When doing a weld vertically is it better to pull or push the bead? and is it better to go from top to bottom or bottom to top?
vertical weld?
- Thread starter usmcruiser
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I watched a buddy who was a professional welder and he went from top to bottom. I tried it myself with good results.
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Thanks for the info man.
Does anyone else have personal experience?
What about pushing vs pulling the weld bead?
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usmcruiser, First is this a SMAW/Stick or GMAW/MIG weld?
If it is a stick weld you have two options... up or down progression.. first--6010,7010,8010 are top to bottom rods --PULL. Second is 7018 bottom to top rods--PUSH. ( these are rod examples... many more choices)
If MIG you still have two options...up or down progression... first a bead that is pulled from top to bottom. This usually make a very aesthetically pleasing weld bead but, it usually not as strong and does NOT penetrate the base metal as well. Second and the best IMO is a push from bottom to top. This weld unless you have quite a bit of time performing it will not be as "Pretty" but, will be stronger in the long run. (Main reason for the strength difference is you are working against gravity and therefore apply more heat input to the weld area, allowing for better breakdown and penetration of base metals.)
This is why most rock slider manufacturers recommend welding diamond plates to the frame to attach their products. It is neither a horizontal or vertical weld and most novice welders have better luck making this weld hold.
All in all IMO and professional one... Vertical up/push from bottom to top for the strongest weld.
J
If it is a stick weld you have two options... up or down progression.. first--6010,7010,8010 are top to bottom rods --PULL. Second is 7018 bottom to top rods--PUSH. ( these are rod examples... many more choices)
If MIG you still have two options...up or down progression... first a bead that is pulled from top to bottom. This usually make a very aesthetically pleasing weld bead but, it usually not as strong and does NOT penetrate the base metal as well. Second and the best IMO is a push from bottom to top. This weld unless you have quite a bit of time performing it will not be as "Pretty" but, will be stronger in the long run. (Main reason for the strength difference is you are working against gravity and therefore apply more heat input to the weld area, allowing for better breakdown and penetration of base metals.)
This is why most rock slider manufacturers recommend welding diamond plates to the frame to attach their products. It is neither a horizontal or vertical weld and most novice welders have better luck making this weld hold.
All in all IMO and professional one... Vertical up/push from bottom to top for the strongest weld.
J
Last edited:
brian
SILVER Star
6010 and it's kind are normally run uphill.
it's old school name is 5p, which is still found on most 50pound tins of it.
5p would be 5 position, up, down, overhead, horizontal and flat.
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Interesting...
Maybe for fabshop/structural steel WPS' and PQR's a 6010 and alike are normally an uphill rod.. I've run 6010-8010 mainly downhill on pipelines, oil & gas and nuclear facilities for over 20 years at 100% RT/x-ray.. Also for AWS D1.1 welding uphill on 6010 and alike is the norm in my experience.
5p= older red rod and the newer 5P plus= grey rod are an all position rod. 5P is a naming feature for the electrode manufacturers.. No different that ESAB's Atom Arc 7018 or Lincoln's Excalibur 7018 etc... Yes, years ago Lincoln named the 6010 rod "5P" because it could be used in any position.
Proper way to read a rod is: Ex. E6010...
E= Electrode
1st two digits.. 60= strength/60K tensile
Next to last digit represents the position a rod is designed to be welded in.. 1= All position 2= Flat and Horizontal 3= Flat welding
Last is the coating on the rod and type of current it is designed to be used at.
0= Cellulose Sodium DC+
1= Cellulose Sodium AC or DC+
2= Cellulose Potassium DC+, DC-, or AC
3= Titania Sodium AC or DC-
4= FE powder Sodium AC, DC+, or DC-
5= Lo/Hy Sodium DC+
6= Lo/Hy Potassium AC or DC+
7= FE powder FE oxide AC, DC+, or DC-
8= Lo/Hy FE powder AC or DC+
Difference in welding worlds Brian. All sectors are different but, at the end of the day all that matters to me is... (1) Was the weld made by a qualified/certified tested welder in accordance with a properly qualified WPS and PQR? (2) Does the weld meet all applicable codes, engineering designs, and standards? (3) Finally, will it pass NDT if required.. If not send the guy back to the hall or wherever for more time under his hood.
J
Last edited:
brian
SILVER Star
we do pipe, and the old man wants it run up hill.
bmorefj40
SILVER Star
My experience is limited, but when i got my cert on mig, I did both up and down. Up will definitely give you a stronger weld because it will end up with a wider bead and much more weld deposited mainly due to the technique. Vert down is just like running a normal bead, but your gun is shooting at an upward angle and your wire is supporting the puddle as your coming down. Vert up is more of a sweeping motion from side to side, with a pause on each side and a very quick wash over the middle. Much harder to do, but with practice, you can hang whatever you want from it. However, in the beginning I hated vertical up as much as overhead, but once you figure it out, its a nice skill to keep in your back pocket when you need it.
