Why does my 22re engine rattle...sound like a diesel (1 Viewer)

[My71FJ40]

Why does my 22re engine rattle...sound like a diesel. My 87 4runner I recently bought had the idle set way too high when I bought it, so I lowered it down to find that the PO was hiding the sound of the engine rattle. I don't know if its the valves or what but it happens at idle and goes away over 1k rpms....? I'm sure this is a common problem, just new to me.

 

[KLF]

Sounds like it's time for at least a valve adjustment. Easy and free to try, see if it helps.

Do you know the history of the engine? How old is the timing chain set, in particular the guides and tensioner?

 

[Devils Paw 80]

Probably not quite right, though they do tend to be noisy engines.

 

[4x4 Station Wagon]

I agree with where KLF is heading. I have seen a few that the chain was sloppy and it took decent oil pressure (higher idle) to make the tensioner take up enough slack to quiet it down. None the less it wasnt really the sound of a diesel but.....

 

[My71FJ40]

No, not the sound of a diesel, but my best way of describing it. My 88 4runner is just nice and quiet...with about 150k less miles on it too. No known history of the 87's engine, close to 300K so I am not surprised it has issues. I'll start with the valve adjustment and then check the timing chain after that if it doesn't go away. Thanks!

 

[RiverRatMatt]

If it sounds at all like a clicking sound, or maybe like there's a small hole in your exhaust pipe, stop driving it TODAY.

If it sounds like its coming from the front of the engine particularly, stop driving it TODAY.

The clicking sound (if that is what it is) is the timing chain eating away at the water pump housing. If you don't know the timing chain guides have been upgraded to metal, then pull the water pump housing and check the guides.

I had a clicking noise at a particular RPM range in my 86. Truck had about 300k on it. The above happened and when I was rebuilding the engine I discovered my chain guides had turned into little plastic pieces in my oil pan.

 

[KLF]

The clicking sound (if that is what it is) is the timing chain eating away at the water pump housing.

I think you mean the timing cover. The water pump bolts to the front of the timing cover, there's no way the chain can hit it.

You can inspect the guides while doing the valve adjustment, just shine a really bright flashlight down between the block and timing cover.

 

[Sam Stewart]

Chain guides are probably shot out. I would check them with a flash light like KLF suggested and you can also stick a long screwdriver or small pry bar down there and see if the chain moves easily. If so that is a good indication of the guides and/or tensioner being worn out. I don't know about you guys but I've seen lots and lots of 22REs with worn out guides. We used to do chain, gears, guides and tensioner replacements fairly often. Usually higher mileagle engines.

Edit: Super-secret 'MUD price will set you back about $350 for the chain, guides, tensioner, gaskets, and gears.

 

[bcstoy]

I just got a timing chain kit for about $69.00 from a company called CNS I think. The kit is from japan guides are metal and water pump is MGB. I have not installed yet but it seems of good quality.

 

[calico kid]

My 93 sounds like that. premium fuel seems to make it run smoother and quieter.

 

[RiverRatMatt]

I think you mean the timing cover.

Yeah, timing cover is what I meant. Couldn't think of the word :whoops:

 

[Combat Chuck]

Engines can rattle if the oil pressure/ levels are low, but I agree it's likely valves or bad fuel if it sounds like a diesel (dieseling). If it's a rhythmic tapping/slapping from the front of the engine, it's a stretched chain.
I'm of the school of though that Toyota put plastic guides in there for a reason - they break, make a hell of a ruckus to let you know what's up; metal ones will just wear and wear until the chain saws through your timing cover, or you eat some valves.

 

[93TonkaToy]

My 93 sounds like that. premium fuel seems to make it run smoother and quieter.

Yours may be spark knock.

 

[flash02]

From what I understand it's the braking of the plastic guide that allows the chain to cut into the cover, since the metal guid should not brake the chain it will never cut into the water jacket.

Sent from my iPhone using IH8MUD

 

[Combat Chuck]

From what I understand it's the braking of the plastic guide that allows the chain to cut into the cover, since the metal guid should not brake the chain it will never cut into the water jacket.

Sent from my iPhone using IH8MUD

I don't know about that, but I know it's the breaking of the plastic guides that tells you when your chain is stretched, because you'll get the death rattle.

I would rather run the OEM guides than one day bust some valves on behalf of a silent stretched chain. That's entirely me, though. Run what you like to run, but I learned this one from a guy who's been building 22R's since long before I was crawling.

Honestly, were it up to me, I'd run timing gears like on an F/2F.
Gears don't stretch.

 

[2ndGenToyotaFan]

I had a metal guide break and fall between the chain and crank, breaking the chain, and bending some valves... Nothing's foolproof... If you bother to adjust your valves once in a while and take a look at your plastic guides while you're at it, they will be fine....

 

[flash02]

Honestly, were it up to me, I'd run timing gears like on an F/2F.
Gears don't stretch.

Man that would be one hell of a gear set up for an over head cam head. My first 4runner lasted well over 200k with the original timing set with NO noise at all. This truck was driven from day one with regular oil changes and Dailey driven on the highway, no noises! Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't Toyota use metal guides and double row gears on the 20R and 22R engines? Perhaps cost cutting changed their minds and as such we got plastic guides and single row timing chain gears.

Sent from my iPhone using IH8MUD

 

[Combat Chuck]

Man that would be one hell of a gear set up for an over head cam head. My first 4runner lasted well over 200k with the original timing set with NO noise at all. This truck was driven from day one with regular oil changes and Dailey driven on the highway, no noises! Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't Toyota use metal guides and double row gears on the 20R and 22R engines? Perhaps cost cutting changed their minds and as such we got plastic guides and single row timing chain gears.

Sent from my iPhone using IH8MUD

it would be. It would take a big cluster of gears to do that right, I can't really see it working out well in the end, either. Just this noisy, overcomplicated clusterfawk of metal getting in the way of the timing cover.
Modern engines with the timing belts are nice, too because you don't have to pull the head to do a new belt. Cuts the shop time down alot, and it's just as reliable as a t-chain so long as you keep up on your maintenance.

As far as I know, Toyota's aways used the plastic guides.
I've never really had any trouble with them, myself. The fact that my plastic guides failed just before my chain stretched out of whack saved my engine, too. Had it not been for the death rattle, I probably would have run it until I ate some valves and had to rack up some serious repairs.

 

[84stockcrawl]

My 84 4runner with a 22R is also rattling at 166k. I think I am need of a new chain and guides. After it starts up it rattles a bit then goes away and happens again at mid range RPM's. The sound goes away at slighty higher Rpms. I think its the original chain I have put 20k since last year. I'm going to let it eat the guides. And I am expecting to have it snap and to be broke down, after wich i will be looking to buy a used 22r to swap. But if the chain wraps that would be really messed up and damadge A LOT MORE! But A 22R takes less than a weekend to swap. I should pull the valve cover and inspect like mentioned above. Thank for the reminder. If anyone has similar noises or stories about the actual chain failing please post it!!

 

[KLF]

As far as I know, Toyota's aways used the plastic guides.

The 22R had metal guides with a double-row chain when it came out in 1981. They switched to a single-row chain and plastic guides in mid-83.