included) but they wouldn't work for everyone. It'd be cool to have some unofficial LCDC-Nomad trips (Baja anyone?) throughout other parts of the year.
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I would not support having a minimum build requirement to attend. There were a number of us this year with stock or nearly stock trucks. I had little experience off-road prior to this year. Attending this years trip was a great experience and it has helped me think more about how I may want to build my LC.
The number of people who own 200 series LC and want to take them off-road is small. I don’t think it would be wise to exclude those who are new to off-roading or to the 200. Let’s be inclusive, not exclusive.
The number of people who own 200 series LC and want to take them off-road is small. I don’t think it would be wise to exclude those who are new to off-roading or to the 200. Let’s be inclusive, not exclusive.
You let me know when and I'm there! I already have all of Baja downloaded in both topo and satellite maps with markings of potential checkpoints.
As for the liability, I don't know how that works. I figure it's sort of like going to the gym for the first time, trying to bench 300lbs, injuring yourself and blaming the gym. There has to be a level of common sense with everything in life. Since everyone on here can afford to buy a 200, I would hope they would have some sense as to know their limitations. If this was a Jeep group I would understand, there's a mix of seasoned guys and dummies in Jeep groups. Whereas 200 guys should have a somewhat level head on their shoulders, myself excluded of course.
indycole
GOLD Star
My understanding is that having the event open to bone stock trucks is a pretty hard requirement for the event. The challenge with some destinations is having enough terrain of all types available to cover 3-4 days without repeating trails though that's true for all levels of trail difficulty.
I'd expect any destination to have at least a couple days worth of trails if people want to stick to a single difficulty level (call it green, blue, and red like the FunTreks books) but folks will need to explore other difficulty levels, travel further afield, or repeat trails if they're overly tied to a trail rating.
indycole
GOLD Star
I think this is exactly why it hasn't been too much of an issue so far. I certainly can't imagine anyone in this fine group lobbing a legal law bomb our way as planners. In exploring the matter a couple cases that have come up before include family members/distant relatives suing events or legal action being taken by bystanders or non-event participants. Even though there are no jeeps in the group, there may still be some on the trail that are impacted by our shenanigans. In any case, this is not the kind of stuff we want folks to worry about on vacation.
