Thinking of selling my 2020 HE (1 Viewer)

[scottm]

a 21 he for $98k will not appreciate in value. Fact. Toyota will bring the 300 back in 23 and these trucks will crater in value.

It’s a damn good vehicle, but it’s a gas pig and gas is getting more expensive.

The 300 will still be a gas pig, physics hasn't been overcome yet. For it to get significantly better mileage, it would have to be significantly smaller and lighter, and then it would not be a replacement to the 200. And 200s would be even more valuable.

There is barely a market for the LC in the U.S., that has been proven. The 300 isn't much different, and won't suddenly have a market. A stripped down version for significantly less $ would be a different story and market, don't see that happening.

70-Series LC offered in the U.S.? There would be 200s abandoned on the streets as we sell our souls to buy every 70 Toyota can ship. But not gonna happen.

I'm not counting on or expecting my 200 to go up in value or even hold it's value, but the more is known about the 300, the more likely it seems. I'm starting to feel rather smug about my foresight in buying this truck, but then I remember it was my wife's idea. And now she's mentioned she might drive it some...eek! That is what happened to my first 80, had to buy a second when my late wife took it over. Maybe a Lexus 300 in our future.

 

[40Man]

The 300 will still be a gas pig, physics hasn't been overcome yet. For it to get significantly better mileage, it would have to be significantly smaller and lighter, and then it would not be a replacement to the 200. And 200s would be even more valuable.

There is barely a market for the LC in the U.S., that has been proven. The 300 isn't much different, and won't suddenly have a market. A stripped down version for significantly less $ would be a different story and market, don't see that happening.

70-Series LC offered in the U.S.? There would be 200s abandoned on the streets as we sell our souls to buy every 70 Toyota can ship. But not gonna happen.

I'm not counting on or expecting my 200 to go up in value or even hold it's value, but the more is known about the 300, the more likely it seems. I'm starting to feel rather smug about my foresight in buying this truck, but then I remember it was my wife's idea. And now she's mentioned she might drive it some...eek! That is what happened to my first 80, had to buy a second when my late wife took it over. Maybe a Lexus 300 in our future.

Sure a gas pig is likely, but also it will likely be much more efficient that the 5.7, which probably sits at as the least efficient among large box gas hogs. If they can get the mpg to push from the 13/17 to 17/21 it would be a huge improvement, and would allow you to get an extra 100 miles per tank, which would be welcome. The lack of range is the biggest issue with the LC. A Gear Patrol article listed a "leaked source" listing 23.7 mpg, with the caveat that the EPA (or other governing bodies since it isn't coming here) may be more stringent.

The non-hybrid Tundra, once tested in the real world, will show us the potential of the TTV6.

 

[scottm]

Sure a gas pig is likely, but also it will likely be much more efficient that the 5.7, which probably sits at as the least efficient among large box gas hogs. If they can get the mpg to push from the 13/17 to 17/21 it would be a huge improvement, and would allow you to get an extra 100 miles per tank, which would be welcome. The lack of range is the biggest issue with the LC. A Gear Patrol article listed a "leaked source" listing 23.7 mpg, with the caveat that the EPA (or other governing bodies since it isn't coming here) may be more stringent.

The non-hybrid Tundra, once tested in the real world, will show us the potential of the TTV6.

A typical owner might save $1,000/year with the better mileage. On a $90k truck. I expected to lose $40k in value my first year, based on used prices I was researching. $1k/yr is not going to to be a factor for buyers of these vehicles.

If more range matters to new buyers, Toyota certainly knows that, and still our range sucks. I don't think the increase in range will be used as a selling point. And still, it won't be sold here, not even with better range.

 

[40Man]

A typical owner might save $1,000/year with the better mileage. On a $90k truck. I expected to lose $40k in value my first year, based on used prices I was researching. $1k/yr is not going to to be a factor for buyers of these vehicles.

If more range matters to new buyers, Toyota certainly knows that, and still our range sucks. I don't think the increase in range will be used as a selling point. And still, it won't be sold here, not even with better range.

Don't disagree, it won't be sold here, but the LX will. And I never said anything about cost savings, just the lack of range many complain about. Toyota knows that, but with the trade-offs in ground clearance and inability/unwillingness to put tanks behind the axle in the USA due to litigation risk, their options outside of better efficiency are limited.

Cruiser owners own their rig at least 10 years (highest of any vehicle). $10k in your pocket over that period in no small thing, but not something most Cruiser buyers focus on on the primary market, but does become a focus on the used market, where better efficiency could help limit depreciation due to increased used market demand.

Not to mention, someone that just paid 90k for a vehicle could more easily justify upgrading to a new car, getting more new sales. If the 300 series LC was sold here with that much more range, I'd definitely get one, although I'd wait a couple years for early issues to be worked out.

An increase in mpg makes sales more viable for CAFE standards as it is based on total fleet sales. I assume that is one reason Toyota never marketed the LC here.

 

[Dunbar]

Better range is here. You just have to buy and install it. I'm keeping the spare underneath so I'll only have 50% more fuel with the LRA 12.5 gallon tank. 39 gallons goes a lot farther than 26.5 even with the Harrop SC I have on order.

 

[bloc]

Better range is here. You just have to buy and install it. I'm keeping the spare underneath so I'll only have 50% more fuel with the LRA 12.5 gallon tank. 39 gallons goes a lot farther than 26.5 even with the Harrop SC I have on order.

But won’t come with toyota factory levels of integration and reliability.

Not that it isn’t worth the money, but there are trade-offs. And in a conversation about range improvements on new vehicles aftermarket mods need to be kept in context.

Factory sub-tank? Hell yes.

 

[40Man]

But won’t come with toyota factory levels of integration and reliability.

Not that it isn’t worth the money, but there are trade-offs. And in a conversation about range improvements on new vehicles aftermarket mods need to be kept in context.

Factory sub-tank? Hell yes.

Not to mention, that for resale, a factory system with better MPG will be more attractive to most buyers (Mud aside ) than a modified rig. Ruptured filling tubes, tanks, and fuel lines are predominant factors in crash fire situations, often from use of subpar lines, which tends to happen more often with aftermarket products, as a manufacturer is going to be more risk adverse (same reason the factory aux tank isn't sold here due to potential litigation risk). Adding a sub-tank behind the rear axle, even in a heavy duty rig like the LC, increases these risks.

 

[AnyMal]

a 21 he for $98k will not appreciate in value. Fact. Toyota will bring the 300 back in 23 and these trucks will crater in value.

It’s a damn good vehicle, but it’s a gas pig and gas is getting more expensive.

Where did you get that from?

 

[TheRealDeal124]

Placing an ad on Autotrader is simple and cheap. I'd put it on with a stretch price and see what you get. I've also seen a lot of overland type vehicles on BAT lately, but a 2020 LC may not be quirky enough for that platform, but an auction site like that will probably get you the best price.

Cars And Bids, owned in part by a famous YouTube car and Land Cruiser enthusiast Doug Demuro.

 

[bloc]

You're driving a $90k gas guzzling, under powered, technology challenged SUV because you want to.

I get that you weren’t trying to be critical, but how much power does a vehicle -designed for the uses that this one is- need?

 

[WCDAVE]

Cars And Bids, owned in part by a famous YouTube car and Land Cruiser enthusiast Doug Demuro.

Same idea as BAT I guess - auction gets you to the best place.

 

[greynolds]

Regarding the 200 series being underpowered goes, it certainly is when compared to a Mercedes AMG G63, but not to a pre-19 G550, both of which have much higher MSRP’s.

As far as the LC not selling well in the USA, the Lexus does sell reasonably well and a more stripped down LC would definitely sell better. Toyota certainly knows this and knows what they’re doing from a profit perspective.

The 70 series is something enthusiasts would want, but most new buyers who have been buying LC’s here most likely wouldn’t be happy with the ride quality and lack of luxury.

 

[tacoduck]

Is it all the time, or only when the stereo is on? Do you hear it through the speakers, or just in the dash? Which sound system? Has anyone else on Mud had this problem from your searches? Do you have kids that may have stuck something in the slot? Are there CDs in there?

Where did you get that from?

It’s a guess, but I’m betting Toyota is watching these things appreciate in value after the sale. If they brought a 300 to the us market they would probably sell 10k units at 100k a unit. That’s a big fat profit.

 

[ToothDr]

It’s a guess, but I’m betting Toyota is watching these things appreciate in value after the sale. If they brought a 300 to the us market they would probably sell 10k units at 100k a unit. That’s a big fat profit.

No big fat profit for Toyota. 10K units is nothing. EPA and DOT regulations for getting a truck approved to sell in the USA is significant. The Lexus variant of the 300 will be the successor to the land cruiser in the USA. Sad on a certain level that Toyota let the truck that made them who they are wither and die in the USA.

 

[Mbarron37]

They will never sell 10k LCs in the US. The only reason they are selling now, is that certain people have to have the last LC made for US.

The LC in the US died once the Sequoia was released in the US market. Look at sales of both LC and Sequoia, once the Sequoia was sold in the US.

I am not saying that the LC couldn’t do better in the US market, but how much better with the Sequoia available? Also, with Lexus being the luxury brand of Toyota, there is only so much we can expect for the LC or the Sequoia.

If Toyota wants to play in this market, they need to build a less expensive option, that is not full blown luxury.

 

[greynolds]

They will never sell 10k LCs in the US. The only reason they are selling now, is that certain people have to have the last LC made for US.

The LC in the US died once the Sequoia was released in the US market. Look at sales of both LC and Sequoia, once the Sequoia was sold in the US.

I am not saying that the LC couldn’t do better in the US market, but how much better with the Sequoia available? Also, with Lexus being the luxury brand of Toyota, there is only so much we can expect for the LC or the Sequoia.

If Toyota wants to play in this market, they need to build a less expensive option, that is not full blown luxury.

I think your last sentence is the key here. I have a hunch that Toyota could pretty easily sell 10K (or more) of a lower trim version of the LC in the USA. The big catch is that a lower trim version will end up competing directly with the Sequoia for sales. The Sequoia is bigger, which is obviously a plus for a lot of people, but it's a negative for some of us too.

It will hopefully be interesting to see what happens over the next several years with the new platform that will be shared by the LC, Sequoia, Tundra, etc. If we're lucky, we may even get a more offroad friendly version of the Lexus LX. Would it really be terrible if we ended up having to buy a Lexus LX instead of a Toyota Land Cruiser, as long as what we buy doesn't have a bumper that only leaves you with 2 inches of ground clearance?

 

[ToothDr]

The slow death of the Land Cruiser started with the introduction for the LX 450 in 1996. That’s the price point competitor, not the Sequoia.

 

[Lester did that]

We live in a Land Cruiser bubble/ echo chamber here on MUD. Everyone will agree they are best 4x4 SUV stock for out of the box. Slap on some slightly larger tyres and you can do more with it than any of the competition. But that's it. They are a great base system to MOD the hell out of for off road use. The majority of potential buyers do not care about this at all. They also don't care about long term reliability because they are replacing it after 3 years for a new model. LC's are also very expensive compared to other SUV's in the same price range that have better tech, better range and better leather. Like the LX570.

I would talk someone out of purchasing a new LC 2018-present unless they where planning on keeping it for 10 years plus or taking it offroad. You can have so much more in the price range. It's a very niche market for the LC here in the states. I understand Toyota's decision to pull it from a business perspective. Glad I have one.

If you don't like it sell it. Especially if you need a pick up truck. Take out the second row seats? Vehicles for me have always been something I accept and budget as a money pit. But it's also hobby that I am passionate about and supports my lifestyle. ( anyone own a boat?! )I think a lot of folks on here feel the same way. I've also driven a 5.7 liter motor since the 90's so gas just is what it is. Only a fool would purchase a LC and complain about the gas. The MPG is clearly stated. Range is clearly stated.

Who knows what's going to happen the next few years with valuations. These are crazy times right now and definitely not normal for any brand. These high prices might go down or not. It's all speculation.

 

[40Man]

We live in a Land Cruiser bubble/ echo chamber here on MUD. Everyone will agree they are best 4x4 SUV stock for out of the box. Slap on some slightly larger tyres and you can do more with it than any of the competition. But that's it. They are a great base system to MOD the hell out of for off road use. The majority of potential buyers do not care about this at all. They also don't care about long term reliability because they are replacing it after 3 years for a new model. LC's are also very expensive compared to other SUV's in the same price range that have better tech, better range and better leather. Like the LX570.

I would talk someone out of purchasing a new LC 2018-present unless they where planning on keeping it for 10 years plus or taking it offroad. You can have so much more in the price range. It's a very niche market for the LC here in the states. I understand Toyota's decision to pull it from a business perspective. Glad I have one.

If you don't like it sell it. Especially if you need a pick up truck. Take out the second row seats? Vehicles for me have always been something I accept and budget as a money pit. But it's also hobby that I am passionate about and supports my lifestyle. ( anyone own a boat?! )I think a lot of folks on here feel the same way. I've also driven a 5.7 liter motor since the 90's so gas just is what it is. Only a fool would purchase a LC and complain about the gas. The MPG is clearly stated. Range is clearly stated.

Who knows what's going to happen the next few years with valuations. These are crazy times right now and definitely not normal for any brand. These high prices might go down or not. It's all speculation.

The average Land Cruiser owner keeps it for 11.4 years, the most of any vehicle on the market, so maybe you don't really understand the majority of potential buyers.

 

[tacoduck]

They will never sell 10k LCs in the US. The only reason they are selling now, is that certain people have to have the last LC made for US.

The LC in the US died once the Sequoia was released in the US market. Look at sales of both LC and Sequoia, once the Sequoia was sold in the US.

I am not saying that the LC couldn’t do better in the US market, but how much better with the Sequoia available? Also, with Lexus being the luxury brand of Toyota, there is only so much we can expect for the LC or the Sequoia.

If Toyota wants to play in this market, they need to build a less expensive option, that is not full blown luxury.

Land Rover sells their top line Range Rover in small numbers. Mercedes sells their g-wagon in small Numbers. Hell, Ferrari sets production limits on all their cars. They somehow find a way to get it crash tested and smog tested for the u.s.

The lc is a halo truck that enhances the Toyota brand. They should and will bring it back in the future.

When that happens values of the 200’s should fall back to earth.