What parts should be replaced / serviced on a Front Brake Job?

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RND1

RND1

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I'm in need of front brakes soon. Once again, I'm trying to decide between doing this myself, having my dealer do it, or having an indy do it.

The rotors and pads have 30,000 miles on them and were last done at Herb Chambers in Boston. My dealer is suggesting to turn the rotors and simply put pads on for $349. If they deem the rotors can not be turned, then replacement of rotors and pads is $689. They said they don't touch the bearings and that you don't have to for this job?

My indy quoted me $355 for new rotors and pads (aftermarket). Said it was $191 for parts and remainder in labor. I don't know if they know these LC's well. They too didn't mention anything about servicing the bearings or replacing any seals, star washer, etc.

OEM parts from beno are $260 plus shipping for rotors, pads, hub seals, and star washers. I have some time to do this job over the holidays, but I'm concerned with the typical challenges faced with a salt belt truck.

So, what parts are required for this job and should the wheel bearings be serviced while in there?
 
Have you done brakes before? Is your steering wheel shaking/vibrating when braking? If it is, you need rotors. If not, just get the pads. If just the pads, that's super simple, no more than an hour for both sides.

I recently replaced my pads/rotors. If you need rotors, they are cheap so it doesn't make sense to go non-oem. I'd get the kit from @beno and do it yourself. UNLESS there is a lot of rust, which I may let someone else do it since IH8RUST. Or ask your indy if you can bring him the parts and just pay labor.

Besides the parts above, you will need grease too. It's probably a good idea to get at least 1 wheel bearing if not both, but it's not necessarily needed unless they are bad. It just depends on your budget and miles.

You have a 54mm socket? That's the only specific tool that you may not have. You probably have the rest.
 
the 54mm socket can be had for 12 bucks.

If its a toyota/Lexus dealer saying you dont have to touch the bearings then you need to find a new dealer that service guy does not know anything. They may not need to be replaced but they do have to come out. And if they come out you will at the least need new grease.

Its not an easy job to replace the rotors for guys that don't do mechanical stuff. Its not impossible but if its your fist time its going to take all day at least. There are guides here on the site and will walk you through it. rotor/pads can be had for 150ish off of amazon. If you get the right grease its 12-30 bucks depending where you get it. Its not regular grease but lots of guys just use regular stuff.

Its a nasty messy operation unless you like to get dirty :). After doing it myself one time. I would consider 600 fair for swaping new rotors and pads repacking. If they find problems with the bearings I forget the total cost but I think it was around 200 each side +- 50 bucks for just the bearings.
 
I was too cheap to spend the money for new vibration damping plates (the ones with the rubber coating) and reused the old ones. Now my brakes are squeaking as I come to a full stop. I would recommend buying new ones and be done with it. It's getting really annoying so next time I order parts I'll probably go ahead and get them and re-do mine. It would have been easier to just not be so cheap the first time.....
By the way, I got the parts kit from Autozone and all the other parts worked fine. It just did not come with the dampener plates. Go figure...
 
ScubaJon said:
If its a toyota/Lexus dealer saying you dont have to touch the bearings then you need to find a new dealer that service guy does not know anything. They may not need to be replaced but they do have to come out. And if they come out you will at the least need new grease.
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Not if the shop is planning on turning the rotors while on the vehicle.
 
arcteryx said:
Have you done brakes before? Is your steering wheel shaking/vibrating when braking? If it is, you need rotors. If not, just get the pads. If just the pads, that's super simple, no more than an hour for both sides.

You have a 54mm socket? That's the only specific tool that you may not have. You probably have the rest.
Click to expand...

Thanks @arcteryx - I've done lots of brakes before, but never on a vehicle that required pulling the hub so this would be a first. No shaking/vibrating during braking so I was thinking I could just get pads. Are you suggesting just doing pads with no turn of the rotors?

If I were to tackle the rotors and pads myself, I would have to get bearing grease and the 54mm socket - I have all the rest. My main concern are the acorn washers and getting the rotor off the hub as I'm sure it's rust welded on there :)

ScubaJon said:
If its a toyota/Lexus dealer saying you dont have to touch the bearings then you need to find a new dealer that service guy does not know anything. They may not need to be replaced but they do have to come out. And if they come out you will at the least need new grease.

Its not an easy job to replace the rotors for guys that don't do mechanical stuff. Its not impossible but if its your fist time its going to take all day at least. There are guides here on the site and will walk you through it. rotor/pads can be had for 150ish off of amazon. If you get the right grease its 12-30 bucks depending where you get it. Its not regular grease but lots of guys just use regular stuff.

Its a nasty messy operation unless you like to get dirty :). After doing it myself one time. I would consider 600 fair for swaping new rotors and pads repacking. If they find problems with the bearings I forget the total cost but I think it was around 200 each side +- 50 bucks for just the bearings.
Click to expand...

Yes, my Toyota dealer is saying that you don't have to touch the bearings to replace the rotors. I was getting the sense that he was trying to relay what the tech was telling him, but wasn't very sure of himself. He did say that they hardly ever work on LC's.

I don't mind getting my hands dirty and I enjoy mechanical work, but with 3 kids and a less than enthusiastic wife ("so you're spending all day Saturday to do your brakes...great"), I find less and less time to DIY.

I'm leaning towards getting the OEM parts from beno and having my indy install them. The LC has 110,000 miles on it so not sure if they will find an issue with the bearings.
 
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If there is no vibration and no front end noise, I would just do the pads. Very easy to do and you don't need to crack the lines. As I said, it would take an hour to do that. Save the other stuff for next time.
 
My front's lasted 90K+ & rears 60K+ miles and were done at Dealer first time. This last time (Oct 2015) I DIY, servicing wheel bearings at same time.

Best practice: Rotors (AKA Disc) should be turned whenever pads are replace.
2001 FSM Measure Disc thickness: Minimum thickness front is 30.0 MM, Rears are 16.0 MM.

One can check thickness in advance on vehicle, but the machine shop will check before they turn disc to make sure within limit and will also check for warping (run-out). Cost $12 per disc off vehicle. Total DIY cost w/pad ~ $35 per wheel.

Wheel bearing and axle bushing & bearings should be service every 30K miles.

Auto shops turn Disc's while on vehicle, so not much help reducing cost of bearing service. DYI; one will pull off rotors and may as well do bearing at same time.

Note: Excessive rust, heavy breaking and age weakens the vents between disc. A search will reveal disc that have separated.
Make sure to: Wipe oils off disc before installing pads, and follow manufacture break in procedure to properly seat pads/disc.
 
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2001LC said:
My front's lasted 90K+ & rears 60K+ miles and were done at Dealer first time. This last time (Oct 2015) I did, servicing wheel bearings at same time.
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You're going to have to share your secrets of how to get 90K miles out of a set of front pads/rotors! Beno told me 30K miles was very good with the front end weight on our LC's!
 
Both my 100's wear the rear brakes faster than the fronts. First car I've owned like that. If it's braking fine and not shimmying, I see no need to turn the rotors.
 
RND1 said:
You're going to have to share your secrets of how to get 90K miles out of a set of front pads/rotors! Beno told me 30K miles was very good with the front end weight on our LC's!
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Doesn't everyone?;)

I guess it just was a good brake job, well balanced Toyota brake hydraulics, regular high pressure washing and my driving style (60/40 city/highway mostly in town).

History:

2004: Assumed Dealer used stock OEM ceramic pads, cost for all 4 was $440 in 2004 at 67.5k miles on odometer. My notes state rears were thick (lots of life left) and front were still ok. I just wanted new brakes at that time. Toyota vin # records showed PO had rears done at 30K miles. I now believe could have gone maybe ~20k miles more on them, back then.

2010: Early warning squeal sounded ~127k miles on odometer. So I bought full set of pads, turns out I only needed rears. I checked front pads every tire rotation (3 to 5K) after that, they were barely wearing. I went to a friend at Lexus and asked: are my front brakes engaging properly, thinking perhaps only rears are carrying load. We couldn't find anything wrong, and the rears brakes which are liter and thinner were holding up very well. I search all my records and receipt thinking maybe I forgot and did a second brake job since. Nope, I have every receipt and have keep a log going back to day one on everything. I flushed my brake fluid. Wish I'd not flushed brake fluid as factory installed can't be imported by the can into USA and color was still clear. Finally we came to conclusion this was normal and rears do wear faster (~60K).

2015: Finally at ~165K miles on odometer early warning sounded, so replace fronts only. Rotors (disc) looked pretty good and still above minimum limit so I turned again. I'm planning on new rotor next time, as they were near limit and getting very old.:cheers:
 
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Thanks guys for all the help. I'm going to start with a simple pad replacement and see how it goes. Should I replace pins or pad hardware?
 
RND1 said:
Thanks guys for all the help. I'm going to start with a simple pad replacement and see how it goes. Should I replace pins or pad hardware?
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Clean old pins and used old shims if new aren't supplied. Make sure to apply anti squeal grease. Use a degrease to wipe disc before installing pads. I'd add follow manufactures break-in procedure but not sure if matters when not turning disc.

I have, when in a hurry, done brake jobs without turning disc or drums, just not on 100. Keep in mind by not turning disc (rotors), your new pads will seat into old groves of disc. This may or may not cause pulling and or squealing. If this happens and you then decide to turn; you'll need new pads again.

I just installed these Ceramic pads, working great and no brake dust. I believe these are same as OEM for 2001, perhaps someone can verify.
Rear pads Akebono ACT773
Fronts pads Akebono ACT772
 
2001LC said:
Doesn't everyone?;)

I guess it just was a good brake job, well balanced Toyota brake hydraulics, regular high pressure washing and my driving style (60/40 city/highway mostly in town).

History:

2004: Assumed Dealer used stock OEM ceramic pads, cost for all 4 was $440 in 2004 at 67.5k miles on odometer. My notes state rears were thick (lots of life left) and front were still ok. I just wanted new brakes at that time. Toyota vin # records showed PO had rears done at 30K miles. I now believe could have gone maybe ~20k miles more on them, back then.

2010: Early warning squeal sounded ~127k miles on odometer. So I bought full set of pads, turns out I only needed rears. I checked front pads every tire rotation (3 to 5K) after that, they were barely wearing. I went to a friend at Lexus and asked: are my front brakes engaging properly, thinking perhaps only rears are carrying load. We couldn't find anything wrong, and the rears brakes which are liter and thinner were holding up very well. I search all my records and receipt thinking maybe I forgot and did a second brake job since. Nope, I have every receipt and have keep a log going back to day one on everything. I flushed my brake fluid. Wish I'd not flushed brake fluid as factory installed can't be imported by the can into USA and color was still clear. Finally we came to conclusion this was normal and rears do wear faster (~60K).

2015: Finally at ~165K miles on odometer early warning sounded, so replace fronts only. Rotors (disc) looked pretty good and still above minimum limit so I turned again. I'm planning on new rotor next time, as they were near limit and getting very old.:cheers:
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I think your experience is normal with a 100 series. Some don't get these great results because they ride their brakes, etc. heavy rush hour traffic.
 
SWUtah said:
I think your experience is normal with a 100 series. Some don't get these great results because they ride their brakes, etc. heavy rush hour traffic.
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I agree, as I have a lite foot and avoid rush hour.

I also feel it starts with a good brake job (parts & procedure). Not turning disc and one can do a brake job in minutes, just more often.
 
Well, I don't expect to get 90K miles out of a pad slap, but I'll see how long it lasts. I do get stuck in a lot of stop and go in Boston area traffic so I'm actually pretty happy with 30K miles. That's about 2 years of driving for me.
 
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