Shift shock in 2017 200 Series (1 Viewer)

[Bajaknot]

Hi all,
New member here. I've been poking around the internet machine researching what seems to be "shift shock". When the engine is not warm, there is a rough transition shifting between 1st, 2nd and 3rd gears. I have around 500 miles on it and it's done this through all of those miles. Does anyone have any thoughts? Once the engine is warmed up, it starts shifting smoothly. Any help would be great.
Thanks!

 

[Sandroad]

A well documented issue with the new 8 speed. It's a very long shot, but if it's something in the shift programming, perhaps someday Toyota will come out with a software update that might help. I know it's of no real help to you, but most (all?) of us with the 8 speed have those hard cold shifts. Let your dealer know and maybe if enough owners complain, word will get back to Toyota.

And, BTW, welcome to MUD!

 

[Bajaknot]

A well documented issue with the new 8 speed. It's a very long shot, but if it's something in the shift programming, perhaps someday Toyota will come out with a software update that might help. I know it's of no real help to you, but most (all?) of us with the 8 speed have those hard cold shifts. Let your dealer know and maybe if enough owners complain, word will get back to Toyota.

And, BTW, welcome to MUD!

Great. Thanks, Sandroad. Any thoughts on the long term effects of this? The reasoning behind buying an LC was its longevity and durability. Would be a shame if the clunky shifting decreased it's lifetime.

 

[ikeb]

some people have noted better (smoother) shift performance when using the ECT pwr button. you may try that as well.

 

[tabraha]

Seems I recall seeing on here there was a TSB for the 8-sp so check with the dealer to see if there is a new trans calibration they need to do on yours?

For reference our 8-sp feels nice like our 6-sp just faster gear changes which make it feel a little more firm when on the throttle harder. Shifts about the same cold as warm.

Also, with only 500 total miles perhaps the trans is still in learning mode? Just some thoughts.

 

[Battleship]

According to my paper work TSB-0209-17 Transmission Software Update for harsh shifting

Mine might shift better when I put it in the "manual" position. Probably placebo. Need to get the TSB done.

 

[LALC]

A well documented issue with the new 8 speed.

Just FYI to all before this becomes a listed problem only on the 8-speed, according to multiple members in a previous thread this same "shift shock" has been seen on the 6-speed all the way back to '08 models.

For OP, the only thing I've found that helps is what you already know... let the engine warm up a bit, 30 seconds or so, before heading out. It also helps to "learn" the correct acceleration to avoid it. Sucks that this is necessary.

I would say Toyota needs to fix it, but on the one hand one members said it's a result of the gear ratio design so maybe it can't be fixed and on the other I'm guessing with it going all the way back to '08 it's doubtful they will be fixing it.

 

[Sandroad]

Just FYI to all before this becomes a listed problem only on the 8-speed, according to multiple members in a previous thread this same "shift shock" has been seen on the 6-speed all the way back to '08 models.

For OP, the only thing I've found that helps is what you already know... let the engine warm up a bit, 30 seconds or so, before heading out. It also helps to "learn" the correct acceleration to avoid it. Sucks that this is necessary.

I would say Toyota needs to fix it, but on the one hand one members said it's a result of the gear ratio design so maybe it can't be fixed and on the other I'm guessing with it going all the way back to '08 it's doubtful they will be fixing it.

Thanks for the reminder on the issue being around a while. Forgot that since the conversations I've had about it have been just with my truck. It was even on the 5 speed when really cold. First gear held a long time and then SHIFTED into 2nd.

 

[Bajaknot]

Thanks for the info. Breathing a little easier but plan on following up on the TSB-0209-17 Transmission Software Update. I'll let you know if anything comes of it.

 

[mud400]

I will be following this as my 16' does the same thing with about 12K on it.

 

[Bajaknot]

The thread below gives a lot of good info including TSB #.
2016+ LC TSB for Rough Shifting Transmission is out

 

[arich]

2011 shirts much harder when cold even at 95K especially in the winter. Let that sucker warm up before and spirited driving.

 

[NMNORSSE]

Mercedes puts all its new technology into the S model and CL model. Then, when all the kinks are worked out, they spread it out to the rest of the fleet. The E-class is the mass market taxi/police car. A new tranny wouldn't hit the E-class until it had been in the S/CL for a number of years.

Perhaps Toyota does the same with the LC/LX and the Sequoia/Tundra.

As far as I know, the 8A is only in the LC and LX. Hopefully if it fails entirely it'll be under warranty. Any upgrades should be covered by TSBs or recalls until all the bugs are worked out. If it's just a software patch/ecu update Mr. Toyota might not actively notify people. Instead they might give you 2 years of free maintenance and upgrade you at oil change time without even telling you.

There is probably a version number for the ecu software. Not sure how we'd get that from our cars to see if ours is current, but for people outside the free maintenance period who do their own oil changes it would be nice if we knew the current version so we could have the dealer flash the new software to the ECU.

Edited:

When the 8A hits the Tundra/Sequoia, they'll have almost all the kinks worked out of it. So anyone with a '16+ who hasn't been to the dealer in a while should get their ECU updated and see if there are any other TSB's that can be addressed.

Similarly, anyone with the 6A who doesn't know what software version they have and hasn't been to the dealer in a while might want to let the dealer change the oil, check/flash the ECU and print a list of outstanding TSBs.

Obviously, the minor draw back to getting the software updated is that you'll have a new learning period for the tranny.

 

[linuxgod]

There is probably a version number for the ecu software. Not sure how we'd get that from our cars to see if ours was current, but for people outside the free maintenance period who do their own oil changes it would be nice if we know the current version so we can have the dealer flash the new software to the ECU.

I suspect you can pull it from Techstream if you have an OBD2 cable

 

[Ali M]

the TSB helped a little in my new LC but I still get those weird confused moments from time to time where the 8spd is either taking long to shift from 2nd to 3rd or down shifts to 1st where it doesn't have to at low speed downhill and yes I do get the hard shifts when it's cold but it got better after the TSB. I am hoping Toyota will release another TSB to fix these remaining issues.

 

[NCMTNS]

Mercedes puts all its new technology into the S model and CL model. Then, when all the kinks are worked out, they spread it out to the rest of the fleet. The E-class is the mass market taxi/police car. A new tranny wouldn't hit the E-class until it had been in the S/CL for a number of years.

Perhaps Toyota does the same with the LC/LX and the Sequoia/Tundra.

As far as I know, the 8A is only in the LC and LX. Hopefully if it fails entirely it'll be under warranty. Any upgrades should be covered by TSBs or recalls until all the bugs are worked out. If it's just a software patch/ecu update Mr. Toyota might not actively notify people. Instead they might give you 2 years of free maintenance and upgrade you at oil change time without even telling you.

There is probably a version number for the ecu software. Not sure how we'd get that from our cars to see if ours is current, but for people outside the free maintenance period who do their own oil changes it would be nice if we knew the current version so we could have the dealer flash the new software to the ECU.

Edited:

When the 8A hits the Tundra/Sequoia, they'll have almost all the kinks worked out of it. So anyone with a '16+ who hasn't been to the dealer in a while should get their ECU updated and see if there are any other TSB's that can be addressed.

Similarly, anyone with the 6A who doesn't know what software version they have and hasn't been to the dealer in a while might want to let the dealer change the oil, check/flash the ECU and print a list of outstanding TSBs.

Obviously, the minor draw back to getting the software updated is that you'll have a new learning period for the tranny.

I've put 11k on my 2017 with no issues. Bought in March so put about ~1800 miles/month. No "hard cold shifting issue" but I do let engine warm up for about 20-30 seconds before I put into gear. Maybe that helps, don't know. Have towed up mountains, driven in crappy city traffic, etc. Guess I'm lucky with no issues but can't believe I'm the only one...

FYI, the 7 speed MB transmission was introduced in 2003 on 8-cylinder models, and was the first seven-speed automatic transmission ever used on a production passenger vehicle including the E-Series.

 

[Bajaknot]

Just wanted to put a cap on this thread. I took my 2017 in for its 5K mile service, mentioned the TSB-0209-17 software update and they performed it. My LC is now shifting like a dream. Much different than before taking it in. Thanks to all for the info and pointing me in the right direction.

 

[JADANT]

I took mine in and mentioned it and they won't do it. Said it is shifting as it should. I asked if they have had experience with many '16+ LC and they said it was the master technician. They said they wouldn't do it without reproducing the shift issue. I told them it occurs after coasting down to 10-20 mph then when I apply gas it jerks. They said they would try it in the morning. Aren't SW updates applied to known systems... or do they only apply it once they prove that it is broken... I understand the idea of if it isn't broken don't fix it but aren't the TSB's made for all the Transmissions that have this issue? How many different transmissions are there for the 2016+ 200 series?

 

[Sandroad]

I took mine in and mentioned it and they won't do it. Said it is shifting as it should. I asked if they have had experience with many '16+ LC and they said it was the master technician. They said they wouldn't do it without reproducing the shift issue. I told them it occurs after coasting down to 10-20 mph then when I apply gas it jerks. They said they would try it in the morning. Aren't SW updates applied to known systems... or do they only apply it once they prove that it is broken... I understand the idea of if it isn't broken don't fix it but aren't the TSB's made for all the Transmissions that have this issue? How many different transmissions are there for the 2016+ 200 series?

Too bad that dealer wouldn't apply a known remedy based just on customer complaints. There's just one transmission for the '16+. And, just because it was a master technician doesn't answer your question about LC experience! Do you have another dealer you can take it to?

 

[LALC]

I took mine in and mentioned it and they won't do it. Said it is shifting as it should. I asked if they have had experience with many '16+ LC and they said it was the master technician. They said they wouldn't do it without reproducing the shift issue. I told them it occurs after coasting down to 10-20 mph then when I apply gas it jerks. They said they would try it in the morning. Aren't SW updates applied to known systems... or do they only apply it once they prove that it is broken... I understand the idea of if it isn't broken don't fix it but aren't the TSB's made for all the Transmissions that have this issue? How many different transmissions are there for the 2016+ 200 series?

I can tell you from experience that Master tech means nothing, mine here didn't even know the propeller shaft *could* be greased. Request the TSB again via appointment, say you're experiencing the issue, describe it fully, and if they refuse kindly let them know if they will not complete it you will be calling Toyota customer service to report their denial of a requested TSB service.