1978 LPB Teardown and Rebuild (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter Awl_TEQ
- Start date
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crushers
post ho
kinda looks familar, walk in and back out.
my shop looks the same.
my shop looks the same.
Hmm, you can actualy walk in there, I have to take a few things out before I can even touch my cruiser.
Nice set up. I do miss the tv and fridge.
Nice set up. I do miss the tv and fridge.
Kevin,
I expected some live narration, maybe a nice English accent "in this area you see one of my favorite rattle cans", etc.
Nice weld table but I can't really see it...
What would you recommend for a big, vertical, but very very quiet compressor - if there is such a thing? Doesn't low noise have something to do with low RPM?
Gus
Awl_TEQ
Supporting Vendor
- Thread starter
- #666
Hmm, you can actualy walk in there, I have to take a few things out before I can even touch my cruiser.
Nice set up. I do miss the tv and fridge.
Wait til I fill it with bed parts!
The wife took the TV to the basement gym so she could watch her workout vids.
Awl_TEQ
Supporting Vendor
- Thread starter
- #667
Kevin,
I expected some live narration, maybe a nice English accent "in this area you see one of my favorite rattle cans", etc.
Nice weld table but I can't really see it...
What would you recommend for a big, vertical, but very very quiet compressor - if there is such a thing? Doesn't low noise have something to do with low RPM?
Gus
No english accent here.
The table is just right... just right to put stuff on! - 1/2" thick top and about 36" x 72" and the shelf below is "notched back" so you can sit on a stool and not hit your shins on it.
For a quiet compressor I would put it in a shack out back
- only trouble is I have neighbors 8' away on both sides. Not much you can do with a compressor. Even the 300CFM screw blower type one at work is noisy. Though it sounds like a jet engine.
Awl_TEQ
Supporting Vendor
- Thread starter
- #668
Oh yeah, here's a video from work today. Starts with a CNC turret punch making some antenna brackets. That is how I cut out all my bed parts. Then I show the forming of a couple of parts we were running today. The first one is just a hat channel bracket that holds a bus bar in an electrical cabinet. The second one is part of an air conditioning unit for big P&H mine shovels. It holds a filter and is made from 304 stainless steel.
I'm gonna try and film myself making bed parts and post it up in the new bed build thread. That's why I was playing with the video embedding code.
I'm gonna try and film myself making bed parts and post it up in the new bed build thread. That's why I was playing with the video embedding code.
crushers
post ho
"sorry, this video is private"
she takes your TV to watch workout vids which gives you the right to watch her work out watching the workout vids ... no?
she takes your TV to watch workout vids which gives you the right to watch her work out watching the workout vids ... no?
crushers
post ho
watching that makes me think of Terminator ...
Awl_TEQ
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- Thread starter
- #672
The wife is on a road trip so I get to stay home. Can't work on beds today so I did a little to my truck.
I wanted to put some sort of corrosion protection in areas where I won't be able to blast later. I took the area in question down to metal, did a phosphate wash and used a self etching 2k epoxy primer in several coats. I'll clamp it in place and weld right through the primer tomorrow.
I wanted to put some sort of corrosion protection in areas where I won't be able to blast later. I took the area in question down to metal, did a phosphate wash and used a self etching 2k epoxy primer in several coats. I'll clamp it in place and weld right through the primer tomorrow.
Isn't it a good idea to let EP fully cure (week +) before welding through it?
Awl_TEQ
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- Thread starter
- #674
I'm not sure. Had not really thought about it. I guess I figured since I'm only "spot" welding it in places the rest of it will cure in due time. I suppose if it was cured fully the heat would do slightly less damage to the area around the weld thereby leaving better corrosion protection, which was the whole point of the excersize.
I don't think it will make a lot of difference either way. I was planning on using a wet rag on the backside to minimize the heat affected zone anyway. But I could be way off base, any body else have an opinion they'd like to share? I'm all ears...
I don't think it will make a lot of difference either way. I was planning on using a wet rag on the backside to minimize the heat affected zone anyway. But I could be way off base, any body else have an opinion they'd like to share? I'm all ears...
merbesfield
SILVER Star
Awl_TEQ said:
I'm no expert but I am with you the amount of heat will be minimal and only burn the spot. In fact I think you will actually have trouble creating a spark due to the primer being so durable. Couple of things I have done. Mark the spots with sharpie and hit them quickly with 2 inch 36 disc to expose clean metal. If you are worried about rust you can spray weld thru primer before spot welding. I like Upol brand as it seems to work well with the welding. I have tried others with less success. I would be more concerned with the fumes you will be creating while welding bc you are burning an epoxy primer, nasty fumes.
2x on the spot cleaning, maybe flatten a drill and use that to clear the spot when clamped in place. IMHO if the spot is clean the weld is stronger and takes less time so less heat.
Awl_TEQ
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- Thread starter
- #677
Thanks guys. I will clamp, mark, grind, clamp and weld. I'll keep my head out of the fumes or wear my mask if it's too intense. My garage has an exterior man door opposite the overhead door and makes for good cross ventilation. Unless it's windy out side, then it blows my shielding gas away.
Kevin,
Don't know if you've seen it but there's a great thread on the Garage Journal forum called "Welding in patch panels". One of the members (MP&C - Robert) seems to have a lot in common with you - an incredible craftsman and really good communicator/teacher to boot. Here's a few quotes from that thread on welding EP, etc. Check out the thread if you get the chance, lots of helpful stuff there.
from Robert (MP&C):
I read an article a number of years ago in a restoration publication that conducted a test between epoxy primer and weld throughs. Their findings were such that epoxy offered better long term protection than the weld through stuff. For epoxies, the cure rate varies by manufacturer and shop/weather conditions, but if you know you are going to weld an area something that will help to further promote the curing process is to use a fine scotchbrite pad on the EP after it has flashed a couple hours. This will open up the surface, which normally flashes over first, to expose the paint to better curing. Now having said that, if I try to weld something one day after using EP, I'll see much more burning (as the paint is still not fully cured) than if I were to leave it a week or better (which normally shows little more than discoloration). So it helps to plan out some of your rust preventive measures to coincide with welding schedules.
[more on paint in the actual weld area- flat drill to clean holes, etc.]
... I could have ground down a bit more paint on the inside, but the experience I have had with H/K epoxy primer, 1" of bare metal is hardly needed. I try to epoxy prime anything that will be a pain to get to afterward, and the headlight eybrows, as I'm sure you are well aware of, are especially prone to dirt collection and rust thereafter. This is why the part was painted first. I use the same practice on overlapped parts in an attempt to get some rust prevention between the panels before the moisture returns there and starts the rust process over again. I use a modified drill bit (flattened and backfaced to mimmick an end mill) to clean out plug weld holes. By spraying the EP on all the parts prior to welding, you now have paint in between the lapped panels where likely from the factory there was none. Here is an example of this:
Just prior to welding, I will clean the epoxy primer out of the hole using a drill bit the same size as the plug welds, that I have flattened and backfaced to form a cutter similar to an end mill. Does a nice job of cleaning out the plug weld hole, and by the end being flat, it is has little to no tendency to drill into the adjacent panel:
Also, I've found that if the epoxy is allowed to cure for about a week there is minimal if any damage from heat. Of course, I can only speak to the EP I am using, I have not tried this using other brands. But I can say there is a noticeable difference in how the EP will react to heat from welding from a one day cure (slight burning around the edges) to a one week cure (slight discoloration around the edges). I have yet to try weld through primers, I have heard both good and bad. I did read in a restoration publication a few years back that EP offered better long term rust protection than weld through primers, and I have been using the above method for lapped joints since. But I would suggest that whether someone chooses to use EP or a weld-through, something would be better than nothing at all.
Welding in patch panels - Page 2 - The Garage Journal Board
Gus
Don't know if you've seen it but there's a great thread on the Garage Journal forum called "Welding in patch panels". One of the members (MP&C - Robert) seems to have a lot in common with you - an incredible craftsman and really good communicator/teacher to boot. Here's a few quotes from that thread on welding EP, etc. Check out the thread if you get the chance, lots of helpful stuff there.
from Robert (MP&C):
I read an article a number of years ago in a restoration publication that conducted a test between epoxy primer and weld throughs. Their findings were such that epoxy offered better long term protection than the weld through stuff. For epoxies, the cure rate varies by manufacturer and shop/weather conditions, but if you know you are going to weld an area something that will help to further promote the curing process is to use a fine scotchbrite pad on the EP after it has flashed a couple hours. This will open up the surface, which normally flashes over first, to expose the paint to better curing. Now having said that, if I try to weld something one day after using EP, I'll see much more burning (as the paint is still not fully cured) than if I were to leave it a week or better (which normally shows little more than discoloration). So it helps to plan out some of your rust preventive measures to coincide with welding schedules.
[more on paint in the actual weld area- flat drill to clean holes, etc.]
... I could have ground down a bit more paint on the inside, but the experience I have had with H/K epoxy primer, 1" of bare metal is hardly needed. I try to epoxy prime anything that will be a pain to get to afterward, and the headlight eybrows, as I'm sure you are well aware of, are especially prone to dirt collection and rust thereafter. This is why the part was painted first. I use the same practice on overlapped parts in an attempt to get some rust prevention between the panels before the moisture returns there and starts the rust process over again. I use a modified drill bit (flattened and backfaced to mimmick an end mill) to clean out plug weld holes. By spraying the EP on all the parts prior to welding, you now have paint in between the lapped panels where likely from the factory there was none. Here is an example of this:
Just prior to welding, I will clean the epoxy primer out of the hole using a drill bit the same size as the plug welds, that I have flattened and backfaced to form a cutter similar to an end mill. Does a nice job of cleaning out the plug weld hole, and by the end being flat, it is has little to no tendency to drill into the adjacent panel:
Also, I've found that if the epoxy is allowed to cure for about a week there is minimal if any damage from heat. Of course, I can only speak to the EP I am using, I have not tried this using other brands. But I can say there is a noticeable difference in how the EP will react to heat from welding from a one day cure (slight burning around the edges) to a one week cure (slight discoloration around the edges). I have yet to try weld through primers, I have heard both good and bad. I did read in a restoration publication a few years back that EP offered better long term rust protection than weld through primers, and I have been using the above method for lapped joints since. But I would suggest that whether someone chooses to use EP or a weld-through, something would be better than nothing at all.
Welding in patch panels - Page 2 - The Garage Journal Board
Gus
Awl_TEQ
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- Thread starter
- #679
Very good info there Gus, thanks.
Modified the plan then, since I am still on the couch. I need to weld it today so I can put the tub back on the frame for two reasons. 1) I need to clear space in the garage so I can start to bring home bed parts. And, B) I may need space for a BJ42 to park next weekend. Oh, and 3) I want to make sure the extended doghouse opening is long enough.
I will try the "drill through the spot hole to remove the primer" idea rather then remove and grind. I will use this opportunity to see just how much this primer burns. In future I will try the one week (or 72 hours) cure time and check the difference. What he says in that article makes sense. I just don't want to alter my schedule at the moment. Besides, this is just the inside of the channel. The rest of the tub will be blasted and shot in EP primer later and I intend to hit the overlap seams with thinned down primer and a paint brush as part of that procedure. Hopefully it will wick in and protect it.
Modified the plan then, since I am still on the couch. I need to weld it today so I can put the tub back on the frame for two reasons. 1) I need to clear space in the garage so I can start to bring home bed parts. And, B) I may need space for a BJ42 to park next weekend. Oh, and 3) I want to make sure the extended doghouse opening is long enough.
I will try the "drill through the spot hole to remove the primer" idea rather then remove and grind. I will use this opportunity to see just how much this primer burns. In future I will try the one week (or 72 hours) cure time and check the difference. What he says in that article makes sense. I just don't want to alter my schedule at the moment. Besides, this is just the inside of the channel. The rest of the tub will be blasted and shot in EP primer later and I intend to hit the overlap seams with thinned down primer and a paint brush as part of that procedure. Hopefully it will wick in and protect it.
merbesfield
SILVER Star
I have welded thru various paints and the fumes are bad news. Get yourself a respirator for under your helmet. Last time I welded the floor pan into my Porsche, my lungs were a mess for weeks. Who knows what I did to my body. I am looking for one now that fits under the helmet, I know they exist.
North welding mask
North welding mask on amazon for half the price of the above link
one at McMaster-Carr
North welding mask
North welding mask on amazon for half the price of the above link
one at McMaster-Carr
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