HJ60 frame and powertrain swap (12ht A440)

[zander]

I will be posting progress on my frame and powertrain swap in this thread.

I bought a 1987 HJ60 out of Canada in 2005. Just this spring i got a remanufactured 12ht turbo diesel motor with extreme A440 transmission from the amazing Rodney at Wholesale Automatics in Australia. When I went to do the swap I found the frame was far more rusted than I had thought. This led me to find a new California frame (a 1989 FJ62 frame from a IH8MUD forum member down in the South Bay). So now my project has grown to a full on frame off rebuild.

So here is link to the pics I am taking of the project:
http://picasaweb.google.com/longnow/LCFrameSwap

 

[Tapage]

pretty rusted !

 

[cdnroofrack]

Nice, I just replaced the frame on my 84 bj60. How did you lift the body off of the old frame? I used floor jacks and pieces of 2x6 on end, scary to say the least. Good luck!

 

[Creeker]

Hey Zander - just wanted to say hi and thanks for your longnow site. I started looking for a biodiesel "family" car over a year ago and you're one of the first sources I found. I'm now converting my newly aquired FJ62 to 1HZ diesel. In the back of my mind I've been thinking of your import advice, and wondering if I was going about things the wrong way...

Seeing you doing a frame off restore now makes me feel a lot better! Very little rust on my frame!

I look forward to seeing your project develop.

 

[roscoFJ73]

I will be posting progress on my frame and powertrain swap in this thread.

I bought a 1987 HJ60 out of Canada in 2005. Just this spring i got a remanufactured 12ht turbo diesel motor with extreme A440 transmission from the amazing Rodney at Wholesale Automatics in Australia. When I went to do the swap I found the frame was far more rusted than I had thought. This led me to find a new California frame (a 1989 FJ62 frame from a IH8MUD forum member down in the South Bay). So now my project has grown to a full on frame off rebuild.

]

An engine combo like that needs a nice shiny frame. You will have something to be proud of whn its finished.
How about some engine pics.

 

[zander]

Good progress over the last few days. Stripped both frames completely down and set them side by side on jack stands.

The first thing I confirmed was that both engine mounts definitely HAVE to be changed. It does look like the FJ62 frame is the best one to do this swap with as it does indeed have the A440 automatic tranny mount in the same position as near as I can tell. I found a PDF of the dimensioned drawing of the frame in the Body Manual (thanks to www.birfield.com for keeping this link alive). It shows the HJ60 and FJ62 as having identical frames and gives all the body mount dimensions but does not specify engine mounts. (This is page 562 http://picasaweb.google.com/longnow/LCFrameSwap/photo#4977421904966778898.)

I took a ton of measurements of the mounts on the HJ60 frame.
Pics of this start with this one:
http://picasaweb.google.com/longnow/LCFrameSwap/photo#4971845624655904786

I took more measurements than shown in the pics, (mostly with a set of 12" digital calipers to close-by holes and reference points). The main dimensions I paid a lot of attention to were the ones to the tranny crossbar points, as I want the engine to have the correct spacing to the tranny mount. I also made a few dimensioned drawings you can see here: http://picasaweb.google.com/longnow/LCFrameSwap/photo#4977421756807643154. One thing that occurs to me in all this is that it would not be too hard to make up a set of engine mounts for doing this swap that reference easily on an FJ frame.

Then I took a plasma cutter to the FJ62 engine mounts, cutting them into three parts, to make the welds easy to bend backward and snap off with no damage to the frame. Conversely on the HJ60 frame I took the grinder and plasma cutter to the frame to release the welds, saving the mounts.

A couple pics of this start with this one:
http://picasaweb.google.com/longnow/LCFrameSwap/photo#4971846939359510546

Then I ground down and cleaned up the weld area on the FJ frame, and cleaned up the HJ mounts on a grinder and wirewheel.

With a set of clamps I set up the mounts on the FJ frame visually at first. Then I started repeating my measurements from my drawing, and slowly adjusting the mounts to match. Again the numbers I paid the most attention to were the ones that referenced the transmission crossbar. This all went well, I got a little inconsistency on the passenger side on my forward measurements. It looks like this frame had a little damage in that corner and was straightened at one point which I think accounts for it. It was not out more than about .100" on any measurement which I think the various mounts etc can take up. Well see anyhow.

Then my shop partner (who is by far the better welder) tacked them in place, we then pulled the clamps and re-measured to be sure. Then he finished the welds with the MIG welder.

A couple pics of this start with this one:
http://picasaweb.google.com/longnow/LCFrameSwap/photo#4971846640443260946

So now I am going to wire wheel any surface rust on the new frame and paint it all up.

 

[zander]

Got new frame prepped and painted today... More pics coming soon.

 

[cruiser_guy]

The frame rust looks pretty standard for the Canadian trucks I've seen. Mine was slightly worse prior to getting a new frame last December.

 

[fe sus]

Zander-
I have the spare tire cross member up here in Seattle... $20 + shipping?

 

[In2cruisers]

Was it the 12ht, the A440 trans. or the 62 frame that caused the mounts to have to be moved? I was under the impression that the 2H w/4 or 5spd would bolt straight into a FJ60 frame?

 

[zander]

Zander-
I have the spare tire cross member up here in Seattle... $20 + shipping?

Thanks for the offer. I have all the cross members as well though...

 

[zander]

Was it the 12ht, the A440 trans. or the 62 frame that caused the mounts to have to be moved? I was under the impression that the 2H w/4 or 5spd would bolt straight into a FJ60 frame?

The 12HT definately does not use the same mounts as the gas motor. I forgot to take pics of the gasser mounts but they are WAY different and the placement of at least one side is about 6" shifted.

I dont know about the tranny mounts as I got a frame that was already made for the A440, just as my old frame was. But my understanding is those mounts change as well if going from auto to manual. I am not clear though if it would be a different cross member, bolt position, or something else...

 

[zander]

The newly painted frame is now back together with axles. I am finishing up the fuel and brake lines as we speak. I am hoping that I can use the FJ62 fuel line I got with the frame for my return line from the 12ht. Looking at it, it looks like it may work.

Pics here:
http://picasaweb.google.com/longnow/LCFrameSwap/photo#4977415349292040210

 

[Diescipel]

Looks good. What products and processes did you use to paint the frame?

B

 

[zander]

Looks good. What products and processes did you use to paint the frame?

The frame was is excellent shape as it was, when I got it I pressure washed all the dirt off. I wire wheeled any minor surface rust or places where paint was missing, then sprayed OSPHO (by Jasco) on the exposed metal to prep it (I really like this stuff, it preps clean metal and converts surface rust into a hard black paintable surface). I pressure washed it one more time, let it dry and then painted it with flat black Rustoleum metal paint with a brush to give it a couple nice thick coats.

 

[zander]

Well I got through all the lines last night. I was able to use what i think is one of the breather lines from the gas FJ62 for my return line. Its slightly smaller in diameter than my diesel feed line, but I am assuming that less fuel will be coming back to the tank than going from it...

The question is whether the ends of the line begin and end in good places for the engine and tank, we will have to wait until the rest goes together for that.

Now I just add the exhaust brackets and push it back across the street to my mechanic who will be mounting the engine/tranny, and putting the body back on. I will post some pics as that goes together.

 

[pjohnson]

Lots of pics of engine mounted without the body... please

I will be doing a 12HT swap in the future and hope for many reference photos.

Thanks,
Phil

 

[zander]

Lots of pics of engine mounted without the body... please

I will try and take as many good reference pics with tape measures etc in them as I can...

 

[zander]

Finally got the motor and tranny bolted together and mounted into the frame today...

pics start here:
http://picasaweb.google.com/longnow/LCFrameSwap/photo#4981732383964135442

I took some pics with a tape measure to give folks some reference points. If you want more or different ones let me know. Also note the tranny mount is not mounted in these pics so there might be some shift still to happen. (I got the wrong tranny mount somehow)

 

[Tapage]

Expectacular !!!!!