1984 Toyota Camry / Vista with 1.8l turbo diesel 1C (3 Viewers)

[Mike NXP]

Hey there — I just wanted to reach out because you’re the only other person I’ve seen with a turbo diesel Camry.

I’ve got an ’85 with the 2C-T that I’ve been slowly collecting parts for. It’s been sitting for about a year and a half while my 300TD Mercedes wagon has been taking up most of my wrenching time, but I’m finally looking forward to digging into the Camry.

Plan is to rebuild the injectors with new nozzles, replace the glow plugs, overhaul the cooling system, do the timing belt and water pump, delete the EGR, refresh the brakes, and go through the usual wear items. I’ve been excited about this project for so long that I’ve ended up doing a deep dive into these fairly obscure cars and learned quite a bit in the process.

Just wanted to say thanks for documenting your build — it’s been a huge help seeing someone else working on one of these. Looking forward to following along, and feel free to reach out if you ever want to connect as a fellow diesel Camry owner.

Hot damn, I knew someone else out there would appear with the same car eventually.....But with the 2C motor, so cool. I don't think I've seen any 1C engine owners out there yet....

As you know there is very little information out there on these vehicles and engine. MUD is such a great resource to people all around the planet who chime in on all things Toyota Diesel . Maybe consider starting a build thread so we can follow along as you do your repairs and keep that old car running....
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Tell me more about your ride, how is it holding upon otherwise, does the engine currently run? Is it rusty? I'd be eager to follow along as you do a timing belt job, my local mechanic pretty much was like meh yeah I'm not touching that lol but the procedure doesn't seem to bad if you have shop / tools / skills to get it done.
>> At one point I opened up the top timing cover to inspect but you really can't see much except the back topside of the belt. I've got all the parts in a box , maybe I'll do it one day
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As for the EGR delete, how do I know if the 1C has this? Can you visually see if the engine has EGR ?
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I don't know how much the 2C varies from the 1C but I've got a service manual if you need any information / specs / wiring diagrams. Also if you need advice on tracking down parts I've got a few different sources but a lot of stuff is just no longer available.....Feel free to post stuff here or message me anytime if you want to chat.


I'm headed out to the driveway now to try and put my old girl back together again

 

[AirheadNut]

You can tell if you have EGR if there is a pipe connecting the exhaust manifold to the intake. There will be a throttle body on the intake with a UFO vacuum valve to actuate the butterfly valve.

 

[Mike NXP]

You can tell if you have EGR if there is a pipe connecting the exhaust manifold to the intake. There will be a throttle body on the intake with a UFO vacuum valve to actuate the butterfly valve.

Roger that, I'll check it out soon but until then, my misery meter is at an all time high

• The alternator re-builder bench tested this unit and tested for charge and all other functions when he was done, and it all checked out
• After busting knuckles for a few days I finally got the alternator installed and you guessed it; the battery is not charging and my dash lights still don't work
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• A bit of good news, it seems to me that the parasitic drain has been solved. The battery is holding steady with the engine off and everything connected BUT I need to test it more to be totally sure
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• Key in the on position, most of the dash lights are still out
• I turn it over for 10-15 seconds and she fires up without the glow plugs
• I check the battery voltage with engine running and it shows a weak 11.8
• I go over to the alternator and I put my positive lead to the alternator output and it shows the same weak 11.8
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• All connection seem to be good and tight. I've got continuity from battery to alternator. New slow blow fuses are still good to go

F u c k

The rebuilder guy is really helpful. He's pointing me towards testing the 3 prong connector that plugs into the alternator to test for power.

Calling it a day for now, will suffer some more this weekend
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For my own reference, latest comment from rebuilder:
Check the harness that plugs into the alternator. Three wires I think. I'll have to look it up but one wire is an ignition turn on to excite the alternator. See if you have power on one or two of the wires. Should be the two that go in the same direction. If I remember correctly the third wire is an output wire, I will check for you tomorrow.

 

[Mike NXP]

So it looks like my next step will be to remove the harness from the alternator , while trying not to break the plastic.

Then I have to check for power with key on at the S snd IG. If I dont have battery voltage then I have to start tracing it back further
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For my reference , here is the latest tip from the alternator rebuilder :

• S is a battery sense terminal. Could be on and off with the key or have battery power all the time.
• IG is an ignition turn on. On and off with the key to excite the regulator.
• L/trio most likely goes to a light on the dash.

As far as charging is concerned, I think this is what he described :
>> The IG needs power with the key on to turn on / tell the alternator to make a charge.
>> The S terminal also needs power with the key on to regulate how much the alternator is charging

 

[Mike NXP]

Alright I spoke with the worlds nicest parts rebuilder again and he's got me on the right track for troubleshooting

• First step was to check for power at the harness on the vehicle side , with the key on
• The S and IG should have the same voltage as the battery. The test light shows power at both connections which was exciting, but I was told anything more than .5V drop is too much , so to check it with a volt meter instead
  
  
• With the key on, my battery shows 11.67
• IG - 11.67
• S - 11.06
  
  He thinks this may be too much of a drop for the S (which apparently signals the alternator to do it's thing?)....So the next step is to bypass the S and IG
  
  
• I need to fabricate some power wire with spade connectors on one end . Then, I can run power from the battery positive direct to the S and IG on the alternator
  >> If it starts charging, then the problem is somewhere along these two lines
  >> If it doesn't start charging, then I will be confused again
  
  
• My grounds all look good, but another tip to bypass any bad grounds was to get jumper cables and create a new ground by clamping to battery - terminal and to somewhere on the engine / ground point

If S and IG are both getting battery voltage, the system has a good ground, and we know the alternator bench tested good, so I should be getting closer to a fix ...


Otherwise this thing is going on Craglist, lol no way

 

[AndyMax]

Hot damn, I knew someone else out there would appear with the same car eventually.....But with the 2C motor, so cool. I don't think I've seen any 1C engine owners out there yet....

As you know there is very little information out there on these vehicles and engine. MUD is such a great resource to people all around the planet who chime in on all things Toyota Diesel . Maybe consider starting a build thread so we can follow along as you do your repairs and keep that old car running....
----
Tell me more about your ride, how is it holding upon otherwise, does the engine currently run? Is it rusty? I'd be eager to follow along as you do a timing belt job, my local mechanic pretty much was like meh yeah I'm not touching that lol but the procedure doesn't seem to bad if you have shop / tools / skills to get it done.
>> At one point I opened up the top timing cover to inspect but you really can't see much except the back topside of the belt. I've got all the parts in a box , maybe I'll do it one day
----
As for the EGR delete, how do I know if the 1C has this? Can you visually see if the engine has EGR ?
----

I don't know how much the 2C varies from the 1C but I've got a service manual if you need any information / specs / wiring diagrams. Also if you need advice on tracking down parts I've got a few different sources but a lot of stuff is just no longer available.....Feel free to post stuff here or message me anytime if you want to chat.


I'm headed out to the driveway now to try and put my old girl back together again

Hey there, yeah, Ive only seen one other 2C Camry and that was one I stripped for parts before the landowner scrapped it.
The car itself runs and drives, but gets hot if it’s pushed and I dont wanna warp the head.
I am also nervous about the old timing belt and the water pump squeaks.
I am hoping to solve all that by just refreshing the whole cooling system while doing timing job. Doesn’t seem too bad.
It’s got some surface rust and had some water intrusion in trunk which ive solved. Interior is nice but I’ve got add more stuffing to the rear seats.
The undercarriage is surprisingly rust free. Im in southern VA so its not too salty here.
I did tons of digging since the seller (who died) was local. Actually found service records on Carfax, called the company who did the work and apparently the injection pump and turbo are brand new. Still think it needs injectors because it smokes white.
No sweet smell, no compression measured from rad and no signs of head gasket so hopefully I am good. Gonna measure compression when I do glow plugs.
I will hopefully document more when I get my damn diesel Mercedes wagon out of the garage. One thing after another with it. Just rebuilt whole fueling, charging, braking and cooling system and then it needed rear axles and I timing chain tensioner which I just finished.

On your Alternator… I had to install an alternator from a Saab on my Mercedes and had to learn a bit about the older charging system on these. Basically, you can directly wire the alternator to the positive and negative terminals of your battery. Make sure that the connectors are very robust and well-made and the wire is very thick battery quality gauge. Then the only other thing you need to do is figure out if the exciter wire that’s going from the ignition picks up your batteries voltage when you turn on the ignition key.
Test the wire and see if it’s receiving 12 V when the ignition is on. If it is, splice that wire and connect it to the corresponding spade on the alternator. That’s all it needs. Also, you mentioned that your batteries is at 11 V? That’s a very low and I would put it on the charger and if it can’t get up past 12 V, I would put in a new battery.

Happy wrenching, and if you do stick it on craigslist let me know! lol

 

[Mike NXP]

I must be missing something obvious here. I can't make sense of how this problem came out of nowhere and has now got me completely stumped

• I created 2 jumper cables and hooked up the S and IG connector on the alternator directly to battery power.... I was told this should be all the alternator needs to output a charge ( with the engine turning )
• I made sure the connectors were crimped on good and everything was secured to the alternator
  
  
• Battery voltage is at 12.4 with the engine off
• I started up the motor and ran over to the volt meter to see the battery now showing 11.6
• The alternator post is showing 11.3

I trust the rebuilders bench test, he is sure this thing was producing a solid charge before handing it back to me....I'm also still confused on how the lack of glow plug voltage / functionality relates to all of this either....Perhaps I'm looking at the wrong thing and something else is going on

 

[Mike NXP]

Hey there, yeah, Ive only seen one other 2C Camry and that was one I stripped for parts before the landowner scrapped it.
The car itself runs and drives, but gets hot if it’s pushed and I dont wanna warp the head.
I am also nervous about the old timing belt and the water pump squeaks.
I am hoping to solve all that by just refreshing the whole cooling system while doing timing job. Doesn’t seem too bad.
It’s got some surface rust and had some water intrusion in trunk which ive solved. Interior is nice but I’ve got add more stuffing to the rear seats.
The undercarriage is surprisingly rust free. Im in southern VA so its not too salty here.
I did tons of digging since the seller (who died) was local. Actually found service records on Carfax, called the company who did the work and apparently the injection pump and turbo are brand new. Still think it needs injectors because it smokes white.
No sweet smell, no compression measured from rad and no signs of head gasket so hopefully I am good. Gonna measure compression when I do glow plugs.
I will hopefully document more when I get my damn diesel Mercedes wagon out of the garage. One thing after another with it. Just rebuilt whole fueling, charging, braking and cooling system and then it needed rear axles and I timing chain tensioner which I just finished.

On your Alternator… I had to install an alternator from a Saab on my Mercedes and had to learn a bit about the older charging system on these. Basically, you can directly wire the alternator to the positive and negative terminals of your battery. Make sure that the connectors are very robust and well-made and the wire is very thick battery quality gauge. Then the only other thing you need to do is figure out if the exciter wire that’s going from the ignition picks up your batteries voltage when you turn on the ignition key.
Test the wire and see if it’s receiving 12 V when the ignition is on. If it is, splice that wire and connect it to the corresponding spade on the alternator. That’s all it needs. Also, you mentioned that your batteries is at 11 V? That’s a very low and I would put it on the charger and if it can’t get up past 12 V, I would put in a new battery.

Happy wrenching, and if you do stick it on craigslist let me know! lol

haha oh I feel your pain on the water in the trunk. I was about three seconds away from drilling a few holes at the lowest points to solve the problem, then decided that would be a little harsh lol

That's so cool that you were able to dig up some old repair history. The previous owner of mine claims this motor was fully rebuilt but failed to produce any proof. However I can see some goopy sealant and shiny bolts that make me think someone indeed may have been in there.

Those old mercedes wagons are awesome, it may be a never ending project but I bet it looks good sitting in the garage =]

> >Does your camry blow white smoke consistently or just on start up?

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Thanks for the tips on diagnosing my no charge situation. My battery is brand new and was put in at the start of all of these issues...Its showing a good charge with the key off ( 12+V) Once I turn the key on, voltage drops to 11ish volts. Glow plugs also are only getting half voltage along with most of the dash lights not working either.

I'll read through your advice and see if I can make sense of what to do next. I think that I sort of just did what you described by jumping the battery positive to the S and IG on the alternator. I should see a charge at the alernator post once the engine is turning

 

[Mike NXP]

For my reference here is the latest troubleshooting after fully charging the battery:

Testing with the 3 pin connector plugged in to alternator

• Key off battery voltage - 12.55
• Let sit for 5-10 minutes and check voltage again to make sure voltage is not dropping - 12.57
  
  
• Key on battery voltage - Drops to 11.9 and slowly going down
• Glow plug voltage - Showing around 3v while slowly going up
• Most of the dash lights still do not illuminate....I see the glow plug light illuminating sometimes when the engine is turning over
  
  Run engine and check for voltage
• At the battery - 11.9
• At the alternator post - 11.6

Unplug 3 pin connector and jump S + IG terminal direct to battery power

• Engine running at battery - 11.9
• Engine running at alternator - 11.6

Still stumped. It looks like the parasitic draw issue has been solved ( for now ) but there is still no charge being produced with the jumper wires or with the 3 pin connected....Dash lights still out, and lack of proper glow plug functionality


I wonder how far could I drive this car in it's current state. Might have to throw in the towel and beg local mechanic to take a look at this pig

 

[bj70bc]

well from the test showing the same voltage its not the connector, its somewhere else, so is the sense wire telling the alt to charge .... need to verify and if bypassed and jumpered direct and still not working, then its the alt...
-i'd re-test the alternator first....
-then i'd trace the wires from the alt connector back, since you've seemingly ruled that out
-i know its been mentioned, but, the grounds id go after next
-then perhaps a short, although from my extremely limited electrical knowledge im not sure if the symptoms show that, but id suspect wire loom rubbing

 

[Mike NXP]

well from the test showing the same voltage its not the connector, its somewhere else, so is the sense wire telling the alt to charge .... need to verify and if bypassed and jumpered direct and still not working, then its the alt...
-i'd re-test the alternator first....
-then i'd trace the wires from the alt connector back, since you've seemingly ruled that out
-i know its been mentioned, but, the grounds id go after next
-then perhaps a short, although from my extremely limited electrical knowledge im not sure if the symptoms show that, but id suspect wire loom rubbing

All good thoughts, luckily it's raining now so I have an excuse to give up for a while


Re-test the alternator

• I really don't want to go that route but the alt re-builder is also suggesting we check it again.... With 12 volts being applied directly to the S and IG , and the alternator spinning, a charge should be coming out of the post. That is how he bench tested.
• Pulling it out will be easier the second go around but it's a huge bitch and I really hate crawling under a low car on jack stands in a gravel driveway so I'm trying to convince myself the alternator is good.
  
  Opening up the wire harness / tracing connections down
  
  
• The wiring harness is actually not that hard to get at if I decide to go that route. However it's pretty clearly mounted out of harms way and both ends of the cables look ok / no corrosion .
• Couldn't I just check Ohms at each end of the cable to determine if there was a short or excessive corrosion somewhere in line
  
  Checking grounds
• Good idea, so the rebuilder said a quick way to sort that out is to clamp a jumper cable on the alternator and the other end to the engine / ground somewhere, sort of like creating a new ground . Or at least I think that's the procedure he described but I may have that wrong, maybe he said to just create a new ground from the battery post
  
  Short somewhere
• Anythings possible but I think I'd be blowing fuses or I would still have that parasitic drain going on. So hopefully no shorts. visually checked around belts and wire harness for any rubbing / mouse chewing but looks good so far

 

[Mike NXP]

Well here's something for anyone interested....

• I went outside and hooked up jumper cables to the negative terminal at the battery. Then the other end of the cable to a bolt on the transmission.... I checked for continuity and confirmed that the new cable is grounded through the engine...I believe this is was the procedure the alt rebuilder was suggesting to create a new ground
  
  
• I turn the key, and to my surprise every light on the dash is working again...I stare with wide eyes and try to contain my excitement while I watch the glow plug light doing it's thing...I turn the key and it fires right up
  
  
  
• I grab the multimeter and check battery voltage, but what the hell it's not charging and is showing like 12.4 . Same goes for the alternator post
• I turn the key off, turn it back on, and nothing is working anymore
  
  It was a wild ride but I'd do it again if I could
  ----

So what the **** is going on here... Check out the picture of this ground terminal below. These wires are like infused within this block of lead, probably the original connection. It looks like these ground out at the fender and the transmission, all within reach.

 

[Mike NXP]

I tested that theory by disconnecting the negative terminal and just using jumper cables only to create a new ground. Nothing changed and the misery level is at an all time high after seeing that slight sign of hope lol I thought for sure I was on to something

I guess the dash lights coming on was just a coincidence. I'll probably just create new ground cables and replace that old connection anyway

 

[bj70bc]

re create exactly what worked again...
must be in your ground situation id suspect, wiggle stuff around
definitely replace that neg battery connector.... looks sus
weak neg batt situation will faulk you over everytime

 

[Mike NXP]

re create exactly what worked again...
must be in your ground situation id suspect, wiggle stuff around
definitely replace that neg battery connector.... looks sus
weak neg batt situation will faulk you over everytime

Agreed. New terminals both sides along with new ground cables will be on the to-do list for tomorrow

 

[Mike NXP]

Man this was a real kick in the balls. I thought for sure cleaning up these connections was going to solve my problem but I've had no such luck.

 

[bj70bc]

damn

 

[Eurasiaoverland]

Just a thought, but are you sure your vehicle wiring and alternator wiring match in terms of voltage regulation? According to the parts catalogue, your alternator should be internally regulated (IC). Did the rebuilder confirm that the alternator is internally regulated? If the alternator expects an external regulator, or the vehicle wiring has been modified in the past to take an externally regulated alternator which has since been replaced with an IC unit, that could cause strange charging problems. Should be easy to confirm that the ignition, sense and warning lights are the right way round.

 

[Mike NXP]

Shoot, I'm really not sure but I'm just about at a dead end with what I can I do here.. This should be the original alternator and I could ask him about the regulator when his shop opens back up...


-I hear the fuel cut off solenoid doing its thing when I turn the key
- The engine turns over and will run so the starter and fuel injectors must be happy
- Glow plugs get power but only half of the expected 6v
- all fuses that I can test are good to go...
- The voltage drop with the key off is no longer happening after alt rebuild


I wonder if I need to get the ignition switch out so I can poke around in there next

>> If I put battery power directly to the alternator through the S and IG , the alternator should be putting out power at the post. So if that logic is right and its not putting out power than that means either A) the alternator has failed again or B) something down the line marked L on the alternator is a problem


I really don't think the alternator failed again due to recent bench test, seemingly no chance of frying it out after install , and since my parasitic draw is no longer happening .... Something else is going on

 

[Mike NXP]

Been staring at and trying to make sense of these wiring diagrams and have been asking myself things like,

- What would cause the glow plugs to only work at half voltage
- What would be stopping the alternator from putting out power, down the line somewhere (if we could assume the alternator is functional still)

I think this problem is giving me plenty of hints as to what's going on but I can't seem to figure it out. Going to throw in the towel and try to call some local shops soon to see if anyone is willing to work on it.

Thanks to all the help from the Mud world, this was a good way to learn about some of the basics of this charging system