3FE vs 2F

[rchalmers3]

A question: Does raising the compression ratio positively affect performance at high altitiude (>7000') all else being equal?

I apologize if this was answered before, as I did not read every post carefully.

Raising the compression on an engine leads to problems, specifically with detonation, which can destroy an engine. By adopting computer control of the fuel injection, ignition timing and EGR management, and fitting a knock sensor, the engineers could raise the compression and squish more air and fuel into every cylinder, without fear of destruction.

The answer to your question is no, simply raising the compression does not augment high altitude power. What helps with power at any altitude is to redesign an engine fitted with a carburetor to make use of electronic engine controls: FI, MAP sensor, ignition tailoring, knock sensor and so on. Raising compression ratios is allowable with tighter reign over the A/F mixture and control of pre-detonation. Fuel octane is addressed as well.

Personally I would not bother to adapt a FI system to any carb designed motor unless it was near the cost of a replacement carb. I don't think the cost/benefit would make sense, given the above explanations. I am not a fan of carburetors, so in this conversation I would opt for an engine replacement to the 3FE, with all management ancillaries.

Rick

 

[Realultpwr]

Hey guys, just read this entire thread, great info. I have an 86 FJ60, with a 2F. The 85 I had previously one of the rods ended up in the oil pan before I got my hands on it. Before any knowledge of these beautiful trucks I had purchased a 3FE from a 62 with all accessories including wiring harness, ECU, MAP sensor, ect. Basically all the necessary components to do the swap. Then I bought the 86 which upon inspection had newly rebuilt 2F with the vacuum lines completely in disarray and a leaking carb. Replaced the carb with a stock Aisan, and did my best to remap the vacuum lines. Now I have a full 3FE swap waiting to be used, and a rebuilt 2f in the truck running strong. The 2FE is really appealing to me for the FI gains explained. My question for you guys would be an electric fuel pump would be required to run the FI? Swapping the entire motor would be foolish of me considering I have a good running block, would like to get rid of the troublesome carb. Any tips or more info would be greatly appreciated.
- Chris

 

[pappy]

My question for you guys would be an electric fuel pump would be required to run the FI?

The 3FE needs 45psi. A mechanical pump will not provide that. Two choices. Inline external pump. In tank pump using the gas tank from an FJ62.

 

[elripster]

Summit sells the pumps and filter.



EDL-3596 EFI FUEL FILTER

SUM-G3138 ELECTRONIC FUEL PUMP

Not sure where you are located but I had no trouble passing the BAR inspection in Cali after my engine swap with this set up.

Frank

 

[Realultpwr]

Very well. I have a guy right down the street specializing in land cruiser parts who has a 62 parts truck, in my opinion I would be better off with an inline pump, now who sells block off plates for the mech. Pump? Or is this something that will have to be fabricated. Not a problem, just curious. Also, I will obviously be using the throttle cable and pedal set up off a 62 rather than the linkage that is in my 60. Trying to get everything lined up so the swap goes smooth as the crusher is my DD. big help guys thanks

 

[pappy]

...now who sells block off plates for the mech. Pump? Or is this something that will have to be fabricated.

You will either need to use a boneyard part off a 3FE, or make your own using the gasket as a template.

 

[elripster]

I was able to use a new cable with my original pedal. I just drilled a hole in the fire wall.

 

[Realultpwr]

When I bought the motor I was able to get the whole wiring harness pedal assembly and throttle
Cable, it was sweet deal! Thanks for all the info gentlemen.

Chris

 

[csd4682]

When I bought the motor I was able to get the whole wiring harness pedal assembly and throttle
Cable, it was sweet deal! Thanks for all the info gentlemen.

Chris

Please keep us posted on your build when it happens. This is something I plan on doing in the future. I would love to see pics along the way also. So far this thread has been very helpful in me deciding that this is the route I want to take(2fe)

 

[klinetime574]

So far this thread has been very helpful in me deciding that this is the route I want to take(2fe)

Same here. I want a 2FE, bad. I feel like a school boy with a crush on his teacher.

 

[AlexJet]

I've read the full thread, but still wondering if any 2F can be converted to 2FE? I've heard that early 2Fs can not. Is it true? What considered as "early"?

 

[Cruiserdrew]

I've read the full thread, but still wondering if any 2F can be converted to 2FE? I've heard that early 2Fs can not. Is it true? What considered as "early"?

78 and earlier, not sure about 79

 

[AlexJet]

78 and earlier, not sure about 79

When I look at pictures of different vehicles I can notice that some engine has heads with 2F sign on the front edge facing front and oil cap further in, while others have 2F sign facing driver side and oil cap sitting right up front of the head.
I have 79 and my head has 2F facing forward. Based on what vehicles I saw it seems to be the "early" design which not suitable for 2FE conversion...(???)

 

[RockDoc]

The pistons are the main problem, and can be changed out. You need flat top pistons, or as MarkW put it, parts the domed pistons will try to occupy the same space as the head. Beyond that, there are more threaded mounting holes on later blocks, and some minor internal differences (type of thrust bearing on crank, press fit vs. threaded plugs for oil passages,....). If your block has all the ass. mounting holes you need (i.e. staying in same vintage of truck), you should be fine with new pistons.

If you search for a thread started by Mace in the 40 section called "best 2F" you'll find lots of good info in there on changes through the years.