24v starter conversion to 12v HDJ81 (1 Viewer)

[veiloctane]

Hi guys,
I know other HD80s use 12v starters. I also have been doing some research on here on other forms on how to do this.

I am trying to make sense of this EWD on how to make this conversion work and how to wire it up for 12volt starting.

my plan of action is to remove the 24v starter and replace with a 12v 2.5kw starter.

I will be using a Ctek D250s and a Ctek Smartpass (dc-dc charger) to isolate and charge batteries from solar.

Items to be deleted from the posted EWD below:

• Voltage Converter Timer
• Voltage Converter Relay
• 24v Hold Warning Relay

I have been reading other posts here on mud on how to wire this I cannot make sense to how its supposed to work without a EWD so please correct me if I am wrong.

1. Battery Positive goes to starter Terminal 30
2. Starter Relay has to go to ground for the ignition switch to activate the starter. I am guessing ground goes to terminal "E"
3. Starter Relay Terminal "B" Also goes to a 12v battery +
4. To Alternator "L" goes to - Ground
5. IG1 goes where?

 

[Douglas S]

Yep, from what I recall you have all of that right.

You'll have to cut out and ground the Terminal E wire from the starter relay located on the LHS fender. I just extended it to the starter relay mounting bolt with a ring terminal. One other item to note is that the wire that feeds starter terminal B is already located near the LHS battery (I believe it is a green fusible link) - this is also somehow tied to the voltage sensing for the alternator and therefore needs to be connected to the main battery that is charged by the alternator.

 

[veiloctane]

Yep, from what I recall you have all of that right.

You'll have to cut out and ground the Terminal E wire from the starter relay located on the LHS fender. I just extended it to the starter relay mounting bolt with a ring terminal. One other item to note is that the wire that feeds starter terminal B is already located near the LHS battery (I believe it is a green fusible link) - this is also somehow tied to the voltage sensing for the alternator and therefore needs to be connected to the main battery that is charged by the alternator.

ok so To Alternator Terminal L goes directly to + of main battery.

 

[veiloctane]

been doing more research on the differences between the 24v and the 12v starters and it looks to share the same casing the differences is the internals that make it 12v or 24 volts.

here is some data to back it up I found from dixie-electric.com they are a canadian starter and alternator manufacture so I am guessing these should be available locally. If anyone here has experience on the quality of dixie-electric products I would like to hear your input.

24v starter 4.5Kw
http://www.dixie-electric.com/dixie/pdf/PN_pdf/STR/246_025_219.pdf

24v starter bill of materials
http://www.dixie-electric.com/catalogue/unit.asp?Num_Dix=246-25219#BOM

12v starter bill of materials
http://www.dixie-electric.com/catalogue/unit.asp?Num_Dix=S-80287#BOM

12v starter applications (good list of other doner land cruisers)
http://www.dixie-electric.com/catalogue/unit.asp?Num_Dix=S-80287#App

 

[Douglas S]

ok so To Alternator Terminal L goes directly to + of main battery.

I never actually came across it in a wiring diagram, but when I was buttoning everything up I originally connected the green fusible link to the aux battery and had completely unregulated voltage from the alt until the batteries combined. I switched the fusible link over to the main battery and now the voltage is regulated at all times.

I can't recall now if that same green fusible link fed terminal B of the starter relay, but I'm fairly certain that was the case.

 

[veiloctane]

I have just got my 12v starter in.

And here is the revised wire diagram. Please excuse my chicken scratch.

I have deleted the following from the diagram

1. Voltage Converter Timer
2. Voltage Converter Relay
3. 24v hold warning relay

• Alternator Terminal "L" goes to ground
• Starter Relay "E" goes to ground
• Starter Terminal 30 goes to + of battery

Where does wire from Starter Switch IG1 "2" from voltage converter timer go once the "Voltage converter timer" has been deleted?

 

[FlyAddiction]

Have you managed to figure out the las bit of wiring modification needed for the swap? I would be interested in your findings.

 

[veiloctane]

Have you managed to figure out the las bit of wiring modification needed for the swap? I would be interested in your findings.

I don't recall I had to do anything with that wire. I just sealed it up and put it aside.

 

[danakittilsen]

Did you go with one of those Dixie units?

 

[dan1554]

Made a diagram to help me understand the necessary changes. This is how I interpreted the final circuit to look (liberties taken where I didn't have correct symbols, also Im no EE). This look about right to anyone?

Plan is to just use the DS battery for now so I can get it on the road, and take the time later to OCD a dual battery setup. Im a little concerned that '0.5' (assuming green) fusible link is not appropriate for 12v but I'll probably leave it be. Worst case is it burns out faster and I need to take the time to select a bigger one.

** Edit **

Its very similar to the FSM diagram w/o the converter, so thats gotta be a good sign.

 

[Squash]

I would truly reconsider the 12v starter as Calgary does feel winter's wrath. That said if you insist, I'd love your spare parts!
Nothing beats a 24v starter on a cold day, but if you are worried, 12v will crank your 24v starter well enough to start if glow plugs are good or engine is warm.

 

[DancesWithMutts]

Made a diagram to help me understand the necessary changes. This is how I interpreted the final circuit to look (liberties taken where I didn't have correct symbols, also Im no EE). This look about right to anyone?

View attachment 2284117

Plan is to just use the DS battery for now so I can get it on the road, and take the time later to OCD a dual battery setup. Im a little concerned that '0.5' (assuming green) fusible link is not appropriate for 12v but I'll probably leave it be. Worst case is it burns out faster and I need to take the time to select a bigger one.

** Edit **

Its very similar to the FSM diagram w/o the converter, so thats gotta be a good sign.

View attachment 2284209

Hey Dan do you happen to know where the "FL ST 0.5g" fusible link is? I've got a tricky no start issue going on and I know it has to do with the power being fed to the white wire going to "b" on the starter Relay.

 

[dan1554]

@DancesWithMutts I wish I could remember exactly, but I believe its a green fusible link near the passenger side battery.

 

[DancesWithMutts]

@DancesWithMutts I wish I could remember exactly, but I believe its a green fusible link near the passenger side battery.

All good man, I think I found the problem I'm having. Thanks!

 

[veiloctane]

I would truly reconsider the 12v starter as Calgary does feel winter's wrath. That said if you insist, I'd love your spare parts!
Nothing beats a 24v starter on a cold day, but if you are worried, 12v will crank your 24v starter well enough to start if glow plugs are good or engine is warm.

I just wanted to report back Starter is still going strong even in -45C no issues starting

here's a part# number cross-reference if anyone is looking for alternatives

YANMAR

119773-77010

DENSO

128000-8640, 128000-8641, 228000-1610, 228000-1611, 228000-1612, 228000-6290, 228000-6291

TOYOTA

28100-17010, 28100-17040

 

[Squash]

Haha!
At -45 not a chance unless it came out of a heated garage, webasto or plugged in.
We have a yard of 12 volt work cruisers which we're routinely boosted, ether'd and or just left idling to ensure the were running in the morning.

 

[veiloctane]

Yeah, just glow 3-4 times best have really good batteries, run a good synthetic oil good diesel winter conditioner she will start, may take a few times. Just as good as she did with a 24V starter. I’m just saying I don’t notice a difference vs 12v. Spins and cranks about the same sounds like pushing thru peanut butter.

Had to do this a few times before I had the webasto now it sure starts like summer time now in the winter.