3B Glow Plug Timing Issue (1 Viewer)

[theglobb]

Hey there, around the start of August my glow plug timing started acting up, I could hear them go on and then back off almost immediately, yet the glow plug light would stay on for how long they would usually be on for. Then after a week, they started working normally again and would turn off with the timing of the light turning off. Then after a couple of days, the timing stopped working again, and just 1 week ago they worked normally again for 2 days and are back to being broken... (Hopefully, that makes some sense) I wasn't too pressed to try and figure out the problem as it would start right up due to it being 80-90°f, but now as the temperature has dipped down into the 50-60's it is having a bit more resistance starting without the plugs working correctly. Are there any common issues that this could be, or do I need to install one of those Wilson manual button things, orrrr? Here's a video I took that hopefully makes what I'm saying a bit more clear.


If you can hear it they instantly go on and then off, that last thunk would happen right when the glow plug light went off, before it all got messed up. Anyways, anything helps and everything is appreciated!

 

[duncanrm]

You have a "superglow" system.. the first step in fixing it is understanding it.. Super Glow - explained

And like many others before you you'll likely find the easiest way to fix Superglow is to bypass it.. its a simple mod to activate the lower voltage solenoid manually.. this mod is described quite well on the HJ60.com.au site here: Landcruiser 60 Series Australia -Simplified Glow System this mod description wont exactly match your vehicle but the principle will be the same.

 

[tlaporte]

I would test the relay, first. Just apply 12V (or 24V, if appropriate) to the control side of the relay and see if it stays close while voltage is applied.

I think the light is controlled by the timer, and it is lighting independently of the relay’s open/closed status.

 

[theglobb]

You have a "superglow" system.. the first step in fixing it is understanding it.. Super Glow - explained

And like many others before you you'll likely find the easiest way to fix Superglow is to bypass it.. its a simple mod to activate the lower voltage solenoid manually.. this mod is described quite well on the HJ60.com.au site here: Landcruiser 60 Series Australia -Simplified Glow System this mod description wont exactly match your vehicle but the principle will be the same.

Ohhhhhhhh, I see... I remember the PO saying something about a superglow system and just figured it was some beefed up aftermarket glowplugs, thank you so much for the links, I'll definitely look into it.

I would test the relay, first. Just apply 12V (or 24V, if appropriate) to the control side of the relay and see if it stays close while voltage is applied.

I think the light is controlled by the timer, and it is lighting independently of the relay’s open/closed status.

Definitely, now just to find the relay... haha. Thank you! I'll update y'all with whatever happens.

 

[Greg_B]

@theglobb from one or two years back (ha!) here is the Wilson Switch post which details a Canadian BJ60 install, so depending on your vehicle there will/may be differences to work through. The idea is to incorporate the factory glow light and glow solenoid into the push button circuit: ala the Wilson Switch.

hth's
gb

 

[roalco]

Hi, search for “super glow problems”, I’ll copy below a post I did about 11 years ago;

FYI, I posted this a while ago on another thread and it has more accurate (years pass...) info;

I had a similar issue with my 84 bj60 (3b). I like the superglow system, but like many others the initial high glow on mine kept getting shorter and shorter. It's either the temp sensor or the computer failing, but it still comes on for 3-4 seconds initially and the afterglow (a brilliant startup feature) is still happily going for 35-40 seconds. After reading all the wilson switch leads, I spent some time with the electrical drawings and realized that if you put a jumper line from the supply (pin 8, black/yellow wire on the pre heating timer 28521-57020) to the feed to the main glow plug relay (pin 9, black/red wire on the same timer) with a momentary contact switch, you wind up with a fully functional superglow system with a manual override to the main glow plug relay. It works a treat, especially as you can give it super glow for however long you wish (say 3 seconds when it's cool out, I normally do manual superglow for 3 seconds, wait for 3 or 4 seconds then superglow for 2 or 3 seconds more (works great when its below freezing)( you can repeat, just don't give it much more than 3 seconds at a go) release the switch, start cranking on afterglow (lower current draw so the starter gets up to speed quicker, then kick it in momentarily for a really clean start, and it is still in afterglow to give you the extra heat.
The only thing I have done since is to disconnect the glow plug current sensor plug (so now my automatic superglow isn't functional), a friend inadvertently shorted out the glow system and it seems to have fried the current sensor circuit which made the main relay hammer like a lucas fuel pump. disconnecting it worked wonders, manual superglow and automatic afterglow!
It works for me anyway!
Oh and BTW, 8.5 v at the bus doesn't sound too bad on a 6 volt glow plug on superglow, I think mine is fluctuates between that and 10 v, depending on how long it is on for, seems to be a ramp up voltage over a few seconds (real, one-onethousand, two-onethousand type of counting seconds).
good luck
Ross

 

[roalco]

Not sure what engine your 87 BJ75 has, is it a 3B or a 3B II ?
I believe the 3B II has a pre heater screen rather than glow plugs....

 

[theglobb]

@theglobb from one or two years back (ha!) here is the Wilson Switch post which details a Canadian BJ60 install, so depending on your vehicle there will/may be differences to work through. The idea is to incorporate the factory glow light and glow solenoid into the push button circuit: ala the Wilson Switch.

hth's
gb

Ohh yeaaaaa, seems like you ran into this problem yesterday haha. Thank you so much! I'll definitely take note from your old thread.

Not sure what engine your 87 BJ75 has, is it a 3B or a 3B II ?
I believe the 3B II has a pre heater screen rather than glow plugs....

I believe it is just a 3B from the exhaust manifold only having 8 studs vs 10, and it never came with Power Steering (or A/C), which I believe the 3BII had a built-in PS pump or something, could be wrong though... here are some pics for any 3B experts out there that want to tell me how horribly wrong I am lol.

 

[roalco]

Yup, it‘s a 3B ( in-line fuel pump, with glow plugs). If it’s 12 volt, all the threads and info here on canadian BJ60 super glow issues should apply. However, just where your super glow controller may be on a 75, I don’t know. It does look like you need to do some electrical connection cleaning and some battery maintenance too.... A bad electrical connection could be part of your problem.
As well, glow plugs only last so long, (once you’ve determined the supply operating voltage, the glow plug rated voltage in a super glow system should be 1/2 of that, ie 6V for a 12V system) so you’ll probably want to get a spare set, they should be replaced as a set, and they need to be the correct ones.
Its a great engine in a great truck, and the super glow system is very handy. You'll get it sorted!

 

[theglobb]

Yup, it‘s a 3B ( in-line fuel pump, with glow plugs). If it’s 12 volt, all the threads and info here on canadian BJ60 super glow issues should apply. However, just where your super glow controller may be on a 75, I don’t know. It does look like you need to do some electrical connection cleaning and some battery maintenance too.... A bad electrical connection could be part of your problem.
As well, glow plugs only last so long, (once you’ve determined the supply operating voltage, the glow plug rated voltage in a super glow system should be 1/2 of that, ie 6V for a 12V system) so you’ll probably want to get a spare set, they should be replaced as a set, and they need to be the correct ones.
Its a great engine in a great truck, and the super glow system is very handy. You'll get it sorted!

It's a 24v sooooo what's exactly different in that regard? (Besides the voltage being 12v in the glow plugs vs 6v) And yes yes I know the engine bay is VERY dirty, along with the electrical connections etc etc. Definitely need a real solid cleaning asap lol. Thank you for confirming what type of 3B it is!

 

[roalco]

Sorry, but offhand I don’t know what’s different (we never got 75s up here, other than non-released mine trucks) other than that the super glow controller would be a Different part number to start with. I do have a manual that includes BJ 7- series. Will do some reading and see if I can’t find some info for you.

 

[roalco]

theglobb , Apparently the super glow systems are very similar and I have some info I found when modifying mine on troubleshooting and a wiring diagram etc. I‘ll get my wife to convert it to about 4 pages of PDF and email it to you, if you PM me your email.

 

[BreckenridgeCruiser]

@theglobb I just sold some 24v superglow plugs (14v rated) to a member on here and it fixed his similar issue...

Superglow is great and I would try fixing first before just ripping it out. Most of the time, the issue is bad plugs. Even one failing plug can throw the resistance readings off and affect the glow. I had a similar issue when I had a 24v superglow 2B and once I swapped in the proper plugs it worked beautifully in sub freezing weather in the mountains of CO.

I actually have one last set of new 14v plugs for sale that I no longer need.

 

[theglobb]

theglobb , Apparently the super glow systems are very similar and I have some info I found when modifying mine on troubleshooting and a wiring diagram etc. I‘ll get my wife to convert it to about 4 pages of PDF and email it to you, if you PM me your email.

wow! Thank you so much, I'll PM you now

 

[theglobb]

@theglobb I just sold some 24v superglow plugs (14v rated) to a member on here and it fixed his similar issue...

Superglow is great and I would try fixing first before just ripping it out. Most of the time, the issue is bad plugs. Even one failing plug can throw the resistance readings off and affect the glow. I had a similar issue when I had a 24v superglow 2B and once I swapped in the proper plugs it worked beautifully in sub freezing weather in the mountains of CO.

I actually have no be last set of new 14v plugs for sale that I no longer need.

Awesome! I'll test them in the near future and if one (or more) aren't working then I'll shoot you a PM and hope that's the problem haha.

 

[roalco]

wow! Thank you so much, I'll PM you now

Sent!

 

[Eurasiaoverland]

Not sure what engine your 87 BJ75 has, is it a 3B or a 3B II ?
I believe the 3B II has a pre heater screen rather than glow plugs....

That's not correct. The direct injection engines (13B, 14B, 15B have heater screens, indirect injection engines such as the 3Bii have glow plugs going into the combustion chambers.

I believe it is just a 3B from the exhaust manifold only having 8 studs vs 10, and it never came with Power Steering (or A/C), which I believe the 3BII had a built-in PS pump or something, could be wrong though... here are some pics for any 3B experts out there that want to tell me how horribly wrong I am lol.

It's an internal vacuum pump which the 3Bii has, the PAS pump is still external.

The 3Bii always has a rotary pump as far as I know, though some late 3Bs also had them.

The main giveaway is the valve cover, the 3Biis had flat, fluted valve covers (like the 1HZ) instead of the ancient looking rounded valve cover on a 3B. Block colour is also different (if it has survived!) the 3B is known as a red block, 3Bii as a blue block.

Other differences in the 3Bii are piston oil squirters, 5 journal cams, 8 bolt flywheel are hardly useful for an in situ engine.

End of pedantry.

 

[roalco]

The just FYI, original block colour on my Canadian September 1984 BJ60 3B was grey from new (I bought it in mid 1985), it has a 5 bearing cam, and piston oil squirters.
I may be wrong on the heater screens, Which is why I said “I believe”, as I have seen only one 3BII, and as I recall it had a pre heater screen, so possibly added professionally at a later time.
Perhaps those made for the middle eastern market differed from the North American market?

 

[Eurasiaoverland]

The just FYI, original block colour on my Canadian September 1984 BJ60 3B was grey from new (I bought it in mid 1985), it has a 5 bearing cam, and pistol oil squirters.
I may be wrong on the heater screens, Which is why I said “I believe”, as I have seen only one 3BII, and as I recall it had a pre heater screen, so possibly added professionally at a later time.
Perhaps those made for the middle eastern market differed from the North American market?

Thanks for the correction on those things, maybe I'm getting confused with an earlier B engine on the oil squirters and can journals.

Red is my bad memory, you are right that they are grey Thanks for the correction too.

Two more differences I thought of; the 3Bii does not have cylinder liners and does not have a pushrod cover.

 

[theglobb]

Soooooo update, took out the glowplugs and it didn't look too good. As you can see from the pics all but one had oil on them and the #1 cylinder was covered in oil and grime? See for yourself in the pics... Glowplugs #2 and #4 had zero resistance which I believe means they are bad. I'm gonna go on a limb and say the bad glowplugs are the problem and hopefully won't have to spend extra time on a Wilson switch. Also what exactly does oil/crud on the glowplugs mean for the health of my engine, or is that just a normal thing? It's my first time messing with glowplugs so as you can probably tell by now I'm pretty clueless. With whatever happens, I'll keep y'all updated?